9x18 or 7.62x25 Tok

iflylow74 · 10-23-2009, 07:42 PM

Need some opinions on these two calibers. I'm looking at getting a C&R pistol for plinking and for a ccw vehicle weapon. I like both the CZ-82 and the Romanian TTC Tokarev from J&G.

My biggest concern is how long ammo will be available in these calibers. Looks like the 7.62x25 ammo is cheaper but it seems like more weapons use the 9x18 ammo.

Which of these two rounds do you think will most likely continue to be easy to find in the near future?

rondog · 10-23-2009, 08:39 PM

I have no idea, but you can always make your own 9x18's out of 9x19 Luger cases, and those will ALWAYS be around.

Jersey Jailer · 10-23-2009, 09:07 PM

Get it iin 7.62, then you can use your PPsH ammo in it ;-) You can also get a 9Mak barrel and have a 2 cal gun. I have also seen them rechambered for 9x19

Cyrano · 10-23-2009, 10:00 PM

I'd go with the 9x18 Makarov round. As rondog says, you can always trim 9x19 brass down to 9x18, and you can always get 9mm bullets.

More to the point, if you go for 7.62x25, the only choice you have is what country's surplus Tokarev you want to buy. But if you opt for 9x18 Makarov, you have the choice of the CZ-82, the Makarov itself from a number of nations, the Hungarian PA-63, and the Polish P-64 and P-83 Wanad pistols, just off the top of my head.

Iron_Colonel · 10-24-2009, 04:00 AM

I would definitely recommend the CZ if you want to carry. The controls are natural AND ambi on it, and it is in double action, the Tok isn't. IMO, a safer gun. If I'm not mistaken, the TTC has to have the added safety as well which is pretty ugly. The 7.62x25 milsurp ammo is corrosive as well. Try J&G, Sportsman's Guide, or Cheaper Than Dirt and see if you can't locate some 9 x 18 Mak. to feed your CZ. Then buy a box of hollow points for carry purposes and shoot the round nose if you can find it. Cyrano also has a good point. J&G is also selling the P64 Maks, and if you can find a Makarov pistol, those are pretty accurate little guns. I have a CZ 82 and a Makarov both in 9 x 18, and have alternate carried each. The think I like more about the Makarov I have, is the rear sights are adjustable. VERY simple design for both. Plus, the CZ is a cinch to clean, as it has polygonal rifling, and you don't have to spend a lot of time trying to get burnt powder residue out of the bore. A bore snake swipe and you're good as new.

iflylow74 · 10-24-2009, 09:31 AM

Thanks guys! I kinda like the size and overall looks of the CZ better as well. Didn't know the Tok wasn't double action. That gives the CZ a big advantage because my wife would be using it sometimes. As for trimming down the 9x18 brass, is that difficult? Just now getting into handloading so I'm still learning.

Edit...

Just looked at the P64...very cool looking pistol...especially for $160!!! Just wish it was C&R eligible....:-(

assaultrecon28 · 10-31-2009, 02:20 PM

id get a tok. just buy a couple thousand rounds for it, it'll run you about 230$ but you wont have to worry about ammo for a long time

SwedeSteve · 11-05-2009, 08:31 AM

Get a case trimmer, and you're in business.

Iron_Colonel · 11-05-2009, 11:02 AM

Case trimmer is all you'd need to resize your 9x19 to 9x18. But the only thing about the ammo is the milsurp 7.62x25 is still pretty darned cheap in the tins as assault mentioned. It is corrosive too. All the 9x8 Mak isn't that I could find. If you're looking for a piece to carry, CZ is the way to go. If you want something you can shoot and shoot and shoot for cheap, then the Tokarev is your best bet. Although the 9x18 Mak ammo isn't as cheap as the 7.62x25, its still not too badly priced. I've seen 9x18 at J&G before, and the Sportsman's Guide. Good luck, pics when you get one! I've got my CZ82 already, just working on one of those Romanian TTC Tok knockoffs. Century Arms is selling the CZs with a black leather holster, 2 mags, and a black leather mag holster too. I missed that deal when they had some nice ones at Classic. I might get another just for the holsters!

