Wolf ammo is it bad for my Cetme?

meatloaf · 06-18-2007, 08:07 PM

When I bought my CETME I realy knew nothing about the gun. Im a vain gun buyer first i look at the coolness factor of a gun then I do reserch. However with this particular rifle I saw it in one gun store and it was out of my price range. Then I went to my other favorite gun store and saw the same gun for 300 dollars cheaper, and I bought it.

Now Thats just to let yall know how little I know about my new rifle. Now back to my question about Wolf ammo. Are the steel casings bad for my7 gun? I know Wolf is dirty, but since the Cetme eats brass beyond repair I would rather shoot ammo with throw away casings and not to mention alot cheaper. Is this idea that steel casings are bad or is this a predjudice past on from some old timers I know?

Three months ago I purchased six hundred rounds of .45 wolf ammo to shoot in my Colt. I wasnt paying attention to see if it was steel or brass casings because wolf was the only brand Sportsman Wharehouse had at that time. (They told me that their shipment was late) When I went to the shooting range they refused to let me shoot ammo with steel casings there, and they swore up and down that the ammo would destroy my gun. So im looking for oppinions from everyone please help.(If Wolf ammo wont hurt my Cetme Im going to buy a ton of it. Im in love with my cetme) Thanks

Ding · 06-22-2007, 06:01 PM

wolf is a dirty burning round,but the rifle will eat it.the H&K's and Cetme's are terrible on brass unless ya put a port buffer on it which will stop the dents in the brass.You will still get less reloads even with the buffer if ya did reload them.Wolf has a coating on it that sometimes gunks up the chamber of all rifles but a good cleaning before the first set of rounds are shot and after the weapon heats up will take care of the headaches.

JoeLee · 06-22-2007, 06:12 PM

FEDERAL AMMO all the way up in the caliber family is the best.

ezearln · 06-22-2007, 06:32 PM

True JoeLee but for those of us on a really tight budget a lil extra elbow grease for cleaning up after cheap ammo is a reasonable trade off for being able to shoot more.

Ding · 06-22-2007, 06:42 PM

Joe-I think he was talkin about fire and forget ammo.Berden primed brass is a head ache to reload,it can be done,but hardly worth the effort.Wolf is a non-corrosive ammo but it is dirty and clean up is a neccessity,but not a biggy as opposed to corrosive.Federal and all the all brass reloadables are great.But a H&K or Cetme will just waste the brass to be non-reloadable after fired without a buffer.I guess my point would be shoot the wolf for cheap fun and keep some more pricey ammo for the more important times.

just_a_car · 06-22-2007, 08:41 PM

See my reply regarding Wolf ammo in a CETME here: http://www.gunandgame.com/forums/amm...tml#post314510 (Wolf Ammo)

Ding · 06-22-2007, 11:58 PM

Just a car
Is that a century build? your FTE's are most likely due to your ejector being too short.Try taking a spent shell and move the bolt carrier back at least the length of the shell. The ejector shouldn't begin to protrude from the bolt until the bolt carrier has cleared enough room for the casing to eject. If ya find that the ejector is too short,MIG weld some ER70S6 wire filler on to the end and re-shape the ejector. Your nose ups could be from your mag having too much play in them.Try holding the mag with your hand in the front cupped and pulling back on the mag while firing.If the rounds feed fine and no jams then your mag catch needs to be adjusted.the white smoke was probably just some oil or cosmoline burning off that was leftover in the chamber.hope this gives a little help on where to look J ya might also hand cycle a few rounds(in a safe place with the buisness end down range)and watch to see if the rounds are hanging up on the feed ramp.Look to see if there is and where the copper is on the ramp.Does the ramp "peel"the copper off in chunks or is it smooth.You can tell by the amount of it at the base.Again hope this helps.

Don357 · 06-24-2007, 05:47 PM

Hello all,
I'm new to the board and thought I'd put my 2 cents in on this subject. I have shot many rounds of Indian milsurp through my Century with no problems, of course it's milsurp. And I intend to hunt with comercial ammo this year. After asking many ex-military friends who have a working knowledge of Cetmes, HKs, and FALs, they say that as long as you keep to low pressure, brass or steel cased ammo, you should have no trouble. However, stay away from the nickle coated cartridges. The brass is thinner (due to the nickle coating and deminsion restrictions) and stands a greater chance of expanding and/or exploding. As you know, the fluted chamber allowes the cartridge to float on expanding gasses when firing to aid and allow extraction, so if you get to much expansion of the case it will stick and possibly pull the head off the case. A broken shell extractor is required then. So, shoot milsurp for fun and protection and low pressure commercial for business.

just_a_car · 06-24-2007, 06:13 PM

Ding, I'll give the space check on the extractor a try when I fire off some more rounds. Don't have any spent shells handy, they're Wolf, so I just toss them.

