Anyone have good info on hot loads for the .264 win mag?

City Hunter · 12-09-2007, 02:56 AM

I'm going to be getting into reloading as I've just about shot up all my good old .264 ammunition that my old man colleceted back in the day.

I'm looking for some good reloading data for making some hot rounds for my rifle. I'm shooting a ruger m77 witht he 26inch barrel. It isnt the fanciest .264 ever made but it shoots damn accurate.

These factory loads now, all 2 or so of them are just crap. 140g core lokt andthe junk winchester is selling. They are nowhere near the power they should be. I'm assuming it's for insurance reason on older guns.

As for bullets, I'd like to load some 100g, 127ish, and some 140 for hunting. deer/elk

Thanks for your time. This is my first post so please be gental

nathangdad · 12-09-2007, 05:54 AM

This round already is so overbore and generates so much heat and metal erosion it is one of those rounds that barely hangs on in the marketplace.
If you check some older gun magazines you will read stories about barrel burnout. It is totally
counterproductive to get anything more out of this gun. I do recall a magazine story of total barrel
accuracy loss at 900 rounds with the factory load.

billy · 12-09-2007, 06:01 AM

hi C.H.
i reload but i dont make hot loads for anything i own.
maybe you should get a couple of loading manuals and ignore the safety warnings in them.

ok ....really you should get some manuals.
but here are some from my books

you can use photoshop or whatever you have to blow these up and make them easier to read.

i didnt feel like typing all that out.

rfc357 · 12-09-2007, 06:50 AM

You will probably achieve much better performance from handloads than from factory ammunition. The .264 cartridge is on life support. The ammunition companies don't sell much of it, so they don't put much effort into load development. .264 ammunition is loaded light to prolong barrel life, not because of "old guns." The .264 is not very old as cartridges go, and there have never been any "weak" rifles for it.

Powders that give the highest velocities usually are the most efficient for any cartridge. Note I did not say that you should try to achive the highest velocities! In a cartridge like the .264, going for the hottest load is a sure recipe for a quickly burned-out barrel. A couple of grains under max will probably give you the best accuracy.

The light bullets available in 6.5mm make any such cartridge marginal for elk, in my opinion. You have to place the bullet exactly right to achieve a one-shot kill. Of course, that is a good thing to do with any cartridge, but a bigger bullet gives you more margin for error. The .264 can be very accurate, and this is an advantage. Use the heaviest bullet you can find for elk.

At any rate, once you start handloading you will shoot a lot more. Your barrel may go south before you know it. (Hornady says they burned out several barrels developing load data for the .264! Avoid rapid fire.) Re-barelling is not a big deal, and when you do it you can consider another cartridge.

Have fun and be careful!

billy · 12-09-2007, 06:53 AM

i wish people would just scan their manuals when i ask for load recipes!
it eliminates typo's!

samuel · 12-09-2007, 08:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nathangdad

This round already is so overbore and generates so much heat and metal erosion it is one of those rounds that barely hangs on in the marketplace.
If you check some older gun magazines you will read stories about barrel burnout. It is totally
counterproductive to get anything more out of this gun. I do recall a magazine story of total barrel
accuracy loss at 900 rounds with the factory load.

Overheating the barrel causes barrel erosion.Not hot loads.Billy posted loads from load books.Using SAAMI guidelines it is fun to utilise powder meant for certain bullets and barrels and get every ft-lb,fps, you can out of this casing.I advise once fired,neck resized cases for hot loads.They seat on the shoulder instead of the belt for better accuracy.It is a high capacity casing and you can get lots of slow burning powder in for more fps at lower working pressures. sam.

rfc357 · 12-09-2007, 11:06 AM

Samuel, you are correct. However, hot loads exacerbate the situation by generating more heat, especially if you do not allow the barrel to cool between shots. Hunting rifles are not intended to heat up. One of the reasons target rifles have heavy barrels is to mitigate the heat generated by rapid fire strings.

City Hunter · 12-10-2007, 04:30 AM

Thanks for the replies guys. I've read a lot on the .264 over the years and a lot of the barrel burn out I've seen in articles has been said to be more of a nit picking issue. Lets face it the .264 isnt the only magnum that will burn a barrel out. I was browsing a alaska game forum the other day and ran accross a article on the .264 and there were a few there who said there was no issues with their older guns burning barrels out. I've put quite a few rounds in my rifle over the years and have never had any issues with accuracy. I have a 3x9 leupold and it's been one of those guns I take out every year and it shoots what I aim at every time with no issues. It's become my favorite caliber right next to my 300 weatherby.

As for me, I rarely shoot more than 4 shots in succession before I put the gun down and play with another gun for a while. It costs a ton fo moeny to shoot these when you buy your ammunition.

