bear rifle - Page 2

twisterx44 · 04-29-2008, 07:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Windwalker

Stalebiscuit, I have read a lot of your posts and would like to continue to do that, so if you decide to go hunt Griz with your CETME please take someone along who is a cool steady shot and carries a 45-70 or a 375 H&H.

lmao yeah I don't think it would work out too well.

Brother Bob · 04-29-2008, 08:40 PM

Bears can be hard to bring down. I'd feel safe with a .30-06 on most black bears. Grizzlies require more oomph. I'd start at the .300 mags and work up from there. The big brownies and polar bears require all your shoulder can handle! .338 would be the minimum. I'd opt for a .375 H&H. Bear in mind that a bear can kill you with one swipe of a paw. With this in mind, that raises the bar on caliber selection.

tippmann7 · 04-29-2008, 09:47 PM

i heard a .338 has around the same amount of recoil as a 12gauge,is this true

Mooseman684 · 04-29-2008, 10:12 PM

.300 Win Mag is the Best all around...Whereas the .338 kicks like a mule...
I can shoot farther than my buddy and his .338....LOL
.308 is IMHO a bit light for Big Bears and Moose...
Rich

twisterx44 · 04-29-2008, 10:27 PM

I've got your solution. 700 Nitro Express. Trust me, It will take down anything you come across. Trees included

YouTube - .577 T-Rex go BOOM

tbonecpk · 04-30-2008, 01:19 AM

eh eheheheheh now here's a gun to go bear huntin with lol

MySpace

but in all seriousness I would agree with the .300WM

AKHunter · 04-30-2008, 11:46 AM

YouTube - .577 T-Rex go BOOM

Ehh. no thanks. None of those shooters could even hang on to the rifle after firing it. That was entertaining to watch though

.

With a recoil that savage you had better hit your mark if your butt is on the line. If you miss, your lunch, cause theres no follow up shot if your rifle is the dirt.

andrew cochran · 04-30-2008, 11:56 AM

Honestly I wouldn't want to shoot a rifle like that. Maybe when I was younger.
.308 will work for black bears. But It is a little bit light for grizzle or moose.

338RemUltraMag · 04-30-2008, 02:13 PM

Hey the 338 Rem Ultra Mag is what I use and it doesn't kick like a mule, the recoil is long and gradual not sharp and all at once like a 243, and this is because of the 110 gr powder charge cannot be burnt all at once so it really kicks like a 30-06 with a 180 gr bullet, mine is in the rem 700 XCR 26" stainless barrel, will cut holes at 150 yards, and the 338 rem ultra mag has 5K ft lbs of energy at the muzzle, and if you look at the rem web site they have a ballistics calculator compare it with 250 gr bullets to a 25-06 with 100 gr bullets and you will find that the 338 shoots as flat as the 25, I had a chance to take a elk at 475 yards with it, cant say enough about it

samuel · 04-30-2008, 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 338RemUltraMag

Hey the 338 Rem Ultra Mag is what I use and it doesn't kick like a mule, the recoil is long and gradual not sharp and all at once like a 243, and this is because of the 110 gr powder charge cannot be burnt all at once so it really kicks like a 30-06 with a 180 gr bullet, mine is in the rem 700 XCR 26" stainless barrel, will cut holes at 150 yards, and the 338 rem ultra mag has 5K ft lbs of energy at the muzzle, and if you look at the rem web site they have a ballistics calculator compare it with 250 gr bullets to a 25-06 with 100 gr bullets and you will find that the 338 shoots as flat as the 25, I had a chance to take a elk at 475 yards with it, cant say enough about it

I got no dog in this fight,but I'll bet Mooseman has shot more .338win and ultra,s than you have seen.Your tale about the recoil being slow and easy because the powder cant be burnt that fast is wierd to say the least.Virtually all cartridges burn all of the powder before the bullet starts down the bore.This can be verified in any article on internal ballistics. sam.

Midas · 04-30-2008, 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 338RemUltraMag

Hey the 338 Rem Ultra Mag is what I use and it doesn't kick like a mule, the recoil is long and gradual not sharp and all at once like a 243, and this is because of the 110 gr powder charge cannot be burnt all at once so it really kicks like a 30-06 with a 180 gr bullet, mine is in the rem 700 XCR 26" stainless barrel, will cut holes at 150 yards, and the 338 rem ultra mag has 5K ft lbs of energy at the muzzle, and if you look at the rem web site they have a ballistics calculator compare it with 250 gr bullets to a 25-06 with 100 gr bullets and you will find that the 338 shoots as flat as the 25, I had a chance to take a elk at 475 yards with it, cant say enough about it

How much of this is true, has yet to be determined, sounds like a lot of hogwash to me.