RomanianSniper · 11-05-2009, 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iflylow74

Need some opinions on these two calibers. I'm looking at getting a C&R pistol for plinking and for a ccw vehicle weapon. I like both the CZ-82 and the Romanian TTC Tokarev from J&G.

My biggest concern is how long ammo will be available in these calibers. Looks like the 7.62x25 ammo is cheaper but it seems like more weapons use the 9x18 ammo.

Which of these two rounds do you think will most likely continue to be easy to find in the near future?

7.62x25 It Was Rushed Through Importation And Now It Is Stockpiled...

ArkansasHunter · 11-05-2009, 12:15 PM

Hornaday, Federal still maufactures 9x18 and Winchester did sell 9X18. I've heard Winchester though imported from S&B and did'nt S&B go under ?
Plus the mil-surp stuff.
I would spring for the 9X18.

I just went to Federals web site and they have 9x18 and I already know that Hornady has it in custom hollow points.

I just remembered I have a 50 round box of Flocchi and it's accurate in my CZ 82 BUT I noticed it makes a we bit of smoke when you shoot it...A.H

Paper · 11-05-2009, 08:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iflylow74

I like both the CZ-82 and the Romanian TTC Tokarev from J&G.

Get em' both!!

I'm going to shoot my Tok for the first time, tomorrow.. Century has the ammo on sale (corrosive) for $87 for the big cans.

Quote:

AM953A Polish 7.62X25MM (Tokarev) Ball (86gr.) 50’s Mfg Berdan /Corrosive Lead Core
70rd per box 1260rd Case *Cosmetic Cracks on Casings*
Was $109.87 Now $86.87 Case

And AIM has 1000 rounds of Mak ammo for $195 or $230 for FMJ or HP.. AIM 9x18Makarov 9x18Makarov

Get em' both and stock up!!

gandog56 · 11-07-2009, 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paper

Get em' both!!

I'm going to shoot my Tok for the first time, tomorrow..

Be prepared for a lot of peoples heads swinging your way at the range. Mighty impressive boom comes from that smaller gun.

Paper · 11-08-2009, 08:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gandog56

Be prepared for a lot of peoples heads swinging your way at the range. Mighty impressive boom comes from that smaller gun.

The gun functioned perfectly, but nobody paid any attention to me..

Granted, I was the only person at the range, but still..

jimb2 · 11-08-2009, 06:21 PM

I see an awful lot of concern over 7.62x25 ammo running out. If you are a reloader, then you have nothing to worry about. New cases can easily be made from 5.56 Nato cases. Cut them to the proper length, resize them to form the brass then turn the necks to get rid of the excess thickness. While the base is slightly smaller, I haven't had any extraction or ejection problems. Yes, I made a bunch due to the fact that I got tired of searching for an hour on my hands and knees searching for maybe 80% of the empties. You should see the strange looks I get when someone picks up one of these rounds and noticed the 5.56 Nato headstamp! *LOL*

Kaybe · 11-10-2009, 11:10 AM

Paper, Do you have the Romanian Tok? How accurate did it shoot? Where did you get it from? I am thinking about getting one, but not sure yet. THe money is there but can't decide what to do with it. What was the condition like?

Archetype_wyo · 11-10-2009, 12:08 PM

I hate how the CIA website doesn't show the prices. I don't have a CIA dealer around here =(

Paper · 11-10-2009, 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Archetype_wyo

I hate how the CIA website doesn't show the prices. I don't have a CIA dealer around here =(

Become one.. Get your C and R license and sent it to them.. Bingo!!

I did get a Romanian Tok.. I got it from Classic Arms..

Condition was very good, although the barrel does have a little bit of pitting.. Accuracy isn't bad, but nowhere near as good as my CZ82..

Cyrano · 11-10-2009, 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Archetype_wyo

I hate how the CIA website doesn't show the prices. I don't have a CIA dealer around here =(

Well, let's see what I can do for you, since I get their catalog.