There's a link to some great pictures of my CETME on my post here (I couldn't hold out), including the boltface and the magwell, which I invite you to take a gander at.

As for the white smoke, this is stuff that was increasing with the faster I shot the Wolf. It's dirty ammo and I found the carbon all throughout the receiver when I cleaned it. Much worse than the South African, but didn't smell "salty" like the SA did.

I'll give the Mag "pull" a try, but I'm not sure if it will do much, as some of the rounds didn't even feed from the first one! The boltface just slid right over the top.

BFRANKlin · 06-24-2007, 06:28 PM

The CETMEs have a fluted chamber that uses gas pressure to extract the shells, thus causing the deformity. They don't have a piston like most semi-autos. It uses a roller delayed blow-back for operation, like the FN FAL and HK G3s. The flutes are there to let gas pass by instead of exploding the shell and causing it to stick in the chamber. That's what makes the spent cartridges look that way.
The chamber MUST be clean and grease free to function and just a light dab of oil should be applied in it.

Ding · 06-24-2007, 08:42 PM

The white smoke will increase as your weapon gets hotter,no biggy,it will subside.If your bolt is sliding over the top(pass bys) then I would really check for the mag seating.it sounds like it needs adjusting.Like I said,take it to the range and hold on to the mag and pull it back towards while you shoot a few real fast.If the weapon doesn't jam,then it is a mag release/or stop adjustment ya need to fix.my guess that is what it needs.

ArkansasHunter · 06-24-2007, 09:09 PM

I didn't read all the posts here but i've read several others else where here about Wolf....
steel case ammo.
I was wondering if theres a product some where you could spray, dip on to steel case's to stop sticking, hanging up and what ever on steel case's. There should be something that drys you can put on them to remedy this. Think about it.
A.H

Ding · 06-24-2007, 09:50 PM

A H,the wolf has a coating that is supposed to do two things,aid in not sticking in the chamber and all around ease of function.(They used to have an acrylic coating(painted) and to keep them from rusting.Not gonna happen,Ha Ha.They rust just sittin in my truck still in the box after three days.Ya outa try the golden tiger or bear brands,much better performance and function,cleaner too.

rocketmonty · 06-26-2007, 10:02 PM

ill be more wisely be with a 127grain to 130 only for semi auto. watch yhose corrosive ammo! is a no-go on cetmes.i use remington /federal /winchester. plinking ill use those sell at wally world. very soon i have one cetme for sale.

Big Dog · 06-27-2007, 04:50 AM

Corrosive ammo is NO problem - we all clean our rifles, eh?

The CETME is easy enough to clean out, especially with no gas system.
I have shot some commercial ammo - Winchester and Remington 150 grain soft-points. Fired about forty, before a case got ripped in half. Luckily, it came out jammed on the front of the cartridge that couldn't chamber.
The CETME extraction is brutal - it's why the case flies so far when ejected.
Commercial ammo CAN function in the CETME, but be careful! Use only good military spec ammo for rapid-fire fun shooting.
I haven't tried Wolf or other steel-cased ammo yet, but may try it soon - prices are better on it these days.

sean46953 · 06-27-2007, 12:35 PM

The first stuff I shot through my CETME was Wolf. Had ok results. No big jams, just a couple stove pipes out of 60 rounds. The best ammo I've put through it honestly was some old boxes of PMC. Chewed through it with out even a hit of failure. Couldn't be happier with it. I just thought I'd throw my 2 cents in.

