law on carring in store

outcastedsoul · 12-20-2008, 11:44 PM

Does anyone know the law on carring in a place that has a sign that has no weapons allowed,with a cwp or not?

rl356 · 12-20-2008, 11:58 PM

Generally speaking, if a sign is posted forbidding you to carry a weapon onto the premises, then it's prohibited for you to do so whether you have a concealed carry permit or not.

Mooseman684 · 12-21-2008, 12:01 AM

You should REFUSE to do Business with a store like that...and Yes , They own the store so they can forbid you to carry in it....
Good place to rob I would think !

just_a_car · 12-21-2008, 12:11 AM

Actually, it depends on the laws of your state or locality.

Here in Washington State, signage carries no weight of law. If they have a no weapons/firearms sign, they may certainly trespass you and if you stay or come back, you can be charged with trespassing, but you can't be charged with trespassing for violating the sign.

I've heard that in some states, though, the sign Does carry the weight of law and you can be charged with trespassing.

So, the main thing to do is to check your laws. You may want to take a look at the relevant state forum over on opencarry.org, where they deal with this stuff all the time.

Oh, and just in case you think I'm promoting going into those stores... I "moderate" the Do Not Patronize list for WA State on OCDO.

TexasT · 12-21-2008, 12:16 AM

I agree with JAC, check your local laws. Here in Texas, if you are a CHL holder you can carry in places that have "no firearms" signs as long as it is not a 30-06 sign or a sign that says it derives at least 51% of it's revenue from alcohol.

just_a_car · 12-21-2008, 12:25 AM

As an aside, TT brought up a nuance I forgot to mention for WA State: places that are barred to those under 21 by the WA Liquor Control Board (bars and lounges, essentially) are also off-limits to carrying... at all; even if you have a concealed pistol license.

But, if it's a place that sells liquor in a bar, but has areas that are not off-limits to under-21, then you're fine to be in those areas.

That's the only situation where the signage carries the weight of law... because it is the law (and references the relevant section at the bottom - RCW 9.41.300... yes, that's from memory

).

BattleRifleG3 · 12-21-2008, 05:05 AM

In PA, such a sign makes it unlawful to carry inside the store. But they have to have the sign conspicuously at the enterance, having it inconspicuously or as a policy isn't good enough. I'm sure they can ask anyone to leave even for a paper policy, but that's the most they can do, and it is their store.

XD9TAC · 12-26-2008, 03:49 PM

I don't go to places that do not allow me to carry. I got my license because I wanted an edge in a TSHF situation. No edge no me.

Airweight38 · 12-26-2008, 08:47 PM

Not only have I taken to boycotting CCH-unfriendly businesses; I've also started writing letters (not Emails) to their corporate offices explaining so. I just got a phone call Friday from Kroger Foods, recommending that I disarm and continue patronizing their stores. Needless to say that call ended on us "agreeing to disagree." It may not change anything immediately, but I can't help but think it has to get their attention.

JohnnyRebel · 12-27-2008, 12:22 AM

I wouldn't do business with a place like that but I believe it is their right to not have firearms on their property if they choose that.

Mooseman684 · 12-27-2008, 12:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Airweight38

Not only have I taken to boycotting CCH-unfriendly businesses; I've also started writing letters (not Emails) to their corporate offices explaining so. I just got a phone call Friday from Kroger Foods, recommending that I disarm and continue patronizing their stores. Needless to say that call ended on us "agreeing to disagree." It may not change anything immediately, but I can't help but think it has to get their attention.

Ask Kroger if they can GUARANTEE yours and your wifes Safety if a Gunman walks in and opens fire on customers in their store , like what has happened in Restaurants and Malls around the country...
They should be thankful that armed citizens are patrolling the aisles ready to help protect the unarmed people inside.

GlockMeister · 12-27-2008, 01:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mooseman684

You should REFUSE to do Business with a store like that...and Yes , They own the store so they can forbid you to carry in it....
Good place to rob I would think !

I agree with this post. Especially the part about NOT doing business with them...

GlockMeister · 12-27-2008, 02:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Airweight38

Not only have I taken to boycotting CCH-unfriendly businesses; I've also started writing letters (not Emails) to their corporate offices explaining so. I just got a phone call Friday from Kroger Foods, recommending that I disarm and continue patronizing their stores. Needless to say that call ended on us "agreeing to disagree." It may not change anything immediately, but I can't help but think it has to get their attention.

