Saiga... Saiga... Saiga...

ttwinsupra · 11-02-2009, 10:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sprout47

I too believe that Saiga's are some of the best built AK's money can buy. Everyone seems to overlook the fact that these rifles are built from new parts and assembled Once, not made from parts and put on a US receiver. The end result is the tightest tolerances you are likely to find on an AK. Plus, in respects to Yugo AK's, the lack of a chromed barrel turns a lot of people off.

some people think they need the chorme lined barrel

like it would make a differance i got my yugo used after it came to USA so who knows if it was used before and the owner before me had at least 2k rnds through it i put about 2k rounds through it and that barrel was like NEW + if for some reason you shoot 10,000 rnds of corosive ammo and never clean your barrel a new yugo barrel is only $19

idk if you can get any tighter tolerances than my yugo you couldnt get a rattle if you put that thing a tumbler and there was not a gap to be found
not to say its tighter than the saiga but i dont think its the other way around eather

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diatribes

Watch some vids on youtube if you doubt the almighty Saiga 12.

i beleve all major ak types are great working guns. to each his own if you like syinthetics over wood go for it if you want a saiga go for it im just saying i think the yugo is a much better deal, not that it has any function over the saiga exept for the grenade launcher but just in looks and cheep parts i think the yugo has the up on the saiga

Rifle_Shaman · 11-03-2009, 12:32 AM

I sat here for like 15 mins typing out this long post breaking down what i was looking for out of the rifle and came to one easy to answer. Im looking to get a Saiga because i dont have an AK. I dont want a 12 just yet, ill get one but i want a rifle more. I dont like the .223/5.56 in an AR why would i like in an AK. And i dont know how the .308 saiga stacks up vs other .308/7.62x51 semi autos. If it can hold its own vs CETME or Fal types. Then its a go, i dont expect it to go vs AR-10s and M1As. But at the same time both cost alot more then a Saiga. Whats a good brand of 7.62x39? Does mil surp shoot any where near as good as commercially made? And so its down to the battle of the 7.62s lol.

Diatribes · 11-03-2009, 08:58 AM

I got a non-Saiga for my 7.62x39. GP1975 from Century. Brand new USA receiver and new USA chrome barrel on a Romy kit. Straight as an arrow nothing canted and very well put together. If I didnt go that route Id go Arsenal, Norinco or Polytech for non-Saiga.

Deussne · 11-03-2009, 09:07 AM

Well then the question is b/w 7.62x39 and 5.45x39 I have both and like to shoot 5.45 better.

squirrelblaster · 11-03-2009, 09:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deussne

Well then the question is b/w 7.62x39 and 5.45x39 I have both and like to shoot 5.45 better.

is that becouse of the cost of ammo?

ttwinsupra · 11-03-2009, 10:16 AM

i dont see why you would want a .223, i know you can share ammo with your ar but that stuff is $$$ i would save it only for my ar.
now 7.62 or 5.45... if they cost the same i would say deff the 7.62 because that a little beast of a rifle rnd if you see thoes vids on the .223 vs 7.62 you can see what that thing can do. + its the clasic AK round.
now i guess the 5.45 is a little more acc but you have an ar for that and you also have to think about all the 74s coming on to the market and the chance that we can run low on the milsurp so the price of it might just jump up to 7.62 prices in the future, so i would stock up now

so what do you want more money or power?

Deussne · 11-03-2009, 12:06 PM

Cost/fun. 5.45 kicks less and just seem to run smoother for me. Plus right now I buy 1080 rd cans for $150 this is surpluss stuff.
If I buy wolf (new stuff) I pay $208 for 1000 rd box. thats still cheaper then 7.62x39
I agree 7.62 is more powerfull if I can describe it that way. However how often do you need that extra power? If all you are doing is plinking around at the range and having fun which I assume is 90% of what we usually use these rifles for then why not go for the one thats more fun (5.45) and cheper (5.45)?
Like I said you decide.

squirrelblaster · 11-03-2009, 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deussne

Cost/fun. 5.45 kicks less and just seem to run smoother for me. Plus right now I buy 1080 rd cans for $150 this is surpluss stuff.
If I buy wolf (new stuff) I pay $208 for 1000 rd box. thats still cheaper then 7.62x39
I agree 7.62 is more powerfull if I can describe it that way. However how often do you need that extra power? If all you are doing is plinking around at the range and having fun which I assume is 90% of what we usually use these rifles for then why not go for the one thats more fun (5.45) and cheper (5.45)?
Like I said you decide.

i have to agree with you...

right now all i have int he ak realm is a 74........ and i love it. the reason i got it over a 47 in the first place was price of ammo though, and i was just curius how much of a factor that was for you.....

p.s im also giving real thought to buying a 47 from kvar

Sprout47 · 11-03-2009, 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by squirrelblaster

is that becouse of the cost of ammo?

I too have both a 7.62 and 5.45 Saiga and I also am liking the 5.45 better. It is more accurate, the lack of recoil makes it a fun rapid shooter, and the ammo is considerably cheaper. The Mil-Surp that is out there is just as good as any commercial ammo. Plus, the popularity of 5.45 is increasing and there are domestic manufacturers, Hornandy VMAX, and talk of other commercial makers talking about releasing their own. An added benefit, the 5.45 ejects forward rather than straight out the side which makes for less "sorry's" at the range.

