How Accurate Should One Be With a Snubby?

[Joshua M. Smith]

Hi,

I was doing draw and shoot speed drills yesterday with my Rossi M68.

The targets were simple 8.5x11" sheets of paper on an old tomato stick.

I noticed a couple problems.

Before I go further, I know the revolver's accurate. In SA slow fire, I can make a can dance around at 25yds.

At speed though, it's different.

I was shooting 5-7yds. The drill was to walk away from the target, turn and draw from the pocket, and fire. I would fire between waist and chest level.

Hits were 4/5 with my left hand (dominant hand) and 3/5 with my right hand. Both eyes were open. I had to work a bit harder with my right hand, but this is to be expected.

The real eye opener was when I used my two handed aimed hold. I did no better than when I did the point shooting with my dominant hand!

I think I need some remedial practice, perhaps with wadcutters.

Also, the sights are not what I'm used to - I would consider them vestigial at best. Same as on earlier S&W J-frames. I keep wanting to raise the muzzle so I can see the front blade.

Besides

practice

practice

practice

is there any other snubby shooting tricks? How fast should one be able to shoot one of these things with 158gr standard pressure practice loads, and are there any new grip methods for revolvers out there? I use the "thumbs curled down on the grip, overlapping" hold for revolvers and I have always found that to be a hindrance to my shooting. I much prefer thumbs pointing forward.

I bought this with the idea that it would be a "bad breath backup" handgun, and that's still its main mission. But I'd like to improve to one hole at 5-7yds with aimed fire. I'm sure I can improve my point shooting and indexed fire with a bit more practice (I've not been doing enough of it).

Tips, tricks, etc. are welcome. And, what kind of groups should I be "shooting for?"

Thanks,

Josh <><

[Doctor Larry K]

Josh,
Stand still in front of your target and point the snubby where you think it will hit center mass. Now bring your elbows into your rib cage and squeez your sides with your elbows. Without moving your hands shift your position by shuffling your feet so the revolver is again pointed at center mass.
Fire one shot and see where POI is. Any adjustments shoull be made by moving your feet, not your arms. As an ex-police pistol team member I know this works.
With practice you should be able to empty your revolver in less than 2 seconds.

Doc

[Triggerjerk]

I do not know what kind of "groups" people consider acceptable, but here is what I do...I take an old shirt and fit a piece of cardboard inside it, snugly. I tape a wire shirt hanger to the back top of the cardboard with duct tape. Then I twist the top curved part of the hanger so that it faces backward. Pound a pipe into the ground and hang the new "silhouette" from the hole in the top of the pipe. You now have the upper torso of an aggressor that is the same size as you are. Run your drills with this and see if you are happy.

I have the advantage of having a large sand pit to shoot at. I take one gallon jugs and have them "peek" out at me from behind cover. I take cover behind my car or an old piece of machinery and have at least three enemy shooters pin me down. I have to engage them at 20-40 yards from cover without exposing myself to fire. This is a good learning experience. While most defense shootings will be close and fast, you may have had to shoot like this if you were in the aftermath of Katrina or caught up in the LA Riots of 1992.

[JMax]

Early in my LE life I used a S&W36 as my off duty/backup. Working in the country one should be expected to at least hit a target a bit further away that normal. I had a Lt that bet me that no one could clean our qual course including 25 yd shooting. He spiced it up making me run a couple of hundred yards before shooting to induce stress. A case of lager was on the line and he was most disappointed in having to cough it up. The key is sight picture even with those tiny front and shallow rear. Perfect practice makes perfect.

[ezearln]

Okay Guys how many times do I have to say it shooting fundamentals! Sight alignment, sight picture, grip, stance, trigger control, breath control get all thosde right and shoot shoot shoot shoot! 99% of shooting errors revolve around a lack of or inability to apply shooting fundamentals and thats for a certainty.

[Calvin]

Josh, my answer to your question is be accurate enough to get the job done effectively. Snubs are tougher than any other handgun to master and it's all trigger control. I carry 2 snubs for backup/off-duty myself. The one thing I learned was that speed will eventually follow once you get the accuracy down.
As far as the one-hole theory, I don't believe two bullets in the same hole do much good. I prefer to space them apart on purpose. I can put them on top of each other if I want to-I just don't see the need to. I'm of the school that double trauma is more incapacitating and more realistic.
In short, as long as you hit what you aim for, it's good enough.

[BPierce]

You found that you shot as well with one hand as two. I have found that to be a common problem with little guns. The problem is that there just is not enough grip for two hands. I have taught a number of people to shoot these guns accurately with two hands. One bought me a 5th of Wild Turkey You need to change the way you grip it. Grip the gun with one hand as you would if you were going to shoot one handed. Then grip your wrist with the other hand. You can't use a strong push/pull grip, just support the shooting hand. If you use the isosceles stance, you may want to change to one foot forward.

[ezearln]

Another thing is in DA one must learn to "Stage" the trigger, a technique wherein one squeezes the trigger almost to the let off point a momentary pause and then a slight squeeze to fire, it takes practice but can be mastered in a relatively short period of time.

[stinger102444]

Ok Josh,
Here is my two cents worth. I am a former deputy sheriff also. You said bad breath shooting. To me that means you should be shooting from the hip with no arm extension. That means for you to grip your weapon with your thumb forward and double action shooting only. Further you should shoot two rounds as fast as possible. We called it tack tack. You do not want two bullets in the same hole as the first hit deadens the shocked area and thus making a second hit in that same hole meaningless. Statistics show that most shootings occur in 3 to 6 feet so I suggest that you practice the hip shooting as well as your other practice. Your other practice is satisfactory if all rounds are in a 9" paper plate area. Good luck. Stinger102444

[dave375hh]

I use a worst case senario with the snubby. The BG has the wife held in front of him and he's armed. I want to be able to take an inner eye shot that will hit the brain stem preventing him from taking a shot. This takes a ton of practice and when you've got it down any other shot would be much easier to pull off. No more than 5 yds for this one.