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View Poll Results: should the military adopt this weapon ?
yes 5 62.50%
no 3 37.50%
Voters: 8. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 12-01-2003, 09:22 PM   #1
Logansdad
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Question is the XM-8 the M-16 replacement ?

http://www.hk-usa.com/pages/military...bines/xm8.html
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Old 12-01-2003, 09:24 PM   #2
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THE XM8 SYSTEM
Beginning life as the 5.56mm KE (kinetic energy) component of the 20mm air-bursting XM29 Objective Individual Combat Weapon (OICW), the XM8
Lightweight Modular Carbine System represents the state-of-the-art in 5.56x45mm NATO assault rifles. Developed by the US Army’s office of Project Manager for Soldier Weapons located at Picatinny Arsenal, New Jersey in close conjunction with the US Army Infantry Center, the XM8 Future Combat Rifle is intended to replace existing M4 Carbines and select 5.56mm x45 weapons in the US Army arsenal beginning as early as the fourth quarter of FY05. Once adopted, the M8 Carbine will replace the aging M16/M4 family of weapons, which have been in service for nearly four decades, longer than any previous US service rifle. The M8 Carbine will be up to 20% lighter than a comparably equipped M4 Carbine MWS and yet offer additional features and performance unavailable currently in any assault rifle in the world.

As a direct development of the separable OICW (XM29) KE or Kinetic Energy module, the M8 Carbine will share a high degree of common parts and training and maintenance procedures to lessen the required support for the “family” of XM8 weapons. Being developed are four XM8 variants, which include a
baseline carbine, a sharpshooter variant, an automatic rifle variant, and the ultra-compact carbine variant. A unique feature of the XM8 modular weapon system is the ability to easily and quickly reconfigure the weapon from one variant to the other to meet changing mission requirements, to include caliber conversion.

This modularity includes the exchange of interchangeable assembly groups such as the barrel, handguard, lower receiver, buttstock modules and
sighting system with removable carrying handle. In addition and in parallel, the new XM320 quick detachable single-shot 40mm grenade launcher with
side-opening breech and LSS lightweight 12 gauge shotgun module can be easily added to the XM8 by the user in the field without tools. The unique buttstock system allows the operator exchange buttstocks without tools from the standard collapsible multi-position version, to an optional buttcap for maximum portability or an optional folding or sniper buttstock with adjustable cheekpiece for special applications. Internally the XM8 employs a combat-proven robust rotary locking bolt system that functions and fieldstrips like that used in the current M16 rifle and M4 carbine. However this bolt is powered by a unique gas operating system that employs a user removable gas piston and pusher rod to operate the mechanism. Unlike the current M4/M16 direct gas system with gas tube, the XM8 gas system does not introduce propellant gases and the associated carbon fouling back into the weapon’s receiver during firing. This greatly increases the reliability of the XM8 while at same time reducing operator cleaning time by as much as 70%. This system also allows the weapon to fire more than 15,000 rounds without lubrication or cleaning in even the worst operational environments. A cold hammer forged barrel will guarantee a minimum of 20,000 rounds service life and ultimate operator safety in the event of an obstructed bore occurrence.

The XM8 has fully ambidextrous operating controls to include a centrally located charging handle that doubles as an ambidextrous forward assist when required, ambidextrous magazine release, bolt catch, safety/selector lever with semi and full automatic modes of fire and release lever for the multiple position collapsible buttstock. The operating controls allow the operator to keep the firing hand on the pistol grip and the weapon in the firing position at all times while the non-firing hand actuates the charging handle and magazine during loading and clearing. Major components of the weapon are produced from high-strength fiber reinforced polymer materials that can be molded in almost any color to include OD green, desert tan, arctic white, urban blue, brown and basic black. Surfaces on the XM8 that interface with the operator are fitted with non-slip materials to increase comfort and operator retention. The XM8 uses 10 or 30-round semi-transparent box magazines and high-reliability 100-round drum magazines for sustained fire applications.

