The descriptions and titles are lacking Key information about the products I purchased. This leaves me very skeptical of any other descriptions and titles on the site.
I looked online at many different sites and chose ammunitionstore.com to purchase some once fired 38 special brass and some milsurp 38/357 bullets. I had compared them to several other sites. I buy from many different places depending on availability and deals etc. While comparing, several other sites had listed once fired brass with nickel shells mixed in or separate from. On this site there was no mention of nickel, not in the description or the title.
Title: 38 Special Once Fired Brass Cleaned and Graded 500 Box
Description: Excellent condition once fired commercial brass. Cleaned and graded ready for processing
The first picture attached is from the website. Note, no nickel showing.
I also ordered some 38/357 bullets. The brand was "Military Surplus". What showed up was used damaged pulls. No description stating they are Pulls. The pictures did not show any pull damage however nearly all the bullets have damage. These were misrepresented at best, in the title, description and pictures. The picture shows a box, the title says box, there was no box, they were bulk packaged. While this is a trivial part of the problem, as consumers we rely on the pictures, descriptions and titles to make our choices. When everything presented does not represent the items we are buying, we are being misled.
Title: 38 special / 357 mag 158gr FMJ Projectiles 100pc Box
"Brand: Military Surplus"
The second picture attached is from the website.
The last two pictures I took of a sample bullet. Nearly all look the same. Note the damage above the cannelure (toward the front of the bullet). It is a significant indent that changes the shape of the bullet and nearly cuts all the way through the copper FMJ.
I got a reasonable deal for the bullets in the picture on their site (second picture below). I paid WAY too much for what I received (last two pics).
Buyer Beware !!!
first you bought once fired brass so expectations should be lower than new. And second the "Military Surplus" should have thrown up a red flag when it comes to .38/.357 as the Military has been using .45acp and 9mm for many many many years. The pic you showed of the bullet to me looks like a factory second.
I agree with you that maybe they were a little misleading but like the tittle states "buyer beware"
The military DOES use .38Special/.357Magnum, as a military police round - or did in my USAF and Navy days - late 70's and early 80's. The air police used .38 revolvers, and on my ship later, when the .45's were 'grounded' for a batch of bad barrels, we were temporaily issued the Ruger Servicesix in .38 Special as a stopgap fpr security onboard.
Still, those pulled bullets would PO me too. I pulled a bunch of milsurp rifle bullets with diagonal cutter pliers and did far less damage!
You may be SOL and just have to use these for close-up practice. Then buy elsewhere. Sometimes these 'deals' really aren't.....
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Your complaint about the brass is not clear. I infer from your narrative that you received nickled cases. Were they otherwise substandard?
I also consider nickled cases less desirable than brass, but not everyone does.
DocAitch
Your complaint about the brass is not clear. I infer from your narrative that you received nickled cases. Were they otherwise substandard?
I also consider nickled cases less desirable than brass, but not everyone does.
DocAitch
They are not "substandard" other than they are not brass. Every place else I buy or have bought from states if they contain nickel cases. Several of them separate out the nickel cases. There was no mention of nickel cases on the site, the pictures show only brass, the title and description indicate brass. One would expect to get brass. It seems they conveniently left out key wording to enhance their ability to sell.
IMO, withholding important information about an item is the same as lying about it.
If I put an old rifle up for sale with pictures and wrote in the description "the stock has no dings or dents". Then took a picture of the right and left sides of the butt stock and you bought the rifle based on the pictures and description. Then I shipped it to you and when you opened the box the first thing you saw was right down the bottom center of the butt stock it was cracked nearly in half. Well that's how I felt when I open the box and found the sub-par bullets and nickel cases. It just isn't what I bought and paid for in good faith.
Reminds me of when ammobrasstrader was up and running. In my descriptions of cases I wanted to trade I always specified this number of brass, this number of nickel plated to to be honest. If I was feeling really frisky I would say this many this brand, that many that brand. Otherwise I just said mixed.
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What was the response from the company you bought this merchandise from sir? I'm assuming you have contacted them and voiced these same complaints to them since that is the only place we consumers can ever get a problem resolved in most instances.
What was the response from the company you bought this merchandise from sir? I'm assuming you have contacted them and voiced these same complaints to them since that is the only place we consumers can ever get a problem resolved in most instances.
I am still waiting for a reply but really I don't care what they say. There is nothing they can do to turn back time and not misrepresent the items to me.
Of the 1000 38 special cases I purchased, I will load and shoot 950 of them. The nickel ones will sit or get thrown out. I will shoot the bullets as well. What I won't do is ever trust another description on their website. A refund, a return, a credit, replacement cases, new bullets ... none of that will change how I feel about what has already happened.
I assume you used a credit card to make the purchase. If you don't get quick satisfaction from the seller, contact the card company. They are usually very good about misrepresented products. I've had a few problems over the years, and my card issuer grants me almost immediate credit.
If you didn't use a credit card, shame on you. Learn from this. I hope you didn't use a debit card-- that money is gone forever. Never use a debit card for online purchases.
FInd another handloader to give or trade the nickel cases to. No sense trashing perfectly good cases just because you don't like the color. Myself, I like the nickel cases. Don't get cruddy looking like brass will after some time.
what is bad about nickel plated brass? I have used them mixed in with plain brass for years and never noticed anything different with them other than the color. I would be pissed about the deformed bullets though.
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I assume you used a credit card to make the purchase. If you don't get quick satisfaction from the seller, contact the card company. They are usually very good about misrepresented products. I've had a few problems over the years, and my card issuer grants me almost immediate credit.
If you didn't use a credit card, shame on you. Learn from this. I hope you didn't use a debit card-- that money is gone forever. Never use a debit card for online purchases.
Yes I used a credit card and no I am not going to contact them. I will use the cases, I will shoot the bullets, I am not looking for a free ride. I more than likely would have been a repete customer. I shoot a lot and buy a lot but not from them ever again.
what is bad about nickel plated brass? I have used them mixed in with plain brass for years and never noticed anything different with them other than the color. I would be pissed about the deformed bullets though.
The general concensus is that nickel cases have a shorter reloading life span.
Some people like them because they feel they are more resistant to corrosion of the case if left in a leather belt or such for prolonged periods. Some say the nickel plating makes the brass more brittle. I don't like them because the plating has flaked off some of them after several reloads and I think the resulting case is likely to hold small bits of crud and scratch my dies.
I do, however have a supply of nickel .357 brass. I use it for loads for my .357 lever gun which are too hot for handgun shooting. I never load the nickel cases in the revolvers, but will put brass ones in the Marlin from time to time.
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They want the bullets back. I had no intention of sending them back but after a second look, they are such crap they can have them back. Of course they don't understand it? ... but whats not to understand?
I am going to send them back the nickel cases as well.
Something else I didn't mention before was the shipping. The cases were in bags and the 12 - 100 packs of bullet were all around it. I notices some potential damage from the packaging. There were a few cases that had the mouths ovaled. Not sure if it happened in shipping but I am sure the packing didn't help.
I still don't feel like the descriptions are accurate enough. I don't see how the damaged bullets could be so easily missed. I didn't have the box open for a minute or two and was disappointed at the quality.
"Ovaled" cases are no problem - the sizer will round them back out. Even hefty mouth dents can be brought out enough with a pointed rifle cartridge or round tool so the sizer will work.
If the company sees no problem with those bullets, they are both blind and stupid. I'd never order from them!
__________________ If you actually passed third grade English, let it show!
Adult Literacy is your friend.
I've been reloading for over 30 years. I don't have, and have never needed a Sizer. That said, I don't roll my own bullets either. Am I assuming right you make your own cast?
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People think I'm paranoid because I own guns. If I own guns, what do I have to be paranoid about?
They are not "substandard" other than they are not brass. Every place else I buy or have bought from states if they contain nickel cases. Several of them separate out the nickel cases. There was no mention of nickel cases on the site, the pictures show only brass, the title and description indicate brass. One would expect to get brass. It seems they conveniently left out key wording to enhance their ability to sell.
I guess I don't understand either. The photos look like you have all brass cases and no nickel plated. Maybe that's just the way the pics come through.
But no matter. If you "didn't pay a lot for your muffler" and the cases are sound then I don't see any reason not to use them.
Even the bullets -although disappointing - might just shoot better than you would expect. I would check the bullet diameters before I loaded any - they have likely expanded somewhat.
But now you know, and I thank you for passing on that information about that supplier. I too buy a fair amount of supplies online and I don't always find reviews about the seller, so info like this is helpful.
I guess I don't understand either. The photos look like you have all brass cases and no nickel plated. Maybe that's just the way the pics come through.
But no matter. If you "didn't pay a lot for your muffler" and the cases are sound then I don't see any reason not to use them.
Even the bullets -although disappointing - might just shoot better than you would expect. I would check the bullet diameters before I loaded any - they have likely expanded somewhat.
But now you know, and I thank you for passing on that information about that supplier. I too buy a fair amount of supplies online and I don't always find reviews about the seller, so info like this is helpful.
The photo of the all brass cases is the photo off the website. The fact there are no nickel cases is exactly the point.
An update. I sent the bullets back and they issued a refund. I also sent the nickel cases back and they issued a refund.
I am glad to have the money back and not the bullets however I still feel their descriptions and photos are misleading enough to prevent me from ordering from them in the future.
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Teach