I am lucky in that NYS doesn't have a deer hunting restriction on .22 cal centerfires so I can hunt with it. But, if you want a hunting rifle there are much better options than an AK anyhow.

Rifle_Shaman · 11-09-2009, 04:57 AM

Ive decided on 7.62x39 if you guys where interested, after the car goes into the shop. Im going to my preferred gun shot and pickin one up. I want nothing to do with another poodle shooter round. 5.56 or 5.45 its still a wuss .22 with no kick. Im the kind of guy that shoots a full mosin dry and then smiles from the kick(not that they kick). Im thinking OD green furniture with a saw girp. Maybe mojo peep sights, unless i can find a good way to mount a economical red dot with out a side mount.

Deussne · 11-09-2009, 09:10 AM

Congrats on making the decision. I agree if you want a bigger kick get a bigger caliber. I have .308 saiga that I was shooting yesterday with my 5.45 afterwards. The .308 is defenetly a beast of its own. I enjoyed shooting 5.45 especially knowing that I am giving it to my wife as her b-day present lol. She would defenetly enjoy it.

Diatribes · 11-09-2009, 09:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rifle_Shaman

unless i can find a good way to mount a economical red dot with out a side mount.

Why wouldnt you take advantage of having the side rail and use that for a red dot? You can add/remove the dot and still hold zero (unless you have a crap dot) I have just ordered 2 side rail mounts (Guntec) for $19 each! For my Saiga .223 and S12. They look good are low profile and centered on the barrel. The .223 is getting a 3-9x30 and the 12 is getting a dot. Ive used Guntec side mounts before and theyre very nice and the side lock is adjustable.

Madcat455 · 11-09-2009, 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diatribes

Why wouldnt you take advantage of having the side rail and use that for a red dot? You can add/remove the dot and still hold zero

+1 man... the rail is perfect for a red dot. I have one on my S.410 and love it.

Then again.. I have the Mojo on my Norinko, with the cross hair front post.. and LOVE those too..

Sry, no help here.

I'd probably go with the Mojo on a 7.62 Saiga tho... red dot gets too big for long distance. that mojo and cross hairs give me a good sight picture out to 200yds. Absolutely worth it.

Sprout47 · 11-09-2009, 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Madcat455

+1 man... the rail is perfect for a red dot. I have one on my S.410 and love it.

Then again.. I have the Mojo on my Norinko, with the cross hair front post.. and LOVE those too..

Sry, no help here.

I'd probably go with the Mojo on a 7.62 Saiga tho... red dot gets too big for long distance. that mojo and cross hairs give me a good sight picture out to 200yds. Absolutely worth it.

That all depends on the red dot used, an EoTech has a one MOA dot whereas it is common to find four MOA dots on the fifty dollar specials. For some thought, in DM training we used Aimpoints and trained to engage man-sized targets out to 500m with them. Front posts are probably bigger than the one MOA as well. Just something to consider.

Rifle_Shaman · 11-09-2009, 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diatribes

Why wouldnt you take advantage of having the side rail and use that for a red dot? You can add/remove the dot and still hold zero (unless you have a crap dot) I have just ordered 2 side rail mounts (Guntec) for $19 each! For my Saiga .223 and S12. They look good are low profile and centered on the barrel. The .223 is getting a 3-9x30 and the 12 is getting a dot. Ive used Guntec side mounts before and theyre very nice and the side lock is adjustable.

Looked at that one my self lol. I figgured at 20 bucks that it couldnt be all that great. I guess i will go with a side mount

Madcat455 · 11-09-2009, 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sprout47

That all depends on the red dot used, an EoTech has a one MOA dot whereas it is common to find four MOA dots on the fifty dollar specials. For some thought, in DM training we used Aimpoints and trained to engage man-sized targets out to 500m with them. Front posts are probably bigger than the one MOA as well. Just something to consider.

Cool.. didn't know you could get Dot's like that. I actually think the front posts are like 2moa..

that's why I went with the cross hair.. much nicer, only .020 thick at the cross section. Didn't have a side rail on the Norinko anyway, and it's just too purdy for a aftermarket rail setup.

Dragunov · 11-09-2009, 03:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rifle_Shaman

I sat here for like 15 mins typing out this long post breaking down what i was looking for out of the rifle and came to one easy to answer. Im looking to get a Saiga because i dont have an AK. I dont want a 12 just yet, ill get one but i want a rifle more. I dont like the .223/5.56 in an AR why would i like in an AK. And i dont know how the .308 saiga stacks up vs other .308/7.62x51 semi autos. If it can hold its own vs CETME or Fal types. Then its a go, i dont expect it to go vs AR-10s and M1As. But at the same time both cost alot more then a Saiga. Whats a good brand of 7.62x39? Does mil surp shoot any where near as good as commercially made? And so its down to the battle of the 7.62s lol.