By hot I mean, better than the few crappy options we have out now, which are toned down. I just want the most out of my round.

And yeah I do need to buy some loading books. A buddy of mine has got me going on it, and im all out of my old .264 ammunition that was made in the early 80s. So right now there really isn't anything to buy that will meet the power it was intended for.

samuel · 12-10-2007, 08:50 AM

I advise getting the load books and concentrating on the slower burn rate powders which can give equal to or more fps at lower pressures and keep the barrel cooler.The point in mind being,I have a 6.5 Gibbs which is a wildcat made by a twostep process of running .270win.cases in the Gibbs die and then fireforming with light loads.For a finished product I was using IMR 4350 to IMR 4895 and running 3200fps with a 140gr bullet.The cases lasted 3 loads.I switched to rel22 and H1000 compressed loads and went to 3400fps+ at the same or lower pressure and the cases lasted for 5 loads.This is a hot wildcat but originally the .264 was too.I just wanted to dimonstrate how you could use a slower burn rate powder to get more fps at lower pressure and lower heat.Before I could only fire 3 shots before cooling.After I could fire 5.This slower burn rate can only be used in longer barrels like yours and you may find powders ranging in the IMR4350toIMR4831.rl 19 and such will work.I have a 29.5" bbl and can burn real slow powders.Also I have more powder capacity with ff cases than you do.I am not trying to compare the two.Just saying heat control can be helped with a little research. sam.

City Hunter · 12-11-2007, 01:50 AM

great post man, thats some fantastic info. I'll definately be looking into that this week.

samuel · 12-11-2007, 10:41 AM

RFC357:While i dont advocate using a .264win for elk,at the same time if my 6.5 Gibbs can make a oneshot kill on a herd bull at 850yds+,(I never shot any game at that range,the experts did) surely the .264win could be used at much shorter ranges.The 6.5mm is inherently deep penetrating because of the heavy bullet weight for diameter.The 6.5mm swede was the rifle of choice for ivory hunters and altho I doubt they made one shot kills still they did kill heavy tusked elephants.The .264win with factory fodder can do 2900fps with a 140gr hpbt and 2700fps with a 160gr sprn. This seems much better than a .243win. with a 100gr spbt that even people on here have told of taking elk with.The .264win can be handloaded about 150fps+ over factory and still stay within SAAMI specs.I dont think there would much to question in a careful hunters hands.It runs about 2600ft lbs+ at the muzzle,the same as the .270win.. sam.

lefty o · 12-11-2007, 10:46 AM

sorry billy, dont own a scanner!

samuel · 12-11-2007, 12:31 PM

I own a scanner and it wont work for me.Give me 50 more years and I will figure it out.(MAYBE) sam.

billy · 12-11-2007, 07:16 PM

well sam
dont you have a 4 or 5 year old grandson or something?
he will do it for ya in a few seconds!
i use children to program things around the house for me.

toolman · 12-11-2007, 08:04 PM

Welcome to G&G C.H.! You might want to look at the powder and bullet mfgr's websites for free load info. Hodgdon, Accurate, and Nosler all have a lot of good info on their sites.

rdale501 · 12-12-2007, 08:37 PM

It's too bad this round is falling by the wayside. I own one in mod. 700 Remmington. It is a good deer stopper at long range. It is most likely the best antelope round made. I don't reload for it but I have dies and plan to do so.

samuel · 12-15-2007, 07:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by billy

well sam
dont you have a 4 or 5 year old grandson or something?
he will do it for ya in a few seconds!
i use children to program things around the house for me.

Altho mostly you have good advice you really let me down on this one!!!I couldnt find a 4-5yr old so I got my 18yr old grandson to get the scanner lined up so I could use it and he wound up messing the printer up so now I have no printer or scanner.Maybe I shouldnt have yelled at him so he left before he was done.Maybe I can kiss a** and get him back to finish.I thought grampa,s were supposed to be grouchy? sam.

billy · 12-15-2007, 07:38 AM

yeah sam but....
you are supposed to be a lovable grouch.
whatever the hey THAT means!

that kid was too old for the job anyway

samuel · 12-15-2007, 09:11 AM

I thought I was loveable-tough loveable.I suppose the cursing could have been misinterperated.I told him he had the brain of a 4yr old.Does that count?He is at the age that he knows everything,18,I am at the age that I cant be told anything by a young punk,68.He is getting along at his job and school.Maybe some of it was my fault.He is a kid that got in trouble and wanted to straighten his life up.He still lacks some control but is learning to watch his temper.I give him he** now and then.He will never learn control of he never has to use it.I just give him reasons. sam.