Romanian Tokarev:

NRA Excellent, $230
NRA VG, $210
NRA G, $200
NRA Good with cracked grip, $180

Polish Tokarev:

NRA Excellent, $270
NRA VG, $260
NRA G, $250

CZ-52 Czech Tokarev:

NRA Good, $150

Czech CZ-82:

NRA Good, $200

Pronsias · 11-10-2009, 03:19 PM

Also the Yugoslavian TT, which I'm told carries one extra round and has a "real" safety. SOG had it not too long ago.

I will echo and say that you should choose 9x18 for CCW. 7.62x25mm has the potential for overpenetration. However, you should ultimately buy both when you get the cash.

I'm a terribly amateur reloader, but aren't 9x18 bullets significantly larger in diameter than 9x19? Is this a problem for reloading?

10-23-2009, 07:42 PM	#1
iflylow74 Registered User Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Arkansaw Posts: 1,439 Blog Entries: 11	9x18 or 7.62x25 Tok Need some opinions on these two calibers. I'm looking at getting a C&R pistol for plinking and for a ccw vehicle weapon. I like both the CZ-82 and the Romanian TTC Tokarev from J&G. My biggest concern is how long ammo will be available in these calibers. Looks like the 7.62x25 ammo is cheaper but it seems like more weapons use the 9x18 ammo. Which of these two rounds do you think will most likely continue to be easy to find in the near future? __________________ Regnant Populi, Nemo me impune lacessit

10-23-2009, 08:39 PM	#2
rondog Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Parker, CO Posts: 3,296	I have no idea, but you can always make your own 9x18's out of 9x19 Luger cases, and those will ALWAYS be around. __________________ I child-proofed my house, but they still keep getting in!

10-23-2009, 09:07 PM	#3
Jersey Jailer Senior Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: SOUTH Jersey Posts: 669	Get it iin 7.62, then you can use your PPsH ammo in it ;-) You can also get a 9Mak barrel and have a 2 cal gun. I have also seen them rechambered for 9x19 __________________ [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] Austrailian Shepherds are like potato chips... You can't have just one

10-24-2009, 04:00 AM	#5
Iron_Colonel Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Washington St. Posts: 3,281	I would definitely recommend the CZ if you want to carry. The controls are natural AND ambi on it, and it is in double action, the Tok isn't. IMO, a safer gun. If I'm not mistaken, the TTC has to have the added safety as well which is pretty ugly. The 7.62x25 milsurp ammo is corrosive as well. Try J&G, Sportsman's Guide, or Cheaper Than Dirt and see if you can't locate some 9 x 18 Mak. to feed your CZ. Then buy a box of hollow points for carry purposes and shoot the round nose if you can find it. Cyrano also has a good point. J&G is also selling the P64 Maks, and if you can find a Makarov pistol, those are pretty accurate little guns. I have a CZ 82 and a Makarov both in 9 x 18, and have alternate carried each. The think I like more about the Makarov I have, is the rear sights are adjustable. VERY simple design for both. Plus, the CZ is a cinch to clean, as it has polygonal rifling, and you don't have to spend a lot of time trying to get burnt powder residue out of the bore. A bore snake swipe and you're good as new. __________________ Mosin Nagant evangelist on a mission to convert YOU!

10-24-2009, 09:31 AM	#6
iflylow74 Registered User Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Arkansaw Posts: 1,439 Blog Entries: 11	Thanks guys! I kinda like the size and overall looks of the CZ better as well. Didn't know the Tok wasn't double action. That gives the CZ a big advantage because my wife would be using it sometimes. As for trimming down the 9x18 brass, is that difficult? Just now getting into handloading so I'm still learning. Edit... Just looked at the P64...very cool looking pistol...especially for $160!!! Just wish it was C&R eligible....:-( __________________ Regnant Populi, Nemo me impune lacessit Last edited by iflylow74; 10-24-2009 at 09:43 AM.

10-23-2009, 10:00 PM	#4
Cyrano Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: New York Posts: 6,917	I'd go with the 9x18 Makarov round. As rondog says, you can always trim 9x19 brass down to 9x18, and you can always get 9mm bullets. More to the point, if you go for 7.62x25, the only choice you have is what country's surplus Tokarev you want to buy. But if you opt for 9x18 Makarov, you have the choice of the CZ-82, the Makarov itself from a number of nations, the Hungarian PA-63, and the Polish P-64 and P-83 Wanad pistols, just off the top of my head.

