12GA VS. 45 ACP

eddiedeverell · 12-20-2007, 03:07 PM

Hi all I would like to know what your thoughts are of this,
if someone broke into your house, lets say 3 am, and you had a 12GA pump pistol grip shotgun, and a 45 acp, which would you grab and why? Thanks all! I have always wondered that scenirio........

madcratebuilder · 12-20-2007, 03:14 PM

The closest one. Both are great for home defense if you know how to handle it. If someone is coming through the door, you only have a few seconds.

CABLE · 12-20-2007, 03:21 PM

12 ga

SilverRun · 12-20-2007, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by madcratebuilder

The closest one. Both are great for home defense if you know how to handle it. If someone is coming through the door, you only have a few seconds.

I tend to agree - the closest one would be my pick. Now if you are choosing which one to leave as the closest, I would likely go with the .45. I love 12ga shotguns ( I have several), but in tight quarters (arms reach) like you will likely find yourself in your situation, I would go with the pistol - it gives a free hand for a light or to protect yourself with. Also, I think putting a pistol grip on a shotgun severely limits its usefulness. Firing from the hip does not promote accuracy - they old cliche of "just point it in their direction" is total BS. A shotgun must be aimed pretty much like any other gun.

The .45 has the advantage of being concealable. Say you have to answer the door unexpectedly. If it was the girls scouts selling cookies, you would feel kinda stupid holding a 12ga, but no one would even know you had the .45 acp. Just a thought.

My 12 ga shotguns' usually stay in the safe. I leave a Glock 22 (.40 S&W) by the bed. If I need more than that I am in deep do-do!

nathangdad · 12-20-2007, 03:48 PM

It is dark - you cannot turn on the lights as it will give away your position - you may or may not hit with a .45 - you need a shotgun loaded with buckshot (any preferably the largest size shot available) - you need the spread pattern to insure at least some stopping effect of an aggressor.

SilverRun · 12-20-2007, 03:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nathangdad

It is dark - you cannot turn on the lights as it will give away your position - you may or may not hit with a .45 - you need a shotgun loaded with buckshot (any preferably the largest size shot available) - you need the spread pattern to insure at least some stopping effect of an aggressor.

How wide do you think the pattern will spread across like a 15' wide room?

musicmaniac · 12-20-2007, 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nathangdad

It is dark - you cannot turn on the lights as it will give away your position - you may or may not hit with a .45 - you need a shotgun loaded with buckshot (any preferably the largest size shot available) - you need the spread pattern to insure at least some stopping effect of an aggressor.

You must have some HUGE rooms in your house if you think that it is going to spread that much! In a home defense situation you wouldn't be shooting past 10 to 15 feet. Not much room for the shot to spread out very far.

SilverRun · 12-20-2007, 04:02 PM

Yep that was the point of my question. The "spread" (pattern) may make it to like the size of your fist at 15'! Maybe tighter?

musicmaniac · 12-20-2007, 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SilverRun

Yep that was the point of my question. The "spread" (pattern) may make it to like the size of your fist at 15'! Maybe tighter?

That's sounds about right. Your other post wasn't there quite yet when I clicked reply.

samuel · 12-20-2007, 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nathangdad

It is dark - you cannot turn on the lights as it will give away your position - you may or may not hit with a .45 - you need a shotgun loaded with buckshot (any preferably the largest size shot available) - you need the spread pattern to insure at least some stopping effect of an aggressor.

Shot fired from a cylinder bore from a .12ga.shotgun travels 7ft before there is a measurable spread on camera.It is between 2"and 3" at 20ft.You would have to aim carefully at 30ft.At 30 yds you could get 1/4th of the shot on target if you were 1ft from center.Maybe. sam.

eddiedeverell · 12-20-2007, 04:46 PM

Is there any legal problems with using a shotgun in this situation? I mean would the courts look at it in a different way? Or are you aloud to use anything to defend yourself? Iam totally new to the shot gun scene, I just picked up a remington 870 express 18" tactical with pistol grip for a hundred bucks from a friend. What kind of load do you recommend for home protection?

baldeagle48 · 12-20-2007, 04:50 PM

Wow,thats a big hole, think it might take more than one shot? LOL

billy · 12-20-2007, 04:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SilverRun

Yep that was the point of my question. The "spread" (pattern) may make it to like the size of your fist at 15'! Maybe tighter?

a shotgun is not a magical cone of death.

utahvarminter · 12-20-2007, 08:12 PM

Both.