billy · 12-15-2007, 09:48 AM

look around and see if ya gotta greatgrandson/daughter

12-09-2007, 02:56 AM	#1
City Hunter Registered User Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: portland, or Posts: 3	Anyone have good info on hot loads for the .264 win mag? I'm going to be getting into reloading as I've just about shot up all my good old .264 ammunition that my old man colleceted back in the day. I'm looking for some good reloading data for making some hot rounds for my rifle. I'm shooting a ruger m77 witht he 26inch barrel. It isnt the fanciest .264 ever made but it shoots damn accurate. These factory loads now, all 2 or so of them are just crap. 140g core lokt andthe junk winchester is selling. They are nowhere near the power they should be. I'm assuming it's for insurance reason on older guns. As for bullets, I'd like to load some 100g, 127ish, and some 140 for hunting. deer/elk Thanks for your time. This is my first post so please be gental

12-09-2007, 05:54 AM	#2
nathangdad Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 2,432	Erosion danger. This round already is so overbore and generates so much heat and metal erosion it is one of those rounds that barely hangs on in the marketplace. If you check some older gun magazines you will read stories about barrel burnout. It is totally counterproductive to get anything more out of this gun. I do recall a magazine story of total barrel accuracy loss at 900 rounds with the factory load.

12-09-2007, 06:01 AM	#3
billy spiritual counselor Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: a secret lab on the shores of lake titicaca Posts: 11,924 Images: 9 Blog Entries: 145	hi C.H. i reload but i dont make hot loads for anything i own. maybe you should get a couple of loading manuals and ignore the safety warnings in them. ok ....really you should get some manuals. but here are some from my books you can use photoshop or whatever you have to blow these up and make them easier to read. i didnt feel like typing all that out. __________________ internet yards and real yards are completely different units of measure. Last edited by billy; 12-09-2007 at 06:27 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

12-09-2007, 06:53 AM	#5
billy spiritual counselor Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: a secret lab on the shores of lake titicaca Posts: 11,924 Images: 9 Blog Entries: 145	i wish people would just scan their manuals when i ask for load recipes! it eliminates typo's! __________________ internet yards and real yards are completely different units of measure.

12-10-2007, 08:50 AM	#9
samuel Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 5,087	I advise getting the load books and concentrating on the slower burn rate powders which can give equal to or more fps at lower pressures and keep the barrel cooler.The point in mind being,I have a 6.5 Gibbs which is a wildcat made by a twostep process of running .270win.cases in the Gibbs die and then fireforming with light loads.For a finished product I was using IMR 4350 to IMR 4895 and running 3200fps with a 140gr bullet.The cases lasted 3 loads.I switched to rel22 and H1000 compressed loads and went to 3400fps+ at the same or lower pressure and the cases lasted for 5 loads.This is a hot wildcat but originally the .264 was too.I just wanted to dimonstrate how you could use a slower burn rate powder to get more fps at lower pressure and lower heat.Before I could only fire 3 shots before cooling.After I could fire 5.This slower burn rate can only be used in longer barrels like yours and you may find powders ranging in the IMR4350toIMR4831.rl 19 and such will work.I have a 29.5" bbl and can burn real slow powders.Also I have more powder capacity with ff cases than you do.I am not trying to compare the two.Just saying heat control can be helped with a little research. sam. Last edited by samuel; 12-10-2007 at 08:52 AM.

12-09-2007, 06:50 AM	#4
rfc357 Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 741	You will probably achieve much better performance from handloads than from factory ammunition. The .264 cartridge is on life support. The ammunition companies don't sell much of it, so they don't put much effort into load development. .264 ammunition is loaded light to prolong barrel life, not because of "old guns." The .264 is not very old as cartridges go, and there have never been any "weak" rifles for it. Powders that give the highest velocities usually are the most efficient for any cartridge. Note I did not say that you should try to achive the highest velocities! In a cartridge like the .264, going for the hottest load is a sure recipe for a quickly burned-out barrel. A couple of grains under max will probably give you the best accuracy. The light bullets available in 6.5mm make any such cartridge marginal for elk, in my opinion. You have to place the bullet exactly right to achieve a one-shot kill. Of course, that is a good thing to do with any cartridge, but a bigger bullet gives you more margin for error. The .264 can be very accurate, and this is an advantage. Use the heaviest bullet you can find for elk. At any rate, once you start handloading you will shoot a lot more. Your barrel may go south before you know it. (Hornady says they burned out several barrels developing load data for the .264! Avoid rapid fire.) Re-barelling is not a big deal, and when you do it you can consider another cartridge. Have fun and be careful!

12-09-2007, 11:06 AM	#7
rfc357 Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 741	Samuel, you are correct. However, hot loads exacerbate the situation by generating more heat, especially if you do not allow the barrel to cool between shots. Hunting rifles are not intended to heat up. One of the reasons target rifles have heavy barrels is to mitigate the heat generated by rapid fire strings.