06-18-2007, 08:07 PM	#1
meatloaf Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: lakewood CO Posts: 904 Images: 3	Wolf ammo is it bad for my Cetme? When I bought my CETME I realy knew nothing about the gun. Im a vain gun buyer first i look at the coolness factor of a gun then I do reserch. However with this particular rifle I saw it in one gun store and it was out of my price range. Then I went to my other favorite gun store and saw the same gun for 300 dollars cheaper, and I bought it. Now Thats just to let yall know how little I know about my new rifle. Now back to my question about Wolf ammo. Are the steel casings bad for my7 gun? I know Wolf is dirty, but since the Cetme eats brass beyond repair I would rather shoot ammo with throw away casings and not to mention alot cheaper. Is this idea that steel casings are bad or is this a predjudice past on from some old timers I know? Three months ago I purchased six hundred rounds of .45 wolf ammo to shoot in my Colt. I wasnt paying attention to see if it was steel or brass casings because wolf was the only brand Sportsman Wharehouse had at that time. (They told me that their shipment was late) When I went to the shooting range they refused to let me shoot ammo with steel casings there, and they swore up and down that the ammo would destroy my gun. So im looking for oppinions from everyone please help.(If Wolf ammo wont hurt my Cetme Im going to buy a ton of it. Im in love with my cetme) Thanks

06-22-2007, 06:32 PM	#4
ezearln Senior Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Texas Hill Country Posts: 3,175	True JoeLee but for those of us on a really tight budget a lil extra elbow grease for cleaning up after cheap ammo is a reasonable trade off for being able to shoot more. __________________ "You can have my Freedom when I'm done with it!"

06-22-2007, 08:41 PM	#6
just_a_car Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Edmonds, WA Posts: 3,522	See my reply regarding Wolf ammo in a CETME here: http://www.gunandgame.com/forums/amm...tml#post314510 (Wolf Ammo) __________________

06-22-2007, 11:58 PM	#7
Ding Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Orygun Posts: 57	Just a car Is that a century build? your FTE's are most likely due to your ejector being too short.Try taking a spent shell and move the bolt carrier back at least the length of the shell. The ejector shouldn't begin to protrude from the bolt until the bolt carrier has cleared enough room for the casing to eject. If ya find that the ejector is too short,MIG weld some ER70S6 wire filler on to the end and re-shape the ejector. Your nose ups could be from your mag having too much play in them.Try holding the mag with your hand in the front cupped and pulling back on the mag while firing.If the rounds feed fine and no jams then your mag catch needs to be adjusted.the white smoke was probably just some oil or cosmoline burning off that was leftover in the chamber.hope this gives a little help on where to look J ya might also hand cycle a few rounds(in a safe place with the buisness end down range)and watch to see if the rounds are hanging up on the feed ramp.Look to see if there is and where the copper is on the ramp.Does the ramp "peel"the copper off in chunks or is it smooth.You can tell by the amount of it at the base.Again hope this helps. Last edited by Ding; 06-23-2007 at 12:04 AM.

06-24-2007, 05:47 PM	#8
Don357 Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Semmes Alabama Posts: 273	Wolf ammo Hello all, I'm new to the board and thought I'd put my 2 cents in on this subject. I have shot many rounds of Indian milsurp through my Century with no problems, of course it's milsurp. And I intend to hunt with comercial ammo this year. After asking many ex-military friends who have a working knowledge of Cetmes, HKs, and FALs, they say that as long as you keep to low pressure, brass or steel cased ammo, you should have no trouble. However, stay away from the nickle coated cartridges. The brass is thinner (due to the nickle coating and deminsion restrictions) and stands a greater chance of expanding and/or exploding. As you know, the fluted chamber allowes the cartridge to float on expanding gasses when firing to aid and allow extraction, so if you get to much expansion of the case it will stick and possibly pull the head off the case. A broken shell extractor is required then. So, shoot milsurp for fun and protection and low pressure commercial for business.

06-22-2007, 06:01 PM	#2
Ding Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Orygun Posts: 57	wolf is a dirty burning round,but the rifle will eat it.the H&K's and Cetme's are terrible on brass unless ya put a port buffer on it which will stop the dents in the brass.You will still get less reloads even with the buffer if ya did reload them.Wolf has a coating on it that sometimes gunks up the chamber of all rifles but a good cleaning before the first set of rounds are shot and after the weapon heats up will take care of the headaches.

06-22-2007, 06:12 PM	#3
JoeLee Banned Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: North New York State. Posts: 1,241	FEDERAL AMMO all the way up in the caliber family is the best.

06-22-2007, 06:42 PM	#5
Ding Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Orygun Posts: 57	Joe-I think he was talkin about fire and forget ammo.Berden primed brass is a head ache to reload,it can be done,but hardly worth the effort.Wolf is a non-corrosive ammo but it is dirty and clean up is a neccessity,but not a biggy as opposed to corrosive.Federal and all the all brass reloadables are great.But a H&K or Cetme will just waste the brass to be non-reloadable after fired without a buffer.I guess my point would be shoot the wolf for cheap fun and keep some more pricey ammo for the more important times.