10-31-2009, 02:20 PM	#7
assaultrecon28 Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 20	id get a tok. just buy a couple thousand rounds for it, it'll run you about 230$ but you wont have to worry about ammo for a long time

11-05-2009, 08:31 AM	#8
SwedeSteve Suspected Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Anchortown, Alaska Posts: 23,549 Images: 1	Get a case trimmer, and you're in business. __________________ Thank God we don't get as much Government as we pay for! -Will Rogers

11-05-2009, 11:02 AM	#9
Iron_Colonel Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Washington St. Posts: 3,281	Case trimmer is all you'd need to resize your 9x19 to 9x18. But the only thing about the ammo is the milsurp 7.62x25 is still pretty darned cheap in the tins as assault mentioned. It is corrosive too. All the 9x8 Mak isn't that I could find. If you're looking for a piece to carry, CZ is the way to go. If you want something you can shoot and shoot and shoot for cheap, then the Tokarev is your best bet. Although the 9x18 Mak ammo isn't as cheap as the 7.62x25, its still not too badly priced. I've seen 9x18 at J&G before, and the Sportsman's Guide. Good luck, pics when you get one! I've got my CZ82 already, just working on one of those Romanian TTC Tok knockoffs. Century Arms is selling the CZs with a black leather holster, 2 mags, and a black leather mag holster too. I missed that deal when they had some nice ones at Classic. I might get another just for the holsters! __________________ Mosin Nagant evangelist on a mission to convert YOU!

11-05-2009, 12:15 PM	#11
ArkansasHunter Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: South Arkansas. Posts: 17,211	Hornaday, Federal still maufactures 9x18 and Winchester did sell 9X18. I've heard Winchester though imported from S&B and did'nt S&B go under ? Plus the mil-surp stuff. I would spring for the 9X18. I just went to Federals web site and they have 9x18 and I already know that Hornady has it in custom hollow points. I just remembered I have a 50 round box of Flocchi and it's accurate in my CZ 82 BUT I noticed it makes a we bit of smoke when you shoot it...A.H __________________ IN GOD WE TRUST NRA MEMBER Last edited by ArkansasHunter; 11-05-2009 at 12:25 PM.

11-08-2009, 06:21 PM	#15
jimb2 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Ohio Posts: 703	I see an awful lot of concern over 7.62x25 ammo running out. If you are a reloader, then you have nothing to worry about. New cases can easily be made from 5.56 Nato cases. Cut them to the proper length, resize them to form the brass then turn the necks to get rid of the excess thickness. While the base is slightly smaller, I haven't had any extraction or ejection problems. Yes, I made a bunch due to the fact that I got tired of searching for an hour on my hands and knees searching for maybe 80% of the empties. You should see the strange looks I get when someone picks up one of these rounds and noticed the 5.56 Nato headstamp! LOL __________________ Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean that they aren't out to get you!

11-10-2009, 11:10 AM	#16
Kaybe Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Northcentral Ohio Posts: 641	Paper, Do you have the Romanian Tok? How accurate did it shoot? Where did you get it from? I am thinking about getting one, but not sure yet. THe money is there but can't decide what to do with it. What was the condition like? __________________ Some people are alive simply because it is illegal to kill them.

11-10-2009, 12:08 PM	#17
Archetype_wyo Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Buffalo, Wyo Posts: 1,731	I hate how the CIA website doesn't show the prices. I don't have a CIA dealer around here =( __________________ The great object is that every man be armed. Everyone who is able may have a gun. —Patrick Henry

11-10-2009, 03:19 PM	#20
Pronsias Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: NV Posts: 150	Also the Yugoslavian TT, which I'm told carries one extra round and has a "real" safety. SOG had it not too long ago. I will echo and say that you should choose 9x18 for CCW. 7.62x25mm has the potential for overpenetration. However, you should ultimately buy both when you get the cash. I'm a terribly amateur reloader, but aren't 9x18 bullets significantly larger in diameter than 9x19? Is this a problem for reloading?