12-10-2007, 04:30 AM	#8
City Hunter Registered User Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: portland, or Posts: 3	Thanks for the replies guys. I've read a lot on the .264 over the years and a lot of the barrel burn out I've seen in articles has been said to be more of a nit picking issue. Lets face it the .264 isnt the only magnum that will burn a barrel out. I was browsing a alaska game forum the other day and ran accross a article on the .264 and there were a few there who said there was no issues with their older guns burning barrels out. I've put quite a few rounds in my rifle over the years and have never had any issues with accuracy. I have a 3x9 leupold and it's been one of those guns I take out every year and it shoots what I aim at every time with no issues. It's become my favorite caliber right next to my 300 weatherby. As for me, I rarely shoot more than 4 shots in succession before I put the gun down and play with another gun for a while. It costs a ton fo moeny to shoot these when you buy your ammunition. By hot I mean, better than the few crappy options we have out now, which are toned down. I just want the most out of my round. And yeah I do need to buy some loading books. A buddy of mine has got me going on it, and im all out of my old .264 ammunition that was made in the early 80s. So right now there really isn't anything to buy that will meet the power it was intended for.

12-11-2007, 01:50 AM	#10
City Hunter Registered User Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: portland, or Posts: 3	great post man, thats some fantastic info. I'll definately be looking into that this week.

12-11-2007, 10:41 AM	#11
samuel Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 5,087	RFC357:While i dont advocate using a .264win for elk,at the same time if my 6.5 Gibbs can make a oneshot kill on a herd bull at 850yds+,(I never shot any game at that range,the experts did) surely the .264win could be used at much shorter ranges.The 6.5mm is inherently deep penetrating because of the heavy bullet weight for diameter.The 6.5mm swede was the rifle of choice for ivory hunters and altho I doubt they made one shot kills still they did kill heavy tusked elephants.The .264win with factory fodder can do 2900fps with a 140gr hpbt and 2700fps with a 160gr sprn. This seems much better than a .243win. with a 100gr spbt that even people on here have told of taking elk with.The .264win can be handloaded about 150fps+ over factory and still stay within SAAMI specs.I dont think there would much to question in a careful hunters hands.It runs about 2600ft lbs+ at the muzzle,the same as the .270win.. sam.

12-11-2007, 10:46 AM	#12
lefty o Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: mn Posts: 4,783	sorry billy, dont own a scanner!

12-11-2007, 12:31 PM	#13
samuel Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 5,087	I own a scanner and it wont work for me.Give me 50 more years and I will figure it out.(MAYBE) sam.

12-11-2007, 07:16 PM	#14
billy spiritual counselor Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: a secret lab on the shores of lake titicaca Posts: 11,924 Images: 9 Blog Entries: 145	well sam dont you have a 4 or 5 year old grandson or something? he will do it for ya in a few seconds! i use children to program things around the house for me. __________________ internet yards and real yards are completely different units of measure.

12-11-2007, 08:04 PM	#15
toolman Mr. Fixit Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: abilene,tx Posts: 5,562 Blog Entries: 22	Welcome to G&G C.H.! You might want to look at the powder and bullet mfgr's websites for free load info. Hodgdon, Accurate, and Nosler all have a lot of good info on their sites. __________________ Don't be messin' with my gun!

12-12-2007, 08:37 PM	#16
rdale501 Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: oregon Posts: 398	It's too bad this round is falling by the wayside. I own one in mod. 700 Remmington. It is a good deer stopper at long range. It is most likely the best antelope round made. I don't reload for it but I have dies and plan to do so.

12-15-2007, 07:38 AM	#18
billy spiritual counselor Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: a secret lab on the shores of lake titicaca Posts: 11,924 Images: 9 Blog Entries: 145	yeah sam but.... you are supposed to be a lovable grouch. whatever the hey THAT means! that kid was too old for the job anyway __________________ internet yards and real yards are completely different units of measure. Last edited by billy; 12-15-2007 at 07:38 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

12-15-2007, 09:11 AM	#19
samuel Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 5,087	I thought I was loveable-tough loveable.I suppose the cursing could have been misinterperated.I told him he had the brain of a 4yr old.Does that count?He is at the age that he knows everything,18,I am at the age that I cant be told anything by a young punk,68.He is getting along at his job and school.Maybe some of it was my fault.He is a kid that got in trouble and wanted to straighten his life up.He still lacks some control but is learning to watch his temper.I give him he** now and then.He will never learn control of he never has to use it.I just give him reasons. sam.

12-15-2007, 09:48 AM	#20
billy spiritual counselor Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: a secret lab on the shores of lake titicaca Posts: 11,924 Images: 9 Blog Entries: 145	look around and see if ya gotta greatgrandson/daughter __________________ internet yards and real yards are completely different units of measure.