BRONZE Receiver???

BattleRifleG3 · 11-17-2004, 07:03 PM

Found an 80% one here:
https://www.vbd.com/noc/shop/product...&ProductID=127

Thrawn · 11-17-2004, 07:22 PM

Shine it up! It'll look like saddam owned it.

would be kind of neat to have...

Shaun · 11-17-2004, 07:23 PM

interesting

Thrawn · 11-18-2004, 02:47 AM

I wonder where you could get the machining finished?

BattleRifleG3 · 11-18-2004, 02:56 AM

Answer: Your own skilled self. That's what it's designed for.

BattleRifleG3 · 11-18-2004, 03:00 AM

This one's actually a tough call... I was planning to upgrade my lower to a heavy duty light toned one to match the soon to be added 24" SS barrel, but this bronze is tempting. Wish there were a way to doctor it in. Wonder how heavy duty it is. Also wouldn't mind knowing exactly what needs to be finished on it, which would affect which tools had to be bought for it.

Thrawn · 11-18-2004, 03:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BattleRifleG3

Answer: Your own skilled self. That's what it's designed for.

that's what money is for. duh.

Thrawn · 11-18-2004, 03:13 AM

I can see some holes that woud have to be drilled.

Can't tell about the inside....

Thrawn · 11-18-2004, 03:15 AM

Stoner's golden boy.

Big Dog · 11-18-2004, 04:35 AM

I would think it would be pretty heavy. And when it starts to tarnish . . . it'll turn that yucky mottled green. Hmmm . . . a natural camo finish, sort of.

G Hollingsworth · 11-18-2004, 07:37 AM

I would venture a guess thats its a test casting or a plug.

lefty o · 11-27-2004, 01:44 AM

its an 80% casting. generally with the 80% you need to drill all the holes, drill and tap the buffer tube hole and mill out the area for the fire control group. its much cheaper to buy a pre machined lower.

BattleRifleG3 · 11-28-2004, 09:21 PM

It is cheaper to buy a pre-machined lower, but when you want a special metal, this seems like a good option.

Thrawn · 11-28-2004, 10:45 PM

It shure would make an interesting rifle.

TULAver · 01-16-2005, 07:16 PM

BRG3, dunno if you're still interested in this, bu I have some considerable experience with that particular type of bronze, and can honestly say that: it's VERY strong; takes incredible temps to cast; machines QUITE well; and is not particularly heavy for a bronze alloy. That particular part will outlast every other part on the rifle, I promise you. Lost Wax casting is an especially detailed and expensive process too, and even though it's an ancient art, modern processes still cannot come CLOSE to the quality of pieces produced this way. It will outperform every aluminum alloy, cast or forged(which, with aluminum, really makes no difference outside of fit and finish) in EVERY relevant category except heat dissipation and weight.

Big Dog, it won't turn green either. Silicon bronze takes a beautiful reddish brown patina, similar to Plum Brown solution. If you really REALLY want it to turn a pretty deep plum, put the piece in a wooden box with urine drenched sawdust(human works good, but Equine is best) and leave it under the house for a couple of months.

It's definitely the nicest of our modern assortment of bronze alloys, in my opinion. Too bad that China forgot more about metallurgy (in the years after Mao took over) than the entire rest of the world knows TODAY.

Honestly, I can't report of EVER hearing of it's use in firearm applications, and I don't know why. The only thing I can think of is it being cost prohibitive. But they use titanium, and it's cost prohibitive, and outside a very few select parts(titanium firing pins ARE great I admit), not even very usefull, and MORE than a hassle to machine. With Silicon Bronze, at least the positives outweigh the negatives(attractive protective oxidation and toughness Vs trouble of casting and overall weight) With titanium, the true costs are hidden The material itself is very expensive to begin with, and on top of that, you spend even MORE money replacing worn out blades, heads, bits, etc just machining it.

Bronze = Good

It's been proven a heck of a lot longer than any of our other alloys.

TULAver · 01-16-2005, 07:33 PM

Quick example for you BRG3, if you're used to machining aluminum.

Poplar is to Teak what Aluminum is to Bronze

It's heavier and harder than aluminum, but it machines much cleaner, if you know what I mean. For example, you can put a razor's edge on a bronze blade, but you can't make a working edge to cut ANYTHING with aluminum(well, blades to cut the air,

Bronze takes fine details better than any other alloy that I know of, except maybe pewter, and from what I know about ARs, seems that would be important.

The short answer to your question about it being heavy duty is this:

We do not currently KNOW of an alloy that will outlast bronze in any capacity besides melting temp.

BattleRifleG3 · 01-16-2005, 11:02 PM

My experience is with brass, aluminum, and steel. Sounds really cool, thanks guys. I might really have to look into this more.

