Exotic (super-fast) ammo for CZ-52

radekaster · 03-02-2004, 07:54 PM

I've been working up a load for the CZ-52 using 46g .224 bullets in a 22/30 sabot. Velocity estimates are around 2000fps. The question I have; would folks be interested if I offered these things for sale? I'm including a picture of the round compared to a 9mm luger.

03-02-2004, 09:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by radekaster
would folks be interested if I offered these things for sale?

but it would be catering to a highly specialized market that is wary of names it doesn't recognize :target:

grizzly · 03-02-2004, 09:52 PM

What kind of accuracy are you getting?

NRAJOE · 03-02-2004, 10:03 PM

Awesome...I would be interested if put out by someone I can trust...I got 5 hungry CZ52's to feed.

radekaster · 03-03-2004, 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by grizzly
What kind of accuracy are you getting?

Not sure yet.
I'll be taking some experimental loads to the range tommorrow, first to chrony and then to test for accuracy. I'll report back.

radekaster · 03-03-2004, 12:44 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by NRAJOE
Awesome...I would be interested if put out by someone I can trust...

Hmm. So how do I cultivate your trust? :-)

Despoiler · 03-03-2004, 01:35 PM

Post pics of your AK-47's, if you don't have an AK-47 your S.O.L.

NRAJOE · 03-03-2004, 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by radekaster
Hmm. So how do I cultivate your trust? :-)

Hmmm. Furst box of ammo free?

BattleRifleG3 · 03-03-2004, 07:51 PM

Hasn't Shaun done something similar?

I think to manufacture ammo professionally you may need some sort of FFL, but I'm not sure.

03-03-2004, 08:43 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by NRAJOE
Hmmm. Furst box of ammo free?

that seems to be a bit much to me..

NRAJOE · 03-03-2004, 10:23 PM

Heres a novel idea LD...try minding your own business sometime...might work out for you....

03-04-2004, 05:58 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by NRAJOE
Heres a novel idea LD...try minding your own business sometime...might work out for you....

BattleRifleG3 · 03-04-2004, 09:05 AM

I think both you guys need an extra helping of good humor.

jarcp · 03-07-2004, 05:00 PM

Battle Rifle is correct, you MUST have an 06 FFL to manufature and sell ammunition. On the same topic, we have created a new round called the .22 Reed Express. It is a 7.62x25 necked down to .22. The test barrels are on the way, and we will begin load development. You'll basically get the same idea of the 22/30 sabots, just with higher velocitys and much better accuracy. The conversion will be a drop in barrell and nothing else. I'll let everyone know when we are ready to start shipping them out.

BattleRifleG3 · 03-07-2004, 06:53 PM

I'd like to see ballistics, but that sounds pretty cool. I could see it competing with the $800 FN-57's 5.7mm round.

Perhaps it could be made to work in 9mm pistols as well. That could really reach a lot of people.

radekaster · 03-08-2004, 12:44 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jarcp
Battle Rifle is correct, you MUST have an 06 FFL to manufature and sell ammunition.

Thanks for pointing that out. And here I was, dumbly, about to commit a felony. Well, I'll just have to GIVE the stuff away.

radekaster · 03-08-2004, 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BattleRifleG3
I'd like to see ballistics, but that sounds pretty cool. I could see it competing with the $800 FN-57's 5.7mm round.

Perhaps it could be made to work in 9mm pistols as well. That could really reach a lot of people.

Yes, FN-57 rounds were the inspiration here.

I'm not sure how a 22 bullet in a 22/35 sabot (if you could find a source) would work in 9mm luger since the 9mm case is so short. By the time you got the required OAL, you'd have very little case capacity for powder.

You can see the beginnings of my experimentation at http://r_aster.home.mindspring.com/f...ld_7_62x25.htm
See the table nearest the bottom of the page, and the associated charge-weight to velocity graph. Until now, I've only had time to build up a load with Bullseye powder. Though I'm getting good velocities (1900 fps) the velocity variance is a little higher than I'd like. I'll be trying with AA#5 and Power Pistol next.

radekaster · 03-08-2004, 12:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jarcp
Battle Rifle is correct, you MUST have an 06 FFL to manufature and sell ammunition. On the same topic, we have created a new round called the .22 Reed Express. It is a 7.62x25 necked down to .22. The test barrels are on the way, and we will begin load development. You'll basically get the same idea of the 22/30 sabots, just with higher velocitys and much better accuracy. The conversion will be a drop in barrell and nothing else. I'll let everyone know when we are ready to start shipping them out.

