New Jap T38 Arisaka

[Full MeTal Jack]

Well it's new to me.
Dang 6.5 barrel is longer than my Dewy cleaning rod!
The ol boy that sold it said it was his fathers bring-back from Guadal Canall where he was a CB.
Said it's chambered in 6.5 Spence.
HUH?
Want to say I've heard of "Spence" but cant find it on a google search.

Any ideas?

Rifle is in fair condition. Stock has been sanded. not much blueing left.

Pics tba

[NRAJOE]

I had a T99 Arisaka that had been sporterized...had the Mum on it...had not been ground off..had the "AA" wings on it...the ammo price was "redicerous"

6.5 Arisaka...I think yours has been rechambered for a long gone wildcat round?

I sold mine to a guy that had a true stock for it...made $50 on it...

[Full MeTal Jack]

Thanks Joe, I'm looking to make a buck on this one too.
Got messing around with it, er, uhm, dianosing the chamber.
Swedes did not fit.
30-06 did not fit.
7mm necked down to 6.5 fit
8mm necked down to 7 then to 6.5 fit. Even with longer neck.
Started necking down the 06. Trim, neck down to 7's shoulder and check. Trim, neckup to 7 to move shoulder down.
To make a long story short.
It appears to be a 6.5x58. hmmm? That Right?
It's bedtime zzzzzzz
Will fire it next thursday, priortiys permitting then see what the chambers diamensions are.
Tie to the bench. Hide behide the tree. Pull the string

[Zen900]

Originally Posted by Full MeTal Jack

Tie to the bench. Hide behide the tree. Pull the string

I accidently fired a .243 out of a .270. It just blows the neck out of the casing.

[dave375hh]

Back in the 50's a lot of the type 38's were rechambered to 6.5 X 257 Roberts. Ammo for the original 6.5X50 was hard to find, while 257 Roberts were common at that time.

[Full MeTal Jack]

too bad swedes were not popular back then. But that would require bolt and maybe extrator work. Hope it's a fair shooter.

[Full MeTal Jack]

Well made some ammo from 06 cases. Trimmed to 57mm long. Expanded with 8mm full length sizer to get a shoulder forming. Necked down to 7mm. Then necked it down again in the 6.5x55, just the neck.
Loaded and fit to chamber. Seems the 6.5 bullet seater or sizer cause some shoulder problems. Put them back in 7mm die to reshape shoulder.
OK now.
Test fire Thursday.

[Falcon2]

I brought back an almost new 6.5 short bbl. Arisaka when the war ended,
and took it to my local gunsmith to find an american bullet that would fire safely, was sold a box of 250-3000 savage, they worked well but had more kick than the original Jap round.
Got my first deer with it.
Falcon2

[jelc]

Hi... this wildcat has been known by other names, but is probably best known as the 6.5 Spence - it is the 257 Roberts case necked up to 6.5, but P.O. Ackley in the first volume of his handloading guide also points out you can make the round by necking down a 7 mm Mauser - Ackley says the 257 Roberts and the 7mm Mauser are identical. If you have the Ackley book, read page 355.

Why do I know this?... I recently decided to reload for a type 38 in 6.5 Spence I have had for a while. By the way, my type 38 is simply marked on the receiver 257-6.5. I do have RCBS dies, probably acquired at the time of the conversion, and they are marked Roberts/6.5 Jap.

The problem is that I do not have any loads for the 6.5 Spence - Ackley has only two obsolete powders listed for this cartridge (H380 and HiVel#2), so I'll have to find out the equivalent of these in present powders. I am also going to check all my reloading manuals- if I am lucky, there might be one from the 1960s that still has loads for that round!