TULAver · 01-30-2005, 11:06 PM

Just don't forget that it WILL be heavy in comparison. Seems like it would make a great target rifle part, especially with a heavier hitting round than 5.56. I've probably said this already, but I really can't recall EVER hearing of Bronze being used in a firearm, and the only reason I can think of is price.

If you like working with metal, bronze will definitely spoil you. Almost as strong as steel, easy to work with(except casting) finishes up beautifully, patina actually protects instead of eating away, etc...

BattleRifleG3 · 01-31-2005, 11:41 AM

Bronze was the gun metal of choice until iron casting and machining were developed enough. Go to an old fort or castle and you'll see plenty of bronze cannons and howitzers. It was still highly used until the latter 19th century.

TULAver · 02-08-2005, 02:28 PM

hehehe, never heard of it's use in a *modern firearm I should have said

Completely forgot about the old cannons and such.

11-17-2004, 07:03 PM	#1
BattleRifleG3 Super Moderator Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Western PA Posts: 11,401 Images: 13	BRONZE Receiver??? Found an 80% one here: https://www.vbd.com/noc/shop/product...&ProductID=127 __________________ Trust is earned, not... GIVEN away. - Worf

11-17-2004, 07:23 PM	#3
Shaun Super Moderator Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Nashville, TN Posts: 8,592 Images: 1	interesting __________________ "Homeland Security is the responsibility of an armed citizen" ME http://webpages.charter.net/s.s.v/

11-18-2004, 02:56 AM	#5
BattleRifleG3 Super Moderator Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Western PA Posts: 11,401 Images: 13	Answer: Your own skilled self. That's what it's designed for. __________________ Trust is earned, not... GIVEN away. - Worf

11-18-2004, 03:00 AM	#6
BattleRifleG3 Super Moderator Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Western PA Posts: 11,401 Images: 13	This one's actually a tough call... I was planning to upgrade my lower to a heavy duty light toned one to match the soon to be added 24" SS barrel, but this bronze is tempting. Wish there were a way to doctor it in. Wonder how heavy duty it is. Also wouldn't mind knowing exactly what needs to be finished on it, which would affect which tools had to be bought for it. __________________ Trust is earned, not... GIVEN away. - Worf

11-18-2004, 04:35 AM	#10
Big Dog Moderator Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Tallahassee, Florida Posts: 10,221	I would think it would be pretty heavy. And when it starts to tarnish . . . it'll turn that yucky mottled green. Hmmm . . . a natural camo finish, sort of. __________________ Moderator of: AR15/M16, M14/M1A, New/Beginning Shooters and Militaria/Collectables.

11-17-2004, 07:22 PM	#2
Thrawn Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Okeefenokee Posts: 1,618 Images: 6	Shine it up! It'll look like saddam owned it. would be kind of neat to have...

11-18-2004, 02:47 AM	#4
Thrawn Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Okeefenokee Posts: 1,618 Images: 6	I wonder where you could get the machining finished?

11-18-2004, 03:13 AM	#8
Thrawn Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Okeefenokee Posts: 1,618 Images: 6	I can see some holes that woud have to be drilled. Can't tell about the inside....

11-18-2004, 03:15 AM	#9
Thrawn Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Okeefenokee Posts: 1,618 Images: 6	Stoner's golden boy.

11-18-2004, 07:37 AM	#11
G Hollingsworth Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 227	I would venture a guess thats its a test casting or a plug.

11-27-2004, 01:44 AM	#12
lefty o Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: mn Posts: 4,812	its an 80% casting. generally with the 80% you need to drill all the holes, drill and tap the buffer tube hole and mill out the area for the fire control group. its much cheaper to buy a pre machined lower.

11-28-2004, 09:21 PM	#13
BattleRifleG3 Super Moderator Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Western PA Posts: 11,401 Images: 13	It is cheaper to buy a pre-machined lower, but when you want a special metal, this seems like a good option. __________________ Trust is earned, not... GIVEN away. - Worf

11-28-2004, 10:45 PM	#14
Thrawn Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Okeefenokee Posts: 1,618 Images: 6	It shure would make an interesting rifle.

