.380 +P load

Muddog · 04-19-2008, 01:12 AM

I have a fairly new CZ 83 that is a dream and more to shoot, so much that it is my new nightstand gun. However, I have found various places that not only list .380 as a bottom line caliber for defense, but that one should also use FMJ or MC bullets to ensure at least some penetration. My question is if I find or load some +P ammo, will that make up for the marginal power? I'm not expecting any first-hand experience, but if anyone has anything to contribute to this it would be greatly appreciated. Thanks

ArkansasHunter · 04-19-2008, 02:14 AM

Muddog all I know to tell you is what I've heard here and thats : Say It's winter time and if an assailent were attacking and the assailent was wearing a heavy to not so heavy coat .
Then the 380 may not take out the attacker before they get to you.
Take that information with a grain of salt and really it doe's make since...A.H

Zephri · 04-19-2008, 03:15 AM

I have a really simple solution for that. Keep shooting him til' he stops, I highly doubt the assailant will keep moving towards you with 12 .380+ps in him, mainly cause he'll be dead.

ArkansasHunter · 04-19-2008, 03:54 AM

I agree and I/m sorry I didn't mention I'll prolly be buying a pistol in 380 soon.

Zephri · 04-19-2008, 04:32 AM

No sorry necessary, I didn't mean to come off as a smart As$.

.

Muddog · 04-19-2008, 11:31 PM

That is my main concern, multiple layers of clothes are more layers to penetrate, I didn't know if a little more powder would make a HP a more effective round. I've read a few stories (I know, I know, there like a$$holes) where someone was shot center mass more than once and none penetrated his chest. Does that mean shoot hotter loads or aim a little higher?
Zephri thats why its in the nightstand, it holds more than the 1911 and I'm bound to get him a good one. just wanted to raise my odds.
A.H. I did a little research before I bought this and they sound like they are very reliable and mine is as accurate as I am. They apparently aren't the smallest or mildest recoiling of the bunch, some 9mm are smaller, but this is all steel -grips and personally it looks a lot better than most. Anyways thanks for your input.

Taurus Fan · 04-20-2008, 12:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ArkansasHunter

I agree and I/m sorry I didn't mention I'll prolly be buying a pistol in 380 soon.

If you have to have a .380, I suppose this might be a good choice. It's the small size versus capacity I find intriguing.
Taurus International Manufacturing Inc

Apollo Morelos · 04-20-2008, 12:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zephri

I have a really simple solution for that. Keep shooting him til' he stops, I highly doubt the assailant will keep moving towards you with 12 .380+ps in him, mainly cause he'll be dead.

That is what I am thinking. Just keep shooting 'til you run out of ammo, if you do run out, get some more. The assailant will go down sooner or later. If that 380 does not do its job, get a sling shot.

FatAlbert · 04-20-2008, 01:26 PM

I was on the jury of a shooting case. It was outside the Compton Cal school board office. Homey shot one of two school security guards from over the top a car and then went around the back or the car to the passengers side to shoot other. He was shot by the other guard as came out from behind the back. The bulllet went in right side of the chest, throught the right kidney, out the back, throught the front window of a van parked behind and bounced around four places inside the van. This was with plane factory FMJ bullets.

Zephri · 04-20-2008, 04:50 PM

Was this .380 that the guy was shooting?

Palladin8 · 04-20-2008, 09:32 PM

I read an article many years ago about bullet performance on one stop shots. The group tested all the latest ammo for all new and old calibers. They also used data from actual shootings (Law Enforcement). I do remember reading that with the magsafe or glaser safety slug the .380 had the same one stop percentage as the 230 fmj .45acp. I do believe it was in the mid 60% range.

sell33 · 04-20-2008, 09:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taurus Fan

If you have to have a .380, I suppose this might be a good choice. It's the small size versus capacity I find intriguing.
Taurus International Manufacturing Inc

Holy Sh*t 19+1 ought to be enough to stop 5 guys coming at you...i know if i was hit with a 380 round id be high tailin it in reverse pretty quick....

mitch_mckee · 04-20-2008, 10:21 PM

The solution to the thick clothing guy is FMJ. It is my understanding that .380s and .38 Spec (in snubby) are not reliable in expansion anyway so why not go the other route and opt for penetration?

Muddog · 04-20-2008, 10:22 PM

Can you load those magsafes or safety slugs? I like the idea of shooting 50 rds. for 13 bucks, it sounds like those might be a little more than my UMC. Also I don't suppose you remember what site that was Palladin?

That was/is my thinking Mitch, 13 MC 95 grs. sit in her now. I was curious to know if anyone had anything showing a good improvement with hotter loads or homebrews. Thanks for the replies.

TXplt · 04-21-2008, 01:59 AM

Try here:

Product Line Listing

After you ensure functioning, you can alternate speers and hardcast. Don't think you'll do alot better than this, but just an opinion. The .38's SWCJHP +P will expand well out of a snubby even; had good luck w/DPX from cor-bon as well.

Muddog · 04-21-2008, 09:40 PM

Thanks TX but I was looking for something in .380 not .38. Something that isnt $1 a bullet would be nice too...

Palladin8 · 04-21-2008, 09:46 PM

Muddog I read it in a magazine article back when I was stationed in Nor Cal in 94. I don't remember what magazine it was but I did a search and found this article. It seems pretty close but says nothing about the glaser safety slug or magsafe ammo.
http://www.abaris.net/info/ballistic...ping-power.htm

TXplt · 04-22-2008, 12:02 AM

The link goes to the .380's -- (but they are quite pricey -- fast though). Just threw in the .38 stuff because this and the .45 colt from them has worked out well for me... Just making a suggestion...... I don't know if you'll get much higher performance but maybe. Best of luck and hope it works out well

Muddog · 04-22-2008, 12:32 AM

Oh, ok thanks TX I see em. Thanks Palladin, thats what I was looking for...Bad news for my MC though, looks like I'm going to Holsters and More tomorrow for something better.

