CCW laws

SPOCAHP ANAR · 02-13-2006, 04:50 PM

Does anyone here believe that a store should be required to allow CCW carriers since they are concealed and noone would know, as well as the CCW holder being trained and registered?

jamesfaync · 02-13-2006, 04:55 PM

no i do not. even more than i believe in the 2nd amendment, i believe that a person should be able to do as he or she wishs in their own home or bussiness. i a person doesnt believe in cch it should be their right to say not in my place of business. of course it is your right as a consumer to decide whether or not to shop there.

BamaBowTie · 02-13-2006, 05:01 PM

Honestly, no! I fully believe in freedom. If a store owner doesn't want guns around that's his choice, but it is also my freedom of choice to shop elsewhere. Only thing I see needs changed is the law here that you can't carry in a place with alcohol consumed on site. I think it should be allowed as long as YOU are not the one consuming it. I do carry in restraunts that serve alcohol, but with my Kel-Tec P-11 I can get away with it. :right:

jamesfaync · 02-13-2006, 05:06 PM

wow thats a first someone who agrees with me on something instead of calling me a quack

Mooseman684 · 02-13-2006, 08:17 PM

Thank God here in Alaska we can carry anywhere other than a FEDERAL building,Post Office, School, State Courthouse, or Troopers Station. You can Carry anywhere else including a Bar as long as you aren't drinking Alcohol.
We can also carry Unconcealed too ! I've never seen a sign Not allowing it in a private business!:lucky:

SPOCAHP ANAR · 02-13-2006, 08:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jamesfaync

wow thats a first someone who agrees with me on something instead of calling me a quack

I also agree with you; I just wanted to see people's responses.

Mooseman; I love it how the government decides after giving someone a license to carry to turn around and say: WHOA there a minute! We trust you running around town with one, just not in here; Oh by the way if someone breaks the law and start ripping people down with an UZI; we are not required to protect you. Tough break but that is the result of living in a free society"

Outriderdark · 02-13-2006, 08:34 PM

Ya gotta keep 'em away from alcohol ....'cause it'll strip the lube off your sidearm.

Bull Barrel · 02-13-2006, 08:43 PM

I think the concealed carry means just that--not in the legal sense--but in the sense that you have a weapon that is deeply concelaed--it is there for a life or death situation that may never happen--disclosing such a thing even to those closest to you is not even on the options list--it's absolutely a personal choice and I believe despite what the law says that it is the right of any human to be armed and prepared to defend life--concealment is primarily to avoid all the different prejudices and unjust laws--including those of spouses, family, businesses, what have you.

On the other hand any human with integrity or decency will honor the reasonable requests of another human--especially those bound by territory (such as a business owner stating what is or is not allowed in a business).

Meaning simply even though I do not recognise any authority outside my own domain, I still acknowledge the needs and desires of those outside my domain and being a decent person I would acquiesce to those needs, providing they do not compromise my own.

Obviously breaking laws can have serious repercussions--if simply choosing when and wear to shop is the easiest way to avoid such difficult decisions then by all means shop where CCW is not even mentioned.

However the right to keep an bear arms shall not be infringed, doesn't leave a lot of room for all these added "infringements" in my reckoning--but I tend to be a little hard-headed about personal freedom.

Unfortunately I also tend to respect the wishes of others (when reasonable) so it's kind of a dichotomy for me. I must admit I have mixed feelings and if I thought I was in an area or zone where a weapon would be a good thing I would be hard pressed to leave it out of the picture just because of a sign on a door--but if any other door was available I would take it instead....

Wiffle Waffle

BattleRifleG3 · 02-14-2006, 12:29 AM

In PA the law is that CCW permits guarantee the right to carry in all but prohibited locations unless the premises has a clear sign prohibiting firearms. In that case it is then illegal to carry on the premises. If they don't have a clear sign, the most they can do is tell you to leave. Then again PA is mandatory CCW so they wouldn't know anyway.

What I think should be different is that the law should not get involved if the person is non-violent, signs be darned. Only if they are asked to leave and refuse, and then only for trespassing.

Shaun · 02-14-2006, 12:44 AM

Like others I am a beliver in freedom and if you post a sign saying I can't come in with my gun then don't worry you won't get my business

pball942 · 02-14-2006, 02:02 AM

Should Kansas pass the CCW bill that will be one of the stipulations. Which if it is law I will obay, and take my money elsewhere. But there is always the criminal element that will ignore the posted sign and do what he wants.

SPOCAHP ANAR · 02-14-2006, 04:21 PM

If I put up a sign that says no CCW guns and you are caught with one its a felony. If I put up a sign and say no Tshirts and you come in in one then its misdemeanor tresspassing.

The level of tresspass is the same yet each is punished differently.

Bull Barrel · 02-14-2006, 04:32 PM

Seems reasonable to me--a T shirt can't go off unexpectedly....

BamaBowTie · 02-14-2006, 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bull Barrel

Seems reasonable to me--a T shirt can't go off unexpectedly....

Neither will a gun.