Special integral flush mounted attachment points are located on the handguard and receiver to allow the quick attachment of targeting devices. Unlike MIL-STD-1913 rails, the XM8 attachment points do not add additional weight, bulk and cost to the host weapon, and will accept MIL-STD-1913 adapters to allow for the use of current in-service accessories. The attachment points for the standard multi-function integrated red-dot sight allow multiple mounting positions and insure 100% zero retention even after
the sight is removed and remounted. The battery powered XM8 sight includes the latest technology in a red dot close combat optic, IR laser aimer and laser illuminator with back-up etched reticle with capability exceeding that of the current M68-CCO, AN/PEQ-2 and AN/PAQ-4. This sight will be factory zeroed on the weapon when it is delivered and does not require constant rezeroing in the field like current rail-mounted targeting devices. The XM8 will be fully compatible with future Land Warrior technology and components.

The US XM8 Carbine is being designed at the HK Defense design center in Sterling, Virginia and will be produced and assembled in the United States at the new Heckler & Koch manufacturing plant located in Columbus, Georgia, adjacent to Fort Benning. The unit cost of the XM8 will be less than that of the current M4 Carbine and will guarantee the American war fighter uncompromising performance far exceeding that of current in-service M4 Carbines.
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Old 12-01-2003, 09:26 PM   #3
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Objective Individual Combat Weapon (OICW) will be a light weight weapon capable of firing kinetic energy projectiles and an air-bursting fragmentation munition. It will allow soldiers to effectively attack targets at greater ranges, and to attack targets in defilade. It combines leading edge technologies in miniaturized fuzing; integrated fire control; light weight, high strength materials; and munitions effects. OICW will increase the lethality and survivability of the individual soldier. It is the sole lethality component of the Dismounted Battle Lab's 21st Century Land Warrior (21 CLW) Top Level Demonstration.

The Objective Individual Combat Weapon Advanced Technology Demonstration (ATD) provides an enhanced capability for the 21st century infantryman, with the potential to selectively replace the M16 rifle, M203 grenade launcher, and M4 carbine. The fire control system (FCS), using a laser range finder, pinpoints the precise target range at which the HE round will burst and relays this information to the 20mm ammunition fuzing system. Fragments from the bursting munition will defeat PASGT armor. The sighting system provides full 24-hour capability by employing uncooled IR sensor technology for night vision.

Specific goals include demonstration of hit probability greater than 0.5 out to 500 meters and 0.3 to 0.5 out to 1,000 meters. Effectiveness against personnel and light armor targets, given a hit, will be greater than those of the M433 High Explosive Dual Purpose cartridge fired from the M203 Grenade Launcher and the M855 cartridge fired from the M16A2 rifle. Specific goals include a 0.5 probability of incapacitation to 300 meters (point target) and a 0.2 probability of incapacitation to 300 meters (defilade target) in FY99.

Program guidelines were derived from the Small Arms Master Plan (SAMP) and Joint Service Small Arms Master Plan (JSSAMP). OICW-ATD is managed by JSSAP and will provide superior firepower to the U.S. Army, Marine Corps, Air Force, Special Operations Command, Navy, and Coast Guard.
On 04 August 2000 Alliant Techsystems Integrated Defense Co., LLC, Hopkins, Minn., was awarded a $6,946,000 increment as part of a $95,426,483 cost-plus-award-fee contract for research and development to advance the state-of-the-art Objective Individual Combat Weapon (OICW), Program Definition and Risk Reduction (PD&RR). Work will be performed in Hopkins, Minn., and is expected to be completed in the third quarter of FY04. Contract funds will not expire at the end of the current fiscal year. There was an announcement in the Commerce Business Daily on Nov. 5, 1999, and one bid was received.

Key Program Capabilities


500 percent increase in probability of incapacitation
New soldier capability to defeat targets in defilade
Effective range to 1,000 meters
Day/night fire control; wireless weapon interface
Substantial weight reduction
Ergonomic design

System Features
Lethality Capability: 20MM High Explosive (Air Bursting) projectiles and 5.56MM Kinetic Energy projectiles
Weapon Length: < 33 in
Weapon Weight: < 12 lbs
Rates of Fire: 20MM - 10 RPM, 5.56MM - equal to M16A2
Range: 20MM - 1,000 meters, 5.56MM equal to or better than M16A2.
Combination 5.56mm and 20mm HE
Single trigger control for both barrels
Ambidextrous weapon and switches
Simple red dot day/night sighting system
Laser adjustment for targets in buildings and in defilade
Unique recoil mitigation and tactical operational awareness

Technology Advancements

Weapon recoil mitigation
Fuzing miniaturization and accuracy
Warhead performance and packaging
Target acquisition and man in the loop
Laser ranging accuracy at extended ranges
Extensive composite use
OICW-ATD Program Schedule
Phase 1: Study complete 12/94.