Phil Lozano · 04-26-2008, 01:35 PM

I carry a Sig in 380 Auto. (quite a nice litle gun). What I did, I bought a bunch of different ammo and tried them all.

I have Remington (heaviest of the bunch) up top, then a Cor Bon, Federal, Remington, Speer, and then some hard stuff, in the magazines (I always carry more than the 1 in the gun).

One of the the loads will "hurt" bad enough to give anyone second thoughts.

Make sure your gun will feed HP's ! Not just one box of each. Put more than a few boxes of each through it. If you have 1 failure, that load is out for good.

JMO

Best,

04-19-2008, 01:12 AM	#1
Muddog Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Northeast Kansas Posts: 125	.380 +P load I have a fairly new CZ 83 that is a dream and more to shoot, so much that it is my new nightstand gun. However, I have found various places that not only list .380 as a bottom line caliber for defense, but that one should also use FMJ or MC bullets to ensure at least some penetration. My question is if I find or load some +P ammo, will that make up for the marginal power? I'm not expecting any first-hand experience, but if anyone has anything to contribute to this it would be greatly appreciated. Thanks

04-19-2008, 03:15 AM	#3
Zephri Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Indianapolis, IN. "The city where nothing happens." Posts: 1,083 Blog Entries: 6	I have a really simple solution for that. Keep shooting him til' he stops, I highly doubt the assailant will keep moving towards you with 12 .380+ps in him, mainly cause he'll be dead. __________________ "All rifles need a sharp pointy object on the end!" http://s96.photobucket.com/albums/l195/zephri/ Last edited by Zephri; 04-19-2008 at 03:23 AM.

04-19-2008, 04:32 AM	#5
Zephri Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Indianapolis, IN. "The city where nothing happens." Posts: 1,083 Blog Entries: 6	No sorry necessary, I didn't mean to come off as a smart As$.. __________________ "All rifles need a sharp pointy object on the end!" http://s96.photobucket.com/albums/l195/zephri/

04-20-2008, 01:26 PM	#9
FatAlbert Registered User Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: North of LA, People Repub. of Kal Posts: 10	I was on the jury of a shooting case. It was outside the Compton Cal school board office. Homey shot one of two school security guards from over the top a car and then went around the back or the car to the passengers side to shoot other. He was shot by the other guard as came out from behind the back. The bulllet went in right side of the chest, throught the right kidney, out the back, throught the front window of a van parked behind and bounced around four places inside the van. This was with plane factory FMJ bullets. Last edited by FatAlbert; 04-20-2008 at 01:28 PM.

04-20-2008, 04:50 PM	#10
Zephri Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Indianapolis, IN. "The city where nothing happens." Posts: 1,083 Blog Entries: 6	Was this .380 that the guy was shooting? __________________ "All rifles need a sharp pointy object on the end!" http://s96.photobucket.com/albums/l195/zephri/

04-19-2008, 02:14 AM	#2
ArkansasHunter Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: South Arkansas Posts: 10,675	Muddog all I know to tell you is what I've heard here and thats : Say It's winter time and if an assailent were attacking and the assailent was wearing a heavy to not so heavy coat . Then the 380 may not take out the attacker before they get to you. Take that information with a grain of salt and really it doe's make since...A.H

04-19-2008, 03:54 AM	#4
ArkansasHunter Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: South Arkansas Posts: 10,675	I agree and I/m sorry I didn't mention I'll prolly be buying a pistol in 380 soon.

04-19-2008, 11:31 PM	#6
Muddog Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Northeast Kansas Posts: 125	That is my main concern, multiple layers of clothes are more layers to penetrate, I didn't know if a little more powder would make a HP a more effective round. I've read a few stories (I know, I know, there like a$$holes) where someone was shot center mass more than once and none penetrated his chest. Does that mean shoot hotter loads or aim a little higher? Zephri thats why its in the nightstand, it holds more than the 1911 and I'm bound to get him a good one. just wanted to raise my odds. A.H. I did a little research before I bought this and they sound like they are very reliable and mine is as accurate as I am. They apparently aren't the smallest or mildest recoiling of the bunch, some 9mm are smaller, but this is all steel -grips and personally it looks a lot better than most. Anyways thanks for your input.

04-20-2008, 09:32 PM	#11
Palladin8 Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Las Vegas, NV Posts: 399	I read an article many years ago about bullet performance on one stop shots. The group tested all the latest ammo for all new and old calibers. They also used data from actual shootings (Law Enforcement). I do remember reading that with the magsafe or glaser safety slug the .380 had the same one stop percentage as the 230 fmj .45acp. I do believe it was in the mid 60% range.

04-20-2008, 10:21 PM	#13
mitch_mckee Banned Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Knoxville, TN Posts: 1,085 Images: 3	The solution to the thick clothing guy is FMJ. It is my understanding that .380s and .38 Spec (in snubby) are not reliable in expansion anyway so why not go the other route and opt for penetration?

04-20-2008, 10:22 PM	#14
Muddog Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Northeast Kansas Posts: 125	Can you load those magsafes or safety slugs? I like the idea of shooting 50 rds. for 13 bucks, it sounds like those might be a little more than my UMC. Also I don't suppose you remember what site that was Palladin? That was/is my thinking Mitch, 13 MC 95 grs. sit in her now. I was curious to know if anyone had anything showing a good improvement with hotter loads or homebrews. Thanks for the replies. Last edited