The.308 Saiga is VERY accurate! Seen a guy zeroing a scope at Rancho a couple of weeks ago. I want one now!

The best ammo in 7.62X39 I've found is Komada. At least in my SKS there is a BIG difference in accuracy over Wolf/Golden Tiger and Brown bear.

A couple of things though:

It's Milsurp and cheap. I just recieved a 1260rnd case for $249.

Brass cased.

It's Yugoslavian (Not a bad thing).

It's corrosive, so clean-up is important, especially the gas port.

It has more recoil.

I'm happy with it.

Diatribes · 11-09-2009, 03:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rifle_Shaman

Looked at that one my self lol. I figgured at 20 bucks that it couldnt be all that great. I guess i will go with a side mount

You wont be disappointed those particular side mounts are awesome.

Diatribes · 11-09-2009, 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dragunov

The.308 Saiga is VERY accurate!

Ive never shot a .308 Saiga, but I shot my Austrian FAL .308 last weekend along side my Saiga .223 and the .308 got about 2" groups on the bullseye vs. the 4" groups my .223 got

Rifle_Shaman · 11-09-2009, 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diatribes

Ive never shot a .308 Saiga, but I shot my Austrian FAL .308 last weekend along side my Saiga .223 and the .308 got about 2" groups on the bullseye vs. the 4" groups my .223 got

Ive thought about a fal, but i dont know jack about them. Well besides dont get a hesse receiver. Ill get both sooner or later.

11-03-2009, 08:58 AM	#23
Diatribes Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Minnesota Posts: 400	I got a non-Saiga for my 7.62x39. GP1975 from Century. Brand new USA receiver and new USA chrome barrel on a Romy kit. Straight as an arrow nothing canted and very well put together. If I didnt go that route Id go Arsenal, Norinco or Polytech for non-Saiga. __________________ Ticking away the moments that make up a dull day.

11-09-2009, 04:57 AM	#30
Rifle_Shaman Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: North Eastern PA Posts: 164	Ive decided on 7.62x39 if you guys where interested, after the car goes into the shop. Im going to my preferred gun shot and pickin one up. I want nothing to do with another poodle shooter round. 5.56 or 5.45 its still a wuss .22 with no kick. Im the kind of guy that shoots a full mosin dry and then smiles from the kick(not that they kick). Im thinking OD green furniture with a saw girp. Maybe mojo peep sights, unless i can find a good way to mount a economical red dot with out a side mount. Last edited by Rifle_Shaman; 11-09-2009 at 05:15 AM.

11-03-2009, 12:32 AM	#22
Rifle_Shaman Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: North Eastern PA Posts: 164	I sat here for like 15 mins typing out this long post breaking down what i was looking for out of the rifle and came to one easy to answer. Im looking to get a Saiga because i dont have an AK. I dont want a 12 just yet, ill get one but i want a rifle more. I dont like the .223/5.56 in an AR why would i like in an AK. And i dont know how the .308 saiga stacks up vs other .308/7.62x51 semi autos. If it can hold its own vs CETME or Fal types. Then its a go, i dont expect it to go vs AR-10s and M1As. But at the same time both cost alot more then a Saiga. Whats a good brand of 7.62x39? Does mil surp shoot any where near as good as commercially made? And so its down to the battle of the 7.62s lol.

11-03-2009, 09:07 AM	#24
Deussne Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Niles Michigan. Posts: 209	Well then the question is b/w 7.62x39 and 5.45x39 I have both and like to shoot 5.45 better.

11-03-2009, 10:16 AM	#26
ttwinsupra Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Tucson, AZ Posts: 357	i dont see why you would want a .223, i know you can share ammo with your ar but that stuff is $$$ i would save it only for my ar. now 7.62 or 5.45... if they cost the same i would say deff the 7.62 because that a little beast of a rifle rnd if you see thoes vids on the .223 vs 7.62 you can see what that thing can do. + its the clasic AK round. now i guess the 5.45 is a little more acc but you have an ar for that and you also have to think about all the 74s coming on to the market and the chance that we can run low on the milsurp so the price of it might just jump up to 7.62 prices in the future, so i would stock up now so what do you want more money or power?

11-03-2009, 12:06 PM	#27
Deussne Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Niles Michigan. Posts: 209	Cost/fun. 5.45 kicks less and just seem to run smoother for me. Plus right now I buy 1080 rd cans for $150 this is surpluss stuff. If I buy wolf (new stuff) I pay $208 for 1000 rd box. thats still cheaper then 7.62x39 I agree 7.62 is more powerfull if I can describe it that way. However how often do you need that extra power? If all you are doing is plinking around at the range and having fun which I assume is 90% of what we usually use these rifles for then why not go for the one thats more fun (5.45) and cheper (5.45)? Like I said you decide.

11-09-2009, 09:10 AM	#31
Deussne Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Niles Michigan. Posts: 209	Congrats on making the decision. I agree if you want a bigger kick get a bigger caliber. I have .308 saiga that I was shooting yesterday with my 5.45 afterwards. The .308 is defenetly a beast of its own. I enjoyed shooting 5.45 especially knowing that I am giving it to my wife as her b-day present lol. She would defenetly enjoy it.