[Full MeTal Jack]

Thanks for the info jelc. Excellent first post. Havent fired the dang thing yet. Rain this Thursday. I loaded several hot and will tie it down then pull the string on trigger from behind a tree. I really dont think she'll blow. Sure want to see the chamber.
I have more 7x57 cases somewhere. The 06's were handy. Loading, I can make an approximation between the Swede and a 7mm mauser. Starting loads for 7mm mauser should be just fine.
Cleaned up the stock with Homer Formby's funiture refinnisher. The wood already had the varish removed. The stock is surprizingly in decent shape. A few dings and dents. Handguard is excellent. Found a long crack in wrist, comb, where your hand goes. It's a two piece butt stock. Like some of the Mosin 1891s. It's cracked just above that joint. Should be easy to repair. Planning to revarnish it.

Originally Posted by Falcon2

I brought back an almost new 6.5 short bbl. Arisaka when the war ended,
and took it to my local gunsmith to find an american bullet that would fire safely, was sold a box of 250-3000 savage, they worked well but had more kick than the original Jap round.
Got my first deer with it.
Falcon2

Dang! Mr Falcon2, you must be older than Father time. Thanks for serving our country. Thanks for doing what you did otherwise we'ld be talking German and eating with chop stixs.
Now, Im confussed. You shot a 25 caliber from a .264 caliber barrel?
I shot my first deer with the 6.5 swede 96.

[jelc]

Hi... Yesterday I was given this link: Steve's Reloading Data Warning Page

Look for the 257 Roberts/6.5 (a.k.a Spence Special) for loads. That's the only source for loading the Spence special I have been able to find.

jelc

[ArkansasHunter]

jelc WELCOME to Gun and Game and thank you for the info ! ...A.H and good night !

[irishjack]

Hi Ful MeTal Jack. I have a 38 Arisaka which had a badly eroded chamber when I got it. I had it rebarrelled to .308 Winchester and it shoots like you wouldn't believe.
The gunsmith who did the job said that early Arisakas were stronger tha many current firearms but later ones were not worth bothering with.

Hope yours turns out to be a good one. Regards jack.

[ArkansasHunter]

irishjack WELCOME To GUN and GAME and thanks for joining ! I hope to hear more from you...A.H

[Full MeTal Jack]

Thanks for Steves Reloading Data.
Cleaned rifle and found is Stamped "256 Spence"
Even found recipe using Varget.

[scvmike]

Never heard of the 6.5 "spence". Only the 6.5 jap from norma. I also own a model 38. Beautiful gun. Chrome plated with a white sling. Only thing about this gun is that some airhole decided to make a lamp out of it. Bored a hole thru the chamber and down the stock for the cord. What a waste. I do know that the guns action is as strong if not stronger than the mauser and is a flat shooter. Wish I could find another one.

[a pittarelli]

im a big fan of chrome plated pistols, i cant remember what but i saw a japanese one not too long ago that really blew my mind

[dave375hh]

PO Ackley did destruction tests on various military rifles to see how strong they were. Back in the 50's sporterizing mil. rifles was quite popular, and no one knew which ones were weak or strong. When he came to the Jap type 38 in 6.5X50 Jap he ended up putting two 160 steel core bullets in the barrel ahead of a proof load. He tied it to a truck tire and set it off with a rope. The action and locking lugs held and the only damage to the barrel was two bulges where the bullets were. He proclaimed it the strongest action ever made.

I've heard some horror stories out of the Weatherby repair shop of rifles that were returned because the owners couldn't get the bolts to open. When they checked the reloads these individuals sent with the guns they found loads that they predicted would go over 200,000 psi. Like 92grs 4227 for H4831, and 88grs 2400 that was supposed to be H870. These actions were in-spec after they beat the bolts open(German made Mark V)

[SwedeSteve]

Lyman's Reloading Manual editions 41 & 42 list some 40+ loads for th 6.5mm-.257Jap

[Full MeTal Jack]

found the recoil lug area completely broken. Spread wood apart, removed two broken lug pieces of wood. Glued and reset. Bored a hole in wood and installed brass screw with washers. After it cures will dremil off the brass head and take it down to wood. Repaired 3 other cracks.
Also reblueing (cold) metal hardware. Later will varnish the stock.