Mooseman684 · 02-14-2006, 05:58 PM

IF I were a Criminal and saw a sign.." No CCW allowed " or "No weapons allowed", well I would know which store to rob safely !
We just had an incident in Fairbanks where 3 teens tried to rob A GUN STORE !
They hit the owner with a crowbar, but he shook it off and pulled his handgun and held 2 of them against the wall for the cops , the third one ran away but was arrested a few blocks away! How dumb Can you be ???

Bull Barrel · 02-14-2006, 06:00 PM

I guess a store owner that posts a no CCW sign would have some reason for it--like fear of being involved in some sort of shooting incident--obviously a criminal isn't going to pay any mind to such a sign, so the store-owner would basically be ruling out any armed help from lawful CCW customers in the event of a hold up, etc--kind of silly--and I agree guns don't go off unexpectedly--I was just making a joke...not a very good joke, but--anyway I think that a storeowner is well within his legal rights to post whatever--no party hats, no suglasses, whatever--it's private property and therefore whatever rules the owner cares to enforce are legal, I imagine...

Mooseman684 · 02-14-2006, 06:39 PM

Funny thing too is Most stores have signs saying.." No shoes, No shirt, No service " but you Don't need PANTS ! Maybe cause you couldn't hide a pistol ??? LOL

Shaun · 02-14-2006, 10:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bull Barrel

I guess a store owner that posts a no CCW sign would have some reason for it--like fear of being involved in some sort of shooting incident--obviously a criminal isn't going to pay any mind to such a sign, so the store-owner would basically be ruling out any armed help from lawful CCW customers in the event of a hold up, etc--kind of silly--and I agree guns don't go off unexpectedly--I was just making a joke...not a very good joke, but--anyway I think that a storeowner is well within his legal rights to post whatever--no party hats, no suglasses, whatever--it's private property and therefore whatever rules the owner cares to enforce are legal, I imagine...

The thing about it is for the posted facilities this is where the criminals will hang out as they know everyone coming and going is an easy victim.

BattleRifleG3 · 02-15-2006, 01:02 AM

In western PA, even in the big liberal infested city of Pittsburgh, I only see no-gun signs in post offices, where they are illegal anyway by fed law, and on hospitals.

02-13-2006, 04:50 PM	#1
SPOCAHP ANAR Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: SC-upstate Posts: 4,097 Images: 3 Blog Entries: 4	CCW laws Does anyone here believe that a store should be required to allow CCW carriers since they are concealed and noone would know, as well as the CCW holder being trained and registered? __________________ Spocrest Out!..........

02-13-2006, 05:01 PM	#3
BamaBowTie Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Alexandria, AL Posts: 226 Images: 1	Honestly, no! I fully believe in freedom. If a store owner doesn't want guns around that's his choice, but it is also my freedom of choice to shop elsewhere. Only thing I see needs changed is the law here that you can't carry in a place with alcohol consumed on site. I think it should be allowed as long as YOU are not the one consuming it. I do carry in restraunts that serve alcohol, but with my Kel-Tec P-11 I can get away with it. :right: __________________ "They call you paranoid until the worst happens, and in the aftermath they call you a hero." -Me

02-13-2006, 08:17 PM	#5
Mooseman684 Super Moderator Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Alaska Wilderness Posts: 9,693 Images: 2	Thank God here in Alaska we can carry anywhere other than a FEDERAL building,Post Office, School, State Courthouse, or Troopers Station. You can Carry anywhere else including a Bar as long as you aren't drinking Alcohol. We can also carry Unconcealed too ! I've never seen a sign Not allowing it in a private business!:lucky: __________________ You know you might be facing your doom,when all you get is a click when you're expecting a BOOM!

02-13-2006, 08:34 PM	#7
Outriderdark Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: New Jersey, USA Posts: 1,125	Ya gotta keep 'em away from alcohol ....'cause it'll strip the lube off your sidearm. __________________ "Would it make you feel better, little girl, if they was thrown outta windows?"-Archie Bunker

02-13-2006, 08:43 PM	#8
Bull Barrel Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Blue Ridge Mountains of Virginia Posts: 239	I think the concealed carry means just that--not in the legal sense--but in the sense that you have a weapon that is deeply concelaed--it is there for a life or death situation that may never happen--disclosing such a thing even to those closest to you is not even on the options list--it's absolutely a personal choice and I believe despite what the law says that it is the right of any human to be armed and prepared to defend life--concealment is primarily to avoid all the different prejudices and unjust laws--including those of spouses, family, businesses, what have you. On the other hand any human with integrity or decency will honor the reasonable requests of another human--especially those bound by territory (such as a business owner stating what is or is not allowed in a business). Meaning simply even though I do not recognise any authority outside my own domain, I still acknowledge the needs and desires of those outside my domain and being a decent person I would acquiesce to those needs, providing they do not compromise my own. Obviously breaking laws can have serious repercussions--if simply choosing when and wear to shop is the easiest way to avoid such difficult decisions then by all means shop where CCW is not even mentioned. However the right to keep an bear arms shall not be infringed, doesn't leave a lot of room for all these added "infringements" in my reckoning--but I tend to be a little hard-headed about personal freedom. Unfortunately I also tend to respect the wishes of others (when reasonable) so it's kind of a dichotomy for me. I must admit I have mixed feelings and if I thought I was in an area or zone where a weapon would be a good thing I would be hard pressed to leave it out of the picture just because of a sign on a door--but if any other door was available I would take it instead.... Wiffle Waffle __________________ Beautiful Noisy Deadly Machines--What's Not to Like? :assult:

02-13-2006, 04:55 PM	#2
jamesfaync Senior Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: fayetteville nc Posts: 167	no i do not. even more than i believe in the 2nd amendment, i believe that a person should be able to do as he or she wishs in their own home or bussiness. i a person doesnt believe in cch it should be their right to say not in my place of business. of course it is your right as a consumer to decide whether or not to shop there.

02-13-2006, 05:06 PM	#4
jamesfaync Senior Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: fayetteville nc Posts: 167	wow thats a first someone who agrees with me on something instead of calling me a quack

02-14-2006, 12:29 AM	#9
BattleRifleG3 Super Moderator Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Western PA Posts: 11,401 Images: 13	In PA the law is that CCW permits guarantee the right to carry in all but prohibited locations unless the premises has a clear sign prohibiting firearms. In that case it is then illegal to carry on the premises. If they don't have a clear sign, the most they can do is tell you to leave. Then again PA is mandatory CCW so they wouldn't know anyway. What I think should be different is that the law should not get involved if the person is non-violent, signs be darned. Only if they are asked to leave and refuse, and then only for trespassing. __________________ Trust is earned, not... GIVEN away. - Worf

02-14-2006, 12:44 AM	#10
Shaun Super Moderator Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Nashville, TN Posts: 8,592 Images: 1	Like others I am a beliver in freedom and if you post a sign saying I can't come in with my gun then don't worry you won't get my business __________________ "Homeland Security is the responsibility of an armed citizen" ME http://webpages.charter.net/s.s.v/

02-14-2006, 02:02 AM	#11
pball942 Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Kansas Posts: 256	Should Kansas pass the CCW bill that will be one of the stipulations. Which if it is law I will obay, and take my money elsewhere. But there is always the criminal element that will ignore the posted sign and do what he wants. __________________ Running is not a plan. Running is what you do when your plan fails.

02-14-2006, 04:21 PM	#12
SPOCAHP ANAR Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: SC-upstate Posts: 4,097 Images: 3 Blog Entries: 4	If I put up a sign that says no CCW guns and you are caught with one its a felony. If I put up a sign and say no Tshirts and you come in in one then its misdemeanor tresspassing. The level of tresspass is the same yet each is punished differently. __________________ Spocrest Out!..........

02-14-2006, 04:32 PM	#13
Bull Barrel Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Blue Ridge Mountains of Virginia Posts: 239	Seems reasonable to me--a T shirt can't go off unexpectedly.... __________________ Beautiful Noisy Deadly Machines--What's Not to Like? :assult:

02-14-2006, 05:58 PM	#15
Mooseman684 Super Moderator Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Alaska Wilderness Posts: 9,693 Images: 2	IF I were a Criminal and saw a sign.." No CCW allowed " or "No weapons allowed", well I would know which store to rob safely ! We just had an incident in Fairbanks where 3 teens tried to rob A GUN STORE ! They hit the owner with a crowbar, but he shook it off and pulled his handgun and held 2 of them against the wall for the cops , the third one ran away but was arrested a few blocks away! How dumb Can you be ??? __________________ You know you might be facing your doom,when all you get is a click when you're expecting a BOOM!

02-14-2006, 06:00 PM	#16
Bull Barrel Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Blue Ridge Mountains of Virginia Posts: 239	I guess a store owner that posts a no CCW sign would have some reason for it--like fear of being involved in some sort of shooting incident--obviously a criminal isn't going to pay any mind to such a sign, so the store-owner would basically be ruling out any armed help from lawful CCW customers in the event of a hold up, etc--kind of silly--and I agree guns don't go off unexpectedly--I was just making a joke...not a very good joke, but--anyway I think that a storeowner is well within his legal rights to post whatever--no party hats, no suglasses, whatever--it's private property and therefore whatever rules the owner cares to enforce are legal, I imagine... __________________ Beautiful Noisy Deadly Machines--What's Not to Like? :assult:

02-14-2006, 06:39 PM	#17
Mooseman684 Super Moderator Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Alaska Wilderness Posts: 9,693 Images: 2	Funny thing too is Most stores have signs saying.." No shoes, No shirt, No service " but you Don't need PANTS ! Maybe cause you couldn't hide a pistol ??? LOL __________________ You know you might be facing your doom,when all you get is a click when you're expecting a BOOM!

02-15-2006, 01:02 AM	#19
BattleRifleG3 Super Moderator Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Western PA Posts: 11,401 Images: 13	In western PA, even in the big liberal infested city of Pittsburgh, I only see no-gun signs in post offices, where they are illegal anyway by fed law, and on hospitals. __________________ Trust is earned, not... GIVEN away. - Worf