[quote]=mooseman684]Ask Kroger if they can GUARANTEE yours and your wife's Safety if a Gunman walks in and opens fire on customers in their store , like what has happened in Restaurants and Malls around the country...
They should be thankful that armed citizens are patrolling the aisles ready to help protect the unarmed people inside. __________________[quote]

And then ask them if they have enough insurance to pay for you suing their sorry butts for same, because if you do disarm, and continue to spend YOUR money there, and something like that happens, and that since you could have probably stopped it, had you been allowed to conceal carry, that's exactly what you'll do.

johnnyusa · 12-27-2008, 10:10 PM

i dont normally shop at kroger, but this is nice to know. i will avoid doing so now. only a fool would think that the store is safer by taking away the ability of honest, sensible people to defend themselves. and did you say they wrote you suggesting that you disarm? who are they to tell you that? i certainly would let them know that you are not looking to them for advice on such matters. its none of thier business.

i carry in places like that whether its posted or not. if you arent doing anything wrong, they would never have a reason to ask. and besides, i would much rather be in trouble for carrying than to be dead because i wasnt.

just_a_car · 12-28-2008, 08:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GlockMeister

I agree with this post. Especially the part about NOT doing business with them...

If you ever come to WA State, feel free to take a look at the WA DNP List that I try to keep up to date. Sometimes I get behind due to school or laziness, but I eventually get it updated.

Some other state forums on that site have taken my lead and started their own DNP List, feel free to look around.

Brother Bob · 12-28-2008, 08:26 PM

Maybe it's just me, but I'd feel much safer in a store where everyone was packing than in one where no one was packing. I'm a firm believer in leveling the playing field.

Roshank · 12-28-2008, 10:57 PM

I dont mind some stores saying you cant have a gun. The thing that pisses me off though is the stores saying you cant have a CCW, but yet the store sells ammo and guns. Is that not the most retarded thing in the world. Well we have them and sell them but you cant have one.Wal-mart is a prime example..

just_a_car · 12-30-2008, 08:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roshank

I dont mind some stores saying you cant have a gun. The thing that pisses me off though is the stores saying you cant have a CCW, but yet the store sells ammo and guns. Is that not the most retarded thing in the world. Well we have them and sell them but you cant have one.Wal-mart is a prime example..

Wal-mart's stated corporate policy is to follow state law... so if your state allows legal CC and/or OC, then they allow it. I can't cite specifically, but it's been researched more than once over on OpenCarry.org

BunnyWabbit · 12-30-2008, 09:00 PM

Kroger owns Dillons Grocery stores and Dillons allow you to carry. We have grocery store banks where you walk up to a counter in the grocery store against a wall and they have a no gun sign, but I figure I am standing in the grocery store and as long as I don't put my purse on their counter, I am not "in" their bank. It's a really gray area in regards to the laws about that, but most of the time they do have a security guard there at the banks. Kansas law has a list of places you are not allowed to carry and a bank is one of them. They don't need a sign either, we are supposed to remember all the places we are not allowed.

Mooseman684 · 12-30-2008, 09:12 PM

We can carry in Banks in Alaska...They are Privately owned...

12-20-2008, 11:44 PM	#1
outcastedsoul Registered User Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: southeast fl Posts: 1	law on carring in store Does anyone know the law on carring in a place that has a sign that has no weapons allowed,with a cwp or not?

12-21-2008, 12:01 AM	#3
Mooseman684 Super Moderator Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Alaska Wilderness. Unit 13 Posts: 11,316 Images: 2	You should REFUSE to do Business with a store like that...and Yes , They own the store so they can forbid you to carry in it.... Good place to rob I would think ! __________________ You know you might be facing your doom,when all you get is a click when you're expecting a BOOM!

12-21-2008, 12:11 AM	#4
just_a_car Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Edmonds, WA Posts: 4,091	Actually, it depends on the laws of your state or locality. Here in Washington State, signage carries no weight of law. If they have a no weapons/firearms sign, they may certainly trespass you and if you stay or come back, you can be charged with trespassing, but you can't be charged with trespassing for violating the sign. I've heard that in some states, though, the sign Does carry the weight of law and you can be charged with trespassing. So, the main thing to do is to check your laws. You may want to take a look at the relevant state forum over on opencarry.org, where they deal with this stuff all the time. Oh, and just in case you think I'm promoting going into those stores... I "moderate" the Do Not Patronize list for WA State on OCDO. __________________ B.S. Chemistry UofWA '09 CETME Owners - Founder AK-47 owners - Member The Mosin Men - Member

12-21-2008, 12:16 AM	#5
TexasT Stop the insanity Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Somewhere. Posts: 7,208 Blog Entries: 18	I agree with JAC, check your local laws. Here in Texas, if you are a CHL holder you can carry in places that have "no firearms" signs as long as it is not a 30-06 sign or a sign that says it derives at least 51% of it's revenue from alcohol. __________________ I'm so evolved. I'm so involved. I'm showing growth. I'm so in charge. I'm CEO, and yeah, going GOD.