06-24-2007, 06:13 PM	#9
just_a_car Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Edmonds, WA Posts: 3,522	Ding, I'll give the space check on the extractor a try when I fire off some more rounds. Don't have any spent shells handy, they're Wolf, so I just toss them. There's a link to some great pictures of my CETME on my post here (I couldn't hold out), including the boltface and the magwell, which I invite you to take a gander at. As for the white smoke, this is stuff that was increasing with the faster I shot the Wolf. It's dirty ammo and I found the carbon all throughout the receiver when I cleaned it. Much worse than the South African, but didn't smell "salty" like the SA did. I'll give the Mag "pull" a try, but I'm not sure if it will do much, as some of the rounds didn't even feed from the first one! The boltface just slid right over the top. __________________

06-24-2007, 06:28 PM	#10
BFRANKlin Banned Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Southern Ohio Posts: 258	The CETMEs have a fluted chamber that uses gas pressure to extract the shells, thus causing the deformity. They don't have a piston like most semi-autos. It uses a roller delayed blow-back for operation, like the FN FAL and HK G3s. The flutes are there to let gas pass by instead of exploding the shell and causing it to stick in the chamber. That's what makes the spent cartridges look that way. The chamber MUST be clean and grease free to function and just a light dab of oil should be applied in it.

06-24-2007, 08:42 PM	#11
Ding Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Orygun Posts: 57	The white smoke will increase as your weapon gets hotter,no biggy,it will subside.If your bolt is sliding over the top(pass bys) then I would really check for the mag seating.it sounds like it needs adjusting.Like I said,take it to the range and hold on to the mag and pull it back towards while you shoot a few real fast.If the weapon doesn't jam,then it is a mag release/or stop adjustment ya need to fix.my guess that is what it needs. Last edited by Ding; 06-24-2007 at 08:46 PM.

06-24-2007, 09:09 PM	#12
ArkansasHunter Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: South Arkansas Posts: 10,709	I didn't read all the posts here but i've read several others else where here about Wolf.... steel case ammo. I was wondering if theres a product some where you could spray, dip on to steel case's to stop sticking, hanging up and what ever on steel case's. There should be something that drys you can put on them to remedy this. Think about it. A.H

06-24-2007, 09:50 PM	#13
Ding Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Orygun Posts: 57	A H,the wolf has a coating that is supposed to do two things,aid in not sticking in the chamber and all around ease of function.(They used to have an acrylic coating(painted) and to keep them from rusting.Not gonna happen,Ha Ha.They rust just sittin in my truck still in the box after three days.Ya outa try the golden tiger or bear brands,much better performance and function,cleaner too.

06-26-2007, 10:02 PM	#14
rocketmonty Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: florida Posts: 137	ill be more wisely be with a 127grain to 130 only for semi auto. watch yhose corrosive ammo! is a no-go on cetmes.i use remington /federal /winchester. plinking ill use those sell at wally world. very soon i have one cetme for sale.

06-27-2007, 04:50 AM	#15
Big Dog Moderator Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Tallahassee, Florida Posts: 10,219	Corrosive ammo is NO problem - we all clean our rifles, eh? The CETME is easy enough to clean out, especially with no gas system. I have shot some commercial ammo - Winchester and Remington 150 grain soft-points. Fired about forty, before a case got ripped in half. Luckily, it came out jammed on the front of the cartridge that couldn't chamber. The CETME extraction is brutal - it's why the case flies so far when ejected. Commercial ammo CAN function in the CETME, but be careful! Use only good military spec ammo for rapid-fire fun shooting. I haven't tried Wolf or other steel-cased ammo yet, but may try it soon - prices are better on it these days. __________________ Moderator of: AR15/M16, M14/M1A, New/Beginning Shooters and Militaria/Collectables.

06-27-2007, 12:35 PM	#16
sean46953 Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Marion, Indiana Posts: 357	The first stuff I shot through my CETME was Wolf. Had ok results. No big jams, just a couple stove pipes out of 60 rounds. The best ammo I've put through it honestly was some old boxes of PMC. Chewed through it with out even a hit of failure. Couldn't be happier with it. I just thought I'd throw my 2 cents in. __________________ http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/b...00_0535100.jpgSean M. Hartman