Please let us know when you have test barrels and reloading dies available. I'm very interested.

BattleRifleG3 · 03-08-2004, 02:59 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by radekaster
Thanks for pointing that out. And here I was, dumbly, about to commit a felony. Well, I'll just have to GIVE the stuff away.

Anyone know the legalities of producing ammo not for financial profit, but in exchange for large quantities of cookies?

radekaster · 03-08-2004, 06:49 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BattleRifleG3
Anyone know the legalities of producing ammo not for financial profit, but in exchange for large quantities of cookies?

Well, 18 U.S.C. 923 (a) says " No person shall engage in the business of ... manufacturing ammunition ... until he has filed an application with and received a license to do so from the Secretary."

The key word being "business", i.e. commercial or mercantile activity engaged in as a means of livelihood. Now, one can argue whether producing small quantities of some commodity for sale is (will be) enough to provide for a means of livelihood, and hence whether 18 U.S.C. 923 (a) explicitly prohibits the manufacture of "hobbyist" quantities of ammunition for resale. Considering that the $30/year FFL-6 licence is cheaper than an argument with a federal judge, I have no doubt as to the pragmatic/practical conclusion.

Note that the definition of money (green, gold, cookies, etc.) is immaterial to the discussion. :-)

But it is clear that "donations" would be exempt from the above. :-)

[Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer, nor do I play one on TV, so my legal advice/analysis should be held in the same regard as that given by your dog]

03-02-2004, 09:52 PM	#3
grizzly Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: PDR of IL Posts: 653	Accuracy What kind of accuracy are you getting? __________________ When white man found this land, Indians were running it. No Taxes... No Debt... Plenty Buffalo... Plenty beaver! Women did most of the work. Medicine Man free! Indian men hunted and fished all the time! White man dumb enough to think he could improve system like that. "The constitutions of most of our States assert that all power is inherent in the people; that... it is their right and duty to be at all times armed." --Thomas Jefferson to John Cartwright, 1824.

03-02-2004, 10:03 PM	#4
NRAJOE Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Toledo,OH Posts: 19,052 Images: 3	Awesome...I would be interested if put out by someone I can trust...I got 5 hungry CZ52's to feed. __________________ U.S. Army 1976-1979 237th Combat Engineers Heilbronn, Germany

03-03-2004, 07:51 PM	#9
BattleRifleG3 Super Moderator Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Western PA Posts: 11,401 Images: 13	Hasn't Shaun done something similar? I think to manufacture ammo professionally you may need some sort of FFL, but I'm not sure. __________________ Trust is earned, not... GIVEN away. - Worf

03-03-2004, 10:23 PM	#11
NRAJOE Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Toledo,OH Posts: 19,052 Images: 3	Heres a novel idea LD...try minding your own business sometime...might work out for you.... __________________ U.S. Army 1976-1979 237th Combat Engineers Heilbronn, Germany

03-04-2004, 09:05 AM	#13
BattleRifleG3 Super Moderator Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Western PA Posts: 11,401 Images: 13	I think both you guys need an extra helping of good humor. __________________ Trust is earned, not... GIVEN away. - Worf

03-03-2004, 01:35 PM	#7
Despoiler Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: The Occupied Territory of California Posts: 2,232	Post pics of your AK-47's, if you don't have an AK-47 your S.O.L.

03-07-2004, 05:00 PM	#14
jarcp Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: OKC, OK Posts: 253	Battle Rifle is correct, you MUST have an 06 FFL to manufature and sell ammunition. On the same topic, we have created a new round called the .22 Reed Express. It is a 7.62x25 necked down to .22. The test barrels are on the way, and we will begin load development. You'll basically get the same idea of the 22/30 sabots, just with higher velocitys and much better accuracy. The conversion will be a drop in barrell and nothing else. I'll let everyone know when we are ready to start shipping them out. __________________ Reed's Ammunition & Research 1209 SW 129th St. Oklahoma City, OK 73170 www.reedsammo.com info@reedsammo.com

03-07-2004, 06:53 PM	#15
BattleRifleG3 Super Moderator Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Western PA Posts: 11,401 Images: 13	I'd like to see ballistics, but that sounds pretty cool. I could see it competing with the $800 FN-57's 5.7mm round. Perhaps it could be made to work in 9mm pistols as well. That could really reach a lot of people. __________________ Trust is earned, not... GIVEN away. - Worf