Brother Bob · 04-30-2008, 09:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Midas

How much of this is true, has yet to be determined, sounds like a lot of hogwash to me.

I'm glad someone else called "B.S." before I did. LOL!

andrew cochran · 05-01-2008, 09:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brother Bob

I'm glad someone else called "B.S." before I did. LOL!

Yep!

338RemUltraMag · 05-01-2008, 10:30 AM

i did not say that the powder is being burnt at the end of the barrel but it does take extra time to burn 110 gr of powder than 50 gr of powder (for example). it may only be an extra 5 milliseconds but there is extra time involved I own a 338 RUM and it does not kick like a mule, the recoil is spread on a longer time frame than any 06 based case. nor did I say that it didn't kick but when you shoot a 243 then the 338 there is a noticable difference. The 243 has a sharper kick to it and the 338 is a longer shove the rifle also came with a R3 recoil pad installed and I am sure this helps a great deal. as far as the ballistics it is a 100 gr 243 and a 120 gr 25-06 they shoot the same and the 338 pushes a 250 gr pill. And as far as shooting an elk at 475 yds that is true but I don't think that is where the BS comes into play... and how many of you people that are calling BS have actually shot a 338 RUM??? B/C samuel is relying on 3rd party info, my experience with the 338 has been nothing but pleasent and recoil is not bad at all (to me) and I don't have fancy recoil testers other than my shoulder and it definately is a longer shove, nor can I scientiffically state the absolute amount of time it takes to burn powder but i know the more powder is burnt at one time from a single ignition point it will take longer to burn, I didn't say it would takes slow motion time but definately more time... Not trying to start a fight but I will defend my self

Remington.com - Products - Ammunition - Ballistics

here is some proof.......

Lng Rng · 05-01-2008, 04:22 PM

Well, I shoot a 340 WBY, which is pretty much the ballistic equal to the 338 RUM. It kicks in quite the same way that all my other rifles kick, just more of it. The primers for these rounds are quite explosive, and you burn a great deal of that charge upon ignition. The recoil isn't horrible, but you do have to limit the number of rounds you fire at a single range session, and be mindful that you don't creep up on the scope too much.

Ho are you fitting 110grs of powder in the RUM? Are you pounding your bullets in witha slege hammer after you drop the charge in?

Midas · 05-01-2008, 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 338RemUltraMag

i did not say that the powder is being burnt at the end of the barrel but it does take extra time to burn 110 gr of powder than 50 gr of powder (for example). it may only be an extra 5 milliseconds but there is extra time involved I own a 338 RUM and it does not kick like a mule, the recoil is spread on a longer time frame than any 06 based case. nor did I say that it didn't kick but when you shoot a 243 then the 338 there is a noticable difference. The 243 has a sharper kick to it and the 338 is a longer shove the rifle also came with a R3 recoil pad installed and I am sure this helps a great deal. as far as the ballistics it is a 100 gr 243 and a 120 gr 25-06 they shoot the same and the 338 pushes a 250 gr pill. And as far as shooting an elk at 475 yds that is true but I don't think that is where the BS comes into play... and how many of you people that are calling BS have actually shot a 338 RUM??? B/C samuel is relying on 3rd party info, my experience with the 338 has been nothing but pleasent and recoil is not bad at all (to me) and I don't have fancy recoil testers other than my shoulder and it definately is a longer shove, nor can I scientiffically state the absolute amount of time it takes to burn powder but i know the more powder is burnt at one time from a single ignition point it will take longer to burn, I didn't say it would takes slow motion time but definately more time... Not trying to start a fight but I will defend my self

Remington.com - Products - Ammunition - Ballistics

here is some proof.......

I have shot just about every flavor of .338 there is, from .338-06, to .338 Lupua, and I find what you are saying, to be absolutely false, when you fire heavy bullets, at high velocity, there is a substantial amount of recoil involved. As for killing an elk at 475 yards, that remains debatable, but mostly doubtful

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lng Rng

Ho are you fitting 110grs of powder in the RUM? Are you pounding your bullets in witha slege hammer after you drop the charge in?