SilverRun · 12-20-2007, 09:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eddiedeverell

Is there any legal problems with using a shotgun in this situation? I mean would the courts look at it in a different way? Or are you aloud to use anything to defend yourself? Iam totally new to the shot gun scene, I just picked up a remington 870 express 18" tactical with pistol grip for a hundred bucks from a friend. What kind of load do you recommend for home protection?

I don't know of any legal problems. I would recommend you replace the pistol grip with a stock on the Rem 87o. There is only one big bolt holding it on. You will here some talk about using bird shot - don't. I would go with 00 buck shot. Here is an excellent write up you need to read. Check out the rest of the site as well - lots of cool stuff there. The Box O' Truth #3 - The Shotgun Meets the Box O' Truth - Page 2

SouthernHunter · 12-20-2007, 10:12 PM

I'd grab my 12 g. I figure when you don't want too possibly risk missing (even if your a good shot your adrenaline can get the best of you + you don't know how they might move and a shotgun will pretty much get anything in the general direction you point it at.)

Also with a 45. you can run the risk it penetrating walls (depending on the individual house) and that could end up possibly hitting a family member, friend, or even a neighbor if you live in an apartment.

For a home defense shotgun I'd recommend getting a tactical light attached on it so you don't have too fumble around with a light while handling the shotgun. Plus having a light pointed in their face will allow you too 100% identify them (making sure its not someone you know) and decrease their ability too see. The only disadvantage I can see with a shotgun is that its long and if your moving around corners a lot it could get in the way.

rockman · 12-20-2007, 10:16 PM

I prefer either depending on the situation. But I do like the idea of a shotgun with twin pistol grips and here's why. Say you have an arm shot by the bad guy or a leg shot too, you take your good arm or leg and put that shotgun back into battery to crank another shot out. Or, you could use the kitchen table or a chair to aide you in getting that shotgun back into battery. Even the protruding corner of a wall, try doing that with a rounded fore arm. I do not agree with the strict use of the largest size of Buckshot either. Bigger is always better. You may live in an apartment complex or in row homes or a condo or a really close by trailer or house where an infant is on the other side of that same wall you have to shoot at to get the bad guy. Do you really want to run the risk of overpenetration and possibly injuring or killing that innocent child? I don't.

Respectfully, Rockman

nathangdad · 12-21-2007, 02:34 AM

The bore diameter of a 12 gauge is greater than a .45 thereby technically providing a greater hit probability even at the end of the barrel. A spread from a shotgun would not be great at 15 ft. but even at that distance it is wider than a single .45 slug. Note in a home you must also consider an encounter from one end of a hallway to another or from a room down a hallway which will definitely exceed 15 ft. imparting a wider spread and greater hit probability to the shotgun. Home encounters are usually events measured in seconds so any advantage counts when semi-auto capability may be negated. I trust my shotgun. Naturally, this is a forum for all to present their thoughts. If yours are different than mine at least we have the opportunity to give the questioner thoughts which might prove helpful in the questioner's firearm determination.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SilverRun

How wide do you think the pattern will spread across like a 15' wide room?

I took the opportunity to answer this thought from another person. Please take a moment to read it as you must consider encounters down a hallway or perhaps from a room down a hallway. It is not so much huge rooms (mine are normal sized by the way) but the fact that you may have an encounter beyond a room sized scenario.

Quote:

Originally Posted by musicmaniac

You must have some HUGE rooms in your house if you think that it is going to spread that much! In a home defense situation you wouldn't be shooting past 10 to 15 feet. Not much room for the shot to spread out very far.

Please check my replies to you and another person in this group of replies.
I have explained by thoughts for the questioner and I do not back down from my recommendation. I do respect the rights and experiences of others to cause them to differ from my advice and congratulate this forum for allowing differing opinions.

irish murphy · 12-21-2007, 02:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SilverRun

How wide do you think the pattern will spread across like a 15' wide room?

