7.62x25 Tok vs. .45 acp 1911 or other common handgun
Hey all,
I've been browsing around, and have recently been seeing things about a handgun/caliber I haven't heard of before, the 7.62x25 Tokarov (sp?). I've looked up some info on them, but I am curious to know how they compare to more "standard/normal" self defense handguns, like a S&W or Kimber 1911, Glock 30, or a .44 revolver, for example. I list these simply because they are handguns that I have personal experience with. Thanks for any info.
FYI: I am not currently looking to buy one, just looking for info about something I don't know about right now. I may be interested in getting one eventually, as I like to have things that are unique/different from what most people have, but I don't even have my .22lr handgun I want yet, due to life expenses interfering (aka, needing to help my gf buy a car, ).
, when you put it that way, i guess it is an old question... I guess I'm looking more for info/opinions on ownership as a whole. For example, is one more accurate/cheaper to buy/easy to strip/easy to upgrade/cheaper to feed/etc... Not just the ballistics is what I'm trying to say, I guess...
I have a Tokarev and 5 -1911's . The 1911 is my favorite gun but the 7.62x25 is my favorite round. you cant get a bigger bang for the buck. my next project is to convert a 1911 in 38 super to 7.62x25.
I have a Tokarev and 5 -1911's . The 1911 is my favorite gun but the 7.62x25 is my favorite round. you cant get a bigger bang for the buck. my next project is to convert a 1911 in 38 super to 7.62x25.
jimbo, why do you want to reinvent the wheel? Just buy yourself a Model 57 Yugoslav Tokarev! The Model 57's controls are the same as the M1911's. Yes, there are some internal differences, notably the unitized trigger group that is meant to be changed out rather than disassembled and worked on; and the captive recoil spring, of course, which in my opinion is something Saint John Browning should have put in his immortal M1911 -- it would have made the pistol just about perfect; but anyone who has five M1911s will find himself instantly at home with the Model 57.
Spend the difference on what it would cost to do the conversion of an M1911 to take 7.62 Tok on Model 57 magazines. They are not that easy to find, though Wideners often has them; and they are not cheap when you do find them (I'm talking like $50 apiece). They are not compatible with other Tokarev magazines.
To me, the Model 57's M1911 controls make it worth the magazine costs. I think you will feel the same. Don't waste you money reinventing the wheel. Just buy yourself a Yugoslav Tok already!
I have a Yugo M57 Tok and CZ-52 Tok. If you want to play with the 7.62x25 round I would highly recommend getting a CZ-52. It is leaps and bounds above the Yugo M57/ TT33 type Tok's.
Personal defense, I would pick anything else. These are like hand rifles more than handguns.
The Yugo M57 mags are at Wideners now for $31 each.
Why, or what do you mean? I'm not sure I understand the comment...
They are 30 cal bullets at 1700fps+, stronger recoil/kick than most carry guns, large fire ball out the muzzle. Mine reminds me more of a rifle than a handgun. About the only handguns I have with more kick are 44 and 357mag revolvers.
They are 30 cal bullets at 1700fps+, stronger recoil/kick than most carry guns, large fire ball out the muzzle. Mine reminds me more of a rifle than a handgun. About the only handguns I have with more kick are 44 and 357mag revolvers.
Ah, ok. That makes more sense now.
That said, how does it compare to smaller self defense rounds, like the 9 mm and .38 etc? Just curious as the 7.62 isn't that much smaller than those rounds, as far as bullet size goes...
That said, how does it compare to smaller self defense rounds, like the 9 mm and .38 etc? Just curious as the 7.62 isn't that much smaller than those rounds, as far as bullet size goes...
IMO, when you compare them side by side the 7.62 is a fair amount smaller. With 38's we are shooting 157gn and the 7.62 is 90gn. The 9mm is wider and a little heavier at arounf 115gn.
To me, it is too much for personal defense. The Makarov 9x18 or a 380 would be better choices IMO. But it is a lot of fun to shoot in the pit.
i dont think there are any modern handguns chambered for the 7.62x25. it is a fast & powerful cartridge but you have to like surplus pistols to shoot it. I have a Romanian Tork and a couple of CZ 52s. I like CZ better as a shooter but their prices have skyrocketed. you can still get Torks for around $200.
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The 7.62x25mm is a ballistic twin to the .30 Carbine. Neither are considered ideal for self defense due to the amount and decibel level of the muzzle blast and the type of bullets loaded in 99% of factory ammo. The main advantage of the 7.62x25mm is penetration, but that quickly diminishes when hollowpoint bullets are used instead of FMJ's. (A typical load using the 90gr Hornady XTP gives about 12" of penetration.) You might think a 1911 converted to 7.62x25mm would be great but most I read about have feeding issues and reduced magazine capacity.
A Tokarev or CZ52 beats the snot out of any other .30 or .32 caliber offering though. Reeds Ammo has several 7.62x25mm loads available.
If I am thinking I am going to get in a gunfight I will stay home. If I can't stay home I will take a shotgun or rifle depending on what kind of fight I think it will be. If I can't take my shotgun or rifle I want a big heavy slug punching a big hole to do what it can to STOP the bad guy. This would usually be a heavy slug in a .45.
A .357 with decent fast ammo is good too. I use either the buffalo barnes 140s or the double tap 158 gr. gold dots (the copper bullets in the barnes get corrosion and case corrosion in my GP-100 somehow when holstered--the gold dots with the nickel cases do not. Have NO idea why--same thing happened to cor bon DPXs in my charter bulldog and I suspect an electrolytic reaction of some kind).
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I guess a few of my reasons for looking at the toks are for something different and cheaper but good quality, for both the gun and ammo... When one of my friends and I went to the range, and spent over $200 just in ammo for only about an hour or so, kinda turned me off of .45 acp. Any gun I buy, I want to be able to afford to shoot it regularly... That's why I'm getting a .22lr first, so I can have more practice with it, but any larger caliber I get, I would like to shoot it fairly often as well...
Bottom line, unless you load it with HP's it's horrible as a self defense weapon due to it's over penetration. Shooting my Romanian Tok at a 1/2" piece of boiler plate at a 30 degree angle the 4 rounds put some rather sizable dents in it. The rounds are steel core. But I found it's the most accurate of any of my handguns. 100 yards, 1 round, 1 gallon jug of water went bye bye. Today, 1 hand, about 60 yards, put every round into an old tire and that was firing as fast as I could when regaining my sight on the tire. Even if you don't want it for SD, it's just a fun pistol to shoot. Personally, I don't think the recoil is as bad as my Sigma 40. However, it does have an IMPRESSIVE fireball when fired in low light...LOL.
9mm & .45 are for basic and intermediate shooters...
.40S&W is a good intermediate caliber...
Things that can puncture semi-truck doors like the .357Mag/.357SIG/.41/.44 Magnums & 10mm should be left to expert pistoleers, IMHO
7.62x25 seems like it would fit more into the intermediate to expert level, as it has pretty darn good penetration...
but I've not tested one yet to figure out where I'd place it...
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7.62x25 Tok vs. .45 acp 1911 or other common handgun 
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