12-21-2008, 12:25 AM	#6
just_a_car Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Edmonds, WA Posts: 4,091	As an aside, TT brought up a nuance I forgot to mention for WA State: places that are barred to those under 21 by the WA Liquor Control Board (bars and lounges, essentially) are also off-limits to carrying... at all; even if you have a concealed pistol license. But, if it's a place that sells liquor in a bar, but has areas that are not off-limits to under-21, then you're fine to be in those areas. That's the only situation where the signage carries the weight of law... because it is the law (and references the relevant section at the bottom - RCW 9.41.300... yes, that's from memory ). __________________ B.S. Chemistry UofWA '09 CETME Owners - Founder AK-47 owners - Member The Mosin Men - Member

12-20-2008, 11:58 PM	#2
rl356 Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: N.E. Ohio Posts: 398	Generally speaking, if a sign is posted forbidding you to carry a weapon onto the premises, then it's prohibited for you to do so whether you have a concealed carry permit or not.

12-21-2008, 05:05 AM	#7
BattleRifleG3 Retired Moderator Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Western PA Posts: 11,681 Images: 13	In PA, such a sign makes it unlawful to carry inside the store. But they have to have the sign conspicuously at the enterance, having it inconspicuously or as a policy isn't good enough. I'm sure they can ask anyone to leave even for a paper policy, but that's the most they can do, and it is their store. __________________ Trust is earned, not... GIVEN away. - Worf

12-26-2008, 03:49 PM	#8
XD9TAC Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Razorback Country Arkansas Posts: 15	I don't go to places that do not allow me to carry. I got my license because I wanted an edge in a TSHF situation. No edge no me.

12-26-2008, 08:47 PM	#9
Airweight38 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Kansas City Posts: 327	Not only have I taken to boycotting CCH-unfriendly businesses; I've also started writing letters (not Emails) to their corporate offices explaining so. I just got a phone call Friday from Kroger Foods, recommending that I disarm and continue patronizing their stores. Needless to say that call ended on us "agreeing to disagree." It may not change anything immediately, but I can't help but think it has to get their attention. __________________ I'll keep my freedom, guns and money. You can keep the "Change."

12-27-2008, 12:22 AM	#10
JohnnyRebel Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Occupied Mississippi Posts: 37	I wouldn't do business with a place like that but I believe it is their right to not have firearms on their property if they choose that.

12-27-2008, 10:10 PM	#14
johnnyusa Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: USA Posts: 34	i dont normally shop at kroger, but this is nice to know. i will avoid doing so now. only a fool would think that the store is safer by taking away the ability of honest, sensible people to defend themselves. and did you say they wrote you suggesting that you disarm? who are they to tell you that? i certainly would let them know that you are not looking to them for advice on such matters. its none of thier business. i carry in places like that whether its posted or not. if you arent doing anything wrong, they would never have a reason to ask. and besides, i would much rather be in trouble for carrying than to be dead because i wasnt.

12-28-2008, 08:26 PM	#16
Brother Bob Banned Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Olive Branch, MS. Posts: 5,651 Blog Entries: 3	Maybe it's just me, but I'd feel much safer in a store where everyone was packing than in one where no one was packing. I'm a firm believer in leveling the playing field.

12-28-2008, 10:57 PM	#17
Roshank Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: South Dakota Posts: 69	I dont mind some stores saying you cant have a gun. The thing that pisses me off though is the stores saying you cant have a CCW, but yet the store sells ammo and guns. Is that not the most retarded thing in the world. Well we have them and sell them but you cant have one.Wal-mart is a prime example.. __________________ <Dosn't matter what gun is used as long as it goes bang when the trigger is pulled>

12-30-2008, 09:00 PM	#19
BunnyWabbit Go Jayhawks! Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Jayhawk Country Posts: 5,386	Kroger owns Dillons Grocery stores and Dillons allow you to carry. We have grocery store banks where you walk up to a counter in the grocery store against a wall and they have a no gun sign, but I figure I am standing in the grocery store and as long as I don't put my purse on their counter, I am not "in" their bank. It's a really gray area in regards to the laws about that, but most of the time they do have a security guard there at the banks. Kansas law has a list of places you are not allowed to carry and a bank is one of them. They don't need a sign either, we are supposed to remember all the places we are not allowed. __________________ I try to live life, that in the morning, Satan shudders & says 'Oh crap, she's awake!"

12-30-2008, 09:12 PM	#20
Mooseman684 Super Moderator Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Alaska Wilderness. Unit 13 Posts: 11,316 Images: 2	We can carry in Banks in Alaska...They are Privately owned... __________________ You know you might be facing your doom,when all you get is a click when you're expecting a BOOM!