01-16-2005, 07:16 PM	#15
TULAver Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Southeast Texas Posts: 372	BRG3, dunno if you're still interested in this, bu I have some considerable experience with that particular type of bronze, and can honestly say that: it's VERY strong; takes incredible temps to cast; machines QUITE well; and is not particularly heavy for a bronze alloy. That particular part will outlast every other part on the rifle, I promise you. Lost Wax casting is an especially detailed and expensive process too, and even though it's an ancient art, modern processes still cannot come CLOSE to the quality of pieces produced this way. It will outperform every aluminum alloy, cast or forged(which, with aluminum, really makes no difference outside of fit and finish) in EVERY relevant category except heat dissipation and weight. Big Dog, it won't turn green either. Silicon bronze takes a beautiful reddish brown patina, similar to Plum Brown solution. If you really REALLY want it to turn a pretty deep plum, put the piece in a wooden box with urine drenched sawdust(human works good, but Equine is best) and leave it under the house for a couple of months. It's definitely the nicest of our modern assortment of bronze alloys, in my opinion. Too bad that China forgot more about metallurgy (in the years after Mao took over) than the entire rest of the world knows TODAY. Honestly, I can't report of EVER hearing of it's use in firearm applications, and I don't know why. The only thing I can think of is it being cost prohibitive. But they use titanium, and it's cost prohibitive, and outside a very few select parts(titanium firing pins ARE great I admit), not even very usefull, and MORE than a hassle to machine. With Silicon Bronze, at least the positives outweigh the negatives(attractive protective oxidation and toughness Vs trouble of casting and overall weight) With titanium, the true costs are hidden The material itself is very expensive to begin with, and on top of that, you spend even MORE money replacing worn out blades, heads, bits, etc just machining it. Bronze = Good It's been proven a heck of a lot longer than any of our other alloys. __________________ It is known that there are an infinite number of worlds, simply because there is an infinite amount of space for them to be in. However, not every one of them is inhabited. Therefore, there must be a finite number of inhabited worlds. Any finite number divided by infinity is as near to nothing as makes no odds, so the average population of the Universe can be said to be zero. From this it follows that any people you meet from time to time are merely the product of a deranged imagination.

01-16-2005, 07:33 PM	#16
TULAver Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Southeast Texas Posts: 372	Quick example for you BRG3, if you're used to machining aluminum. Poplar is to Teak what Aluminum is to Bronze It's heavier and harder than aluminum, but it machines much cleaner, if you know what I mean. For example, you can put a razor's edge on a bronze blade, but you can't make a working edge to cut ANYTHING with aluminum(well, blades to cut the air, Bronze takes fine details better than any other alloy that I know of, except maybe pewter, and from what I know about ARs, seems that would be important. The short answer to your question about it being heavy duty is this: We do not currently KNOW of an alloy that will outlast bronze in any capacity besides melting temp. __________________ It is known that there are an infinite number of worlds, simply because there is an infinite amount of space for them to be in. However, not every one of them is inhabited. Therefore, there must be a finite number of inhabited worlds. Any finite number divided by infinity is as near to nothing as makes no odds, so the average population of the Universe can be said to be zero. From this it follows that any people you meet from time to time are merely the product of a deranged imagination.

01-16-2005, 11:02 PM	#17
BattleRifleG3 Super Moderator Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Western PA Posts: 11,401 Images: 13	My experience is with brass, aluminum, and steel. Sounds really cool, thanks guys. I might really have to look into this more. __________________ Trust is earned, not... GIVEN away. - Worf

01-30-2005, 11:06 PM	#18
TULAver Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Southeast Texas Posts: 372	Just don't forget that it WILL be heavy in comparison. Seems like it would make a great target rifle part, especially with a heavier hitting round than 5.56. I've probably said this already, but I really can't recall EVER hearing of Bronze being used in a firearm, and the only reason I can think of is price. If you like working with metal, bronze will definitely spoil you. Almost as strong as steel, easy to work with(except casting) finishes up beautifully, patina actually protects instead of eating away, etc... __________________ It is known that there are an infinite number of worlds, simply because there is an infinite amount of space for them to be in. However, not every one of them is inhabited. Therefore, there must be a finite number of inhabited worlds. Any finite number divided by infinity is as near to nothing as makes no odds, so the average population of the Universe can be said to be zero. From this it follows that any people you meet from time to time are merely the product of a deranged imagination.

01-31-2005, 11:41 AM	#19
BattleRifleG3 Super Moderator Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Western PA Posts: 11,401 Images: 13	Bronze was the gun metal of choice until iron casting and machining were developed enough. Go to an old fort or castle and you'll see plenty of bronze cannons and howitzers. It was still highly used until the latter 19th century. __________________ Trust is earned, not... GIVEN away. - Worf

02-08-2005, 02:28 PM	#20
TULAver Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Southeast Texas Posts: 372	hehehe, never heard of it's use in a *modern firearm I should have said Completely forgot about the old cannons and such. __________________ It is known that there are an infinite number of worlds, simply because there is an infinite amount of space for them to be in. However, not every one of them is inhabited. Therefore, there must be a finite number of inhabited worlds. Any finite number divided by infinity is as near to nothing as makes no odds, so the average population of the Universe can be said to be zero. From this it follows that any people you meet from time to time are merely the product of a deranged imagination.