New Goat ?? Hear Come Da Judge !!!

[PAPA G]

GM announced they were bringing back the GTO. the new car will be made in Australia in limited numbers and imported to USA!!!! sorry, but if it doesn't have a 389 with trip deuces, chromed cragers, and about the size of a boat fugidaboudit!!!

[BenP]

I heard they were bringing back a new and (gasp!!) improved hemmy with tuned quads to put in it stock. If that's the case, sign me up!!!!!

Mad max without the supercharger??

[Shaun]

I just heard about it on Liddy's show -- sounds like fun

[Klaus]

Hate to break the news to you guys, but hemis are only hot stuff compared to other engines made 40 years ago. Remember the old 1 HP/CI rule of thumb for HIGH PERFORMANCE engines? I can't think of any car made today made in the US, Japan, or Western Europe with such poor performance. Even cheap economy cars have it beat, with fuel injection, overhead cams, 4 valves per cylinder, electronic ignition, and combustion chambers designed with extensive FEA and fluid flow analysis. The hemi head was a big advance in design for people who lacked microprocessors, but it is primitive compared to today's technology. The only way muscle cars got a lot of horsepower was through huge displacements. To put things in perspective, today most cars have engines in the 2.0L to 3.0L range. Big cars and trucks have generally have 3.0L-4.5L engines. My 67 Mustang had the ECONOMY 6 cylinder 200 CI engine. In metric that was 3.3 Liters!!!!!!

[Shaun]

I'll take large displacement on a naturally aspirated engine any day of the week. Compared to the computer driven things like my current truck has. The older engines are easy for the average person to do major repairs on versus the new one's

[Klaus]

Yes, that is true, the newer engines are more difficult to do major repairs on because they do not have all those little fiddly bits like points, rockers, vacuum advance, floats, and distributors that need constant adjustment. Also they have better lubrication and cooling systems and beefier bearings, so they do not require major repairs as much.

[Shaun]

you got that one right. I doubt my 460 in the cougar would have gone 200K like my Nissan truck has without being rebuilt at least once. I just wish I had a lot more power

[Joe B.]

Todays performance cars are as fast, better engineered, and more reliable than the muscle cars of old. But a computer controlled,plastic valve covered, timing belt driven, wonder sled does not and never will command the respect at a stop light that a real muscle car does. Regardless of how many camshafts it has. I dont need a computer to think for me. I'll shift my M-22 Rock Crusher whenever I'm ready ...thank you very much. Kind of a Kel- Tec vs. 1911 thing I guess. Thank God Chevy didnt measure Super Sport engine displacement in Liters back then! Yech!

[DANA]

MY BEST WAS A 68 TORONADO
WORST WAS 73 TORONADO

[Klaus]

It is true that many people really like the old muscle cars. I will not fault them for that. I was trying to head off a bunch of claims about "the good old days" with a dose of reality. I admit many of the old cars really had personality, great looks, and sounded awesome. They also tended to have very poor mileage, smoked bad, needed constant tweaking, and generally were not as safe or well handling as modern cars.

[duck223]

I just I wish I had my 64 1/2 Mustang today,talk about an investement.It had the 289 with the c4 transmission.

[Klaus]

The 68 firebird was real nice too. You might still be able to find some of the old Cougars at a good price.

[Joe B.]

Klaus, I know what you mean. I have a 72' Z/28 all matching no. with a factory solid lifter cam. 4.10:1 tail gears and breaker point ignition. And yes, it can be a pain in the butt, and by no means is it a daily driver, cause' man does it drink the liquid. But on the days that I do drive it I just can stop grinnin' like a big Idiot. Used to have a 69' SS396 375 hp Chevelle, but that was before age mellowed me out a little. I think I'll keep this camaro though. Hey when everybodys driving electric cars I'll still be driving the Z and probably be getting dirty looks from the battery crowd. I cant wait!Mabey when the CMP runs out of rifles and ammo the government will put in place a program for 92 octain fuel sales to members of affiliated clubs...hmmm...I wonder what the Gallon per year limit will be?

most of the little 4 cylinders were basically half a big block... some of those little four bangers can get pretty impressive 'cause the cars they put them in weigh less than half what the old big blocks used to push around...more power to weight ratio

[7mmag6]

I agree with Klauss, I had a 65 GTO three dueses, 389 ci, advertised at 400 hp, with the SAE ratings my 99 Camaro Z-28 fuel injected is rated at 305 horse, but it feels a lot stronger than those old muscle cars, and drives 10 times better(klauss remember those wide boots, horrible, bias ply, a life of only 10,000 miles if you are lucky), my 2002 cooper s is on the way to go with my 64 cooper s, had it painted the same scheme, white top BRG

[8mm Vigilante]

i really like my '83 porsche 944, it handles better than any car i've ever owned, in fact in my way of thinking that's the only reason to own a porsche, handling i mean it is a fast car for a 4 cyl. (love destroying the local rice rockets!!) but i'd have to say when it comes to the power issue, i miss my '68 Camaro, had a 350cid bored and stroked to 400cid, even had a big block i ripped out of an old cadillac, just never built it up, to busy/lazy.
-Jesse

[8mm Vigilante]

944

[Big Dog]

Duck, a buddy of mine had a 64 1/2 Mus-hoss back in high school. It had the earlier 260 engine - a rare animal these days. He traded it for a Datsun! He feels like kicking himself now.

[dhermesc]

I had a 67 Mustang with just a 2V 289 with a 3 speed. The car just seemed fast. Now my 96 Gran Marque seems to be crawling down the road at 90, it doesn't seem to really be moving until the needle moves right of 100. The Mustang had wind whistling through the windows, cowl, and shifter hole, gave the impression of moving real fast at 70. Even with just a base engine the stang could leave some tremendous patches of rubber on the pavement, the Mercury just squeaks like a mouse.

[NRAJOE]

I had a '70 Chevelle SS with the 396 C.I. engine, cowl induction hood, 4 speed, 4:11 gears, Goodrich white letter tires, Cragars...red with white SS stripes...man I miss that car