Phase 2: System design and subsystem demonstration complete 2/96.

Phase 3: Prototype system demonstration in fall1997/Jan 98.

Phase 4/5: Hardware build/live-fire simulation begins 4/98.

Fielding of first unit equipped in 2005.
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Old 12-01-2003, 09:30 PM   #4
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looks like a prop from a science fiction movie...but I wouldn't want to be downrange from that :assult:
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Old 12-01-2003, 10:17 PM   #5
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I like the idea of caliber changing modularity.







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Old 12-01-2003, 11:36 PM   #6
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FN FAL - Still the right arm of the free world!
I guess I'm just getting old, I don't want batteries in my weapon, just bullets and plenty of them.
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Old 12-02-2003, 12:19 AM   #7
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I'm not a FAL owner, but a FAL admirer. Hope to get one some day, perhaps a stainless model by DSARMS.
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Old 12-02-2003, 07:29 AM   #8
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That is one of the proposed models that I have seen, there is another HK designed weapon which was or is still in the running. I had printed out a bunch of documents on it but don't have them with me, I will see if I can get the web page address to post those pics as well.
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Old 12-02-2003, 09:13 AM   #9
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I want one.
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Old 12-02-2003, 09:13 AM   #10
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Thumbs down OH GREAT, ANOTHER SPACE GUN

i still want the M-14 brought back, in all its glory!!!

also why not bring back mounted Lancers???? the thunder of hoofs, the battle crys of the Lancers. now wouldn't that be special!!!
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Old 12-02-2003, 10:50 AM   #11
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What I want to know is if this thing is as cranky as a m16/m4/ar15 when dirty. My fal will shoot reliably no matter how dirty it is. Otherwise it looks like a good option, especially with all the interchangability.
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Old 12-04-2003, 04:05 PM   #12
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Until they come up with a self cleaning weapon. Do yourself a favor and clean that sucker.
A malfunction at the wrong time would not be a good thing due to a dirty firearm.
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Old 12-05-2003, 12:25 PM   #13
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rifle gets only 10% of casulties in combat

and the troops fire many thousands of rds of rifle ammo for every hit that they get. So there is nothing to gain by spending billions of $ on a new rifle or rd for same. So lets home that they never get the funding for this boondoggle. The grenade launcher thing will never be issued to ranks below captain. If it is, it will be stolen, and used to cover gangs against SWAT, while they clean out entire bank vaults. Just watch.
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Old 12-05-2003, 01:19 PM   #14
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Here are some of the current and proposed models and varients.

http://home.c2i.net/johnhe/g36_hoved.html

http://i.world.guns.ru/assault/as61-e.htm

http://www.hkpro.com/G36.htm

http://www.hkpro.com/oicw.htm
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Old 12-05-2003, 01:25 PM   #15
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Re: rifle gets only 10% of casulties in combat

Quote:
Originally posted by over
and the troops fire many thousands of rds of rifle ammo for every hit that they get. So there is nothing to gain by spending billions of $ on a new rifle or rd for same. So lets home that they never get the funding for this boondoggle. The grenade launcher thing will never be issued to ranks below captain. If it is, it will be stolen, and used to cover gangs against SWAT, while they clean out entire bank vaults. Just watch.
thats because the troops do not get real rifle man training, that is one bullet one hit kind of training, anymore
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Old 12-05-2003, 06:28 PM   #16
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in the Revolutionary War, they still missed

dozens of times for every hit. By WW1, it was many hundreds of misses per hit. you are dreaming if you "think" that you or anyone else is doing much hitting, when men are dodging, using cover or darkness, firing back, and you have no ear protection. The near misses are making you duck, the noise is making you flinch, much of the time you are exhausted, ill, wounded, etc. Get real, man. It aint a plinking session. Not only that, but most men can't kill other men, face to face, and many of those who can will suffer for it, psychologically, for years after doing so. Some can't sleep after they've killed, and are rendered combat-ineffective, due to exhaustion.
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xm8, m16, replacement

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