Bugger all mate,

CHEF MIKE · 12-21-2007, 08:49 AM

May I suggest this, it is your home that you are protecting so practice, practice, practice! If you clear your house, apt, whatever and try both scenarios you will find the weapon that works best for you. I used to prefer a 12 ga till I found that it comes around the corner before I did. I now use a .45 with tritium night sights and a mag light in the other hand. Helps in balance and draws attention away from me. No weapon will do the job if you don't have a plan.

12-20-2007, 03:07 PM	#1
eddiedeverell Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Aurora, CO. Posts: 241	12GA VS. 45 ACP Hi all I would like to know what your thoughts are of this, if someone broke into your house, lets say 3 am, and you had a 12GA pump pistol grip shotgun, and a 45 acp, which would you grab and why? Thanks all! I have always wondered that scenirio........

12-20-2007, 03:14 PM	#2
madcratebuilder Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Northern Orygun Posts: 586	The closest one. Both are great for home defense if you know how to handle it. If someone is coming through the door, you only have a few seconds. __________________ The difference between a hot dog and a weenie is a fine line.....

12-20-2007, 03:48 PM	#5
nathangdad Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 2,474	shotgun It is dark - you cannot turn on the lights as it will give away your position - you may or may not hit with a .45 - you need a shotgun loaded with buckshot (any preferably the largest size shot available) - you need the spread pattern to insure at least some stopping effect of an aggressor.

12-20-2007, 08:12 PM	#14
utahvarminter Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Utah Posts: 487	Both. __________________ My Photo Album

12-20-2007, 03:21 PM	#3
CABLE Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: GA Posts: 65	12 ga

12-20-2007, 04:02 PM	#8
SilverRun Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: AL Posts: 1,661	Yep that was the point of my question. The "spread" (pattern) may make it to like the size of your fist at 15'! Maybe tighter?

12-20-2007, 04:46 PM	#11
eddiedeverell Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Aurora, CO. Posts: 241	Is there any legal problems with using a shotgun in this situation? I mean would the courts look at it in a different way? Or are you aloud to use anything to defend yourself? Iam totally new to the shot gun scene, I just picked up a remington 870 express 18" tactical with pistol grip for a hundred bucks from a friend. What kind of load do you recommend for home protection?

12-20-2007, 04:50 PM	#12
baldeagle48 Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Alabama Posts: 91	Wow,thats a big hole, think it might take more than one shot? LOL

12-20-2007, 10:12 PM	#16
SouthernHunter Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 19	I'd grab my 12 g. I figure when you don't want too possibly risk missing (even if your a good shot your adrenaline can get the best of you + you don't know how they might move and a shotgun will pretty much get anything in the general direction you point it at.) Also with a 45. you can run the risk it penetrating walls (depending on the individual house) and that could end up possibly hitting a family member, friend, or even a neighbor if you live in an apartment. For a home defense shotgun I'd recommend getting a tactical light attached on it so you don't have too fumble around with a light while handling the shotgun. Plus having a light pointed in their face will allow you too 100% identify them (making sure its not someone you know) and decrease their ability too see. The only disadvantage I can see with a shotgun is that its long and if your moving around corners a lot it could get in the way.

12-20-2007, 10:16 PM	#17
rockman Registered User Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: P.A. Posts: 6	I prefer either depending on the situation. But I do like the idea of a shotgun with twin pistol grips and here's why. Say you have an arm shot by the bad guy or a leg shot too, you take your good arm or leg and put that shotgun back into battery to crank another shot out. Or, you could use the kitchen table or a chair to aide you in getting that shotgun back into battery. Even the protruding corner of a wall, try doing that with a rounded fore arm. I do not agree with the strict use of the largest size of Buckshot either. Bigger is always better. You may live in an apartment complex or in row homes or a condo or a really close by trailer or house where an infant is on the other side of that same wall you have to shoot at to get the bad guy. Do you really want to run the risk of overpenetration and possibly injuring or killing that innocent child? I don't. Respectfully, Rockman

12-21-2007, 08:49 AM	#20
CHEF MIKE Registered User Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: In the Blue Ridge Mts. of VA Posts: 14	May I suggest this, it is your home that you are protecting so practice, practice, practice! If you clear your house, apt, whatever and try both scenarios you will find the weapon that works best for you. I used to prefer a 12 ga till I found that it comes around the corner before I did. I now use a .45 with tritium night sights and a mag light in the other hand. Helps in balance and draws attention away from me. No weapon will do the job if you don't have a plan.