I think it's quite obvious that Mr. 338 may be speaking beyond his realm of knowledge

338RemUltraMag · 05-01-2008, 05:07 PM

I am almost certian that in the hornady handbook there is a charge listed with 110 gr of powder it is 106% case capacity, yeah i know there can't be over 100% but I am almost 100 percent positive, because the book is not at my house but at my reloading room at my grandfathers. And I have never tried said load so I do not know how to fit the powder in the case. I never said the 338 RUM is a light kicker not once did I type those words, but the gun I shoot feels more like a long shove not an abrupt hit, possibly because of the R3 recoil pad on it? I find the recoil to be fatigueing but not painful in any way, and I have no proof of distance for the elk just my word... but apparently you people think that I come on this forum and intentionally type BS and try to ruin my name... well for those of you that do, fu(k off. And Midas there are many things I have yet to learn but my knowledge of the guns I own is more than most people. I don't come on this site to stir the pot, I am just relaying my experience to everyone else and obviously my experience has differed from yours.

Lng Rng · 05-01-2008, 05:39 PM

In my book, I see loads for the 338RUM 180gr bullet with 105-106% case capacity, and they run around 101-102grs, and I can't see the case accepting much more powder than that. Although this isn't a Hornady book, I would think 110 might be a touch strong, but I could be wrong.

You can compress some loads to over 100% capacity, you just have to watch your book closley, and keep a cautious eye out for dangerous pressures, ect...

338RemUltraMag · 05-01-2008, 05:46 PM

it may be 100 something i though it was 110 wish i had my book, but i am 100% sure it said 106% capacity and I know it was with a light bullet, and the pressure is the reason i would never go over case cap.

samuel · 05-01-2008, 06:17 PM

The largest load I find in the Hodgdon manual for a 160gr bullet is H1000-or H 4831 both compressed is 102gr.For a 250gr bullet the largest is retumbo-101gr and 98gr-compressed of H1000.As to 3rd party info,that gave me the best laugh I have had in a while.You say I am using 3rd party info and turn around and state that you have never used the load you stated but you are sure you read it somewhere.If I am reading info I state that and also know where I read it because it is right in front of me.I dont believe you were intentionally lying so much as repeating gunshop talk.I picked up on it because the .338,s are kind of a favorite of mine,even tho the .300rum beats the .338 at 300yds and beyond and as Mooseman says,the .300win.mag is all you need.Come to think of it,every cal. I can think of from .17 to .600nitro is kind of my favorite. sam.

04-29-2008, 08:40 PM	#22
Brother Bob The Mayor Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Olive Branch, MS. Posts: 2,695 Blog Entries: 3	Bears can be hard to bring down. I'd feel safe with a .30-06 on most black bears. Grizzlies require more oomph. I'd start at the .300 mags and work up from there. The big brownies and polar bears require all your shoulder can handle! .338 would be the minimum. I'd opt for a .375 H&H. Bear in mind that a bear can kill you with one swipe of a paw. With this in mind, that raises the bar on caliber selection. __________________ The Most Expensive Commodity In This Country Is Ignorance!

04-29-2008, 09:47 PM	#23
tippmann7 Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Attica, Ohio Posts: 865	i heard a .338 has around the same amount of recoil as a 12gauge,is this true __________________ energizer bunny arrested, charged with battery

04-29-2008, 10:12 PM	#24
Mooseman684 Super Moderator Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Alaska Wilderness Posts: 9,742 Images: 2	.300 Win Mag is the Best all around...Whereas the .338 kicks like a mule... I can shoot farther than my buddy and his .338....LOL .308 is IMHO a bit light for Big Bears and Moose... Rich __________________ You know you might be facing your doom,when all you get is a click when you're expecting a BOOM!

04-30-2008, 11:56 AM	#28
andrew cochran Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Little town in ARKANSAW! Posts: 2,183	Honestly I wouldn't want to shoot a rifle like that. Maybe when I was younger. .308 will work for black bears. But It is a little bit light for grizzle or moose. __________________ If you don't have anything good to say... Don't say it!

05-01-2008, 10:30 AM	#34
338RemUltraMag Banned Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Cumberland, MD USA Posts: 199	i did not say that the powder is being burnt at the end of the barrel but it does take extra time to burn 110 gr of powder than 50 gr of powder (for example). it may only be an extra 5 milliseconds but there is extra time involved I own a 338 RUM and it does not kick like a mule, the recoil is spread on a longer time frame than any 06 based case. nor did I say that it didn't kick but when you shoot a 243 then the 338 there is a noticable difference. The 243 has a sharper kick to it and the 338 is a longer shove the rifle also came with a R3 recoil pad installed and I am sure this helps a great deal. as far as the ballistics it is a 100 gr 243 and a 120 gr 25-06 they shoot the same and the 338 pushes a 250 gr pill. And as far as shooting an elk at 475 yds that is true but I don't think that is where the BS comes into play... and how many of you people that are calling BS have actually shot a 338 RUM??? B/C samuel is relying on 3rd party info, my experience with the 338 has been nothing but pleasent and recoil is not bad at all (to me) and I don't have fancy recoil testers other than my shoulder and it definately is a longer shove, nor can I scientiffically state the absolute amount of time it takes to burn powder but i know the more powder is burnt at one time from a single ignition point it will take longer to burn, I didn't say it would takes slow motion time but definately more time... Not trying to start a fight but I will defend my self Remington.com - Products - Ammunition - Ballistics here is some proof....... Last edited by 338RemUltraMag; 05-01-2008 at 10:48 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

04-30-2008, 02:13 PM	#29
338RemUltraMag Banned Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Cumberland, MD USA Posts: 199	Hey the 338 Rem Ultra Mag is what I use and it doesn't kick like a mule, the recoil is long and gradual not sharp and all at once like a 243, and this is because of the 110 gr powder charge cannot be burnt all at once so it really kicks like a 30-06 with a 180 gr bullet, mine is in the rem 700 XCR 26" stainless barrel, will cut holes at 150 yards, and the 338 rem ultra mag has 5K ft lbs of energy at the muzzle, and if you look at the rem web site they have a ballistics calculator compare it with 250 gr bullets to a 25-06 with 100 gr bullets and you will find that the 338 shoots as flat as the 25, I had a chance to take a elk at 475 yards with it, cant say enough about it

05-01-2008, 04:22 PM	#35
Lng Rng Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Minnesota Posts: 944	Well, I shoot a 340 WBY, which is pretty much the ballistic equal to the 338 RUM. It kicks in quite the same way that all my other rifles kick, just more of it. The primers for these rounds are quite explosive, and you burn a great deal of that charge upon ignition. The recoil isn't horrible, but you do have to limit the number of rounds you fire at a single range session, and be mindful that you don't creep up on the scope too much. Ho are you fitting 110grs of powder in the RUM? Are you pounding your bullets in witha slege hammer after you drop the charge in?

05-01-2008, 05:07 PM	#37
338RemUltraMag Banned Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Cumberland, MD USA Posts: 199	I am almost certian that in the hornady handbook there is a charge listed with 110 gr of powder it is 106% case capacity, yeah i know there can't be over 100% but I am almost 100 percent positive, because the book is not at my house but at my reloading room at my grandfathers. And I have never tried said load so I do not know how to fit the powder in the case. I never said the 338 RUM is a light kicker not once did I type those words, but the gun I shoot feels more like a long shove not an abrupt hit, possibly because of the R3 recoil pad on it? I find the recoil to be fatigueing but not painful in any way, and I have no proof of distance for the elk just my word... but apparently you people think that I come on this forum and intentionally type BS and try to ruin my name... well for those of you that do, fu(k off. And Midas there are many things I have yet to learn but my knowledge of the guns I own is more than most people. I don't come on this site to stir the pot, I am just relaying my experience to everyone else and obviously my experience has differed from yours.

05-01-2008, 05:39 PM	#38
Lng Rng Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Minnesota Posts: 944	In my book, I see loads for the 338RUM 180gr bullet with 105-106% case capacity, and they run around 101-102grs, and I can't see the case accepting much more powder than that. Although this isn't a Hornady book, I would think 110 might be a touch strong, but I could be wrong. You can compress some loads to over 100% capacity, you just have to watch your book closley, and keep a cautious eye out for dangerous pressures, ect...

05-01-2008, 05:46 PM	#39
338RemUltraMag Banned Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Cumberland, MD USA Posts: 199	it may be 100 something i though it was 110 wish i had my book, but i am 100% sure it said 106% capacity and I know it was with a light bullet, and the pressure is the reason i would never go over case cap.

05-01-2008, 06:17 PM	#40
samuel Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 5,087	The largest load I find in the Hodgdon manual for a 160gr bullet is H1000-or H 4831 both compressed is 102gr.For a 250gr bullet the largest is retumbo-101gr and 98gr-compressed of H1000.As to 3rd party info,that gave me the best laugh I have had in a while.You say I am using 3rd party info and turn around and state that you have never used the load you stated but you are sure you read it somewhere.If I am reading info I state that and also know where I read it because it is right in front of me.I dont believe you were intentionally lying so much as repeating gunshop talk.I picked up on it because the .338,s are kind of a favorite of mine,even tho the .300rum beats the .338 at 300yds and beyond and as Mooseman says,the .300win.mag is all you need.Come to think of it,every cal. I can think of from .17 to .600nitro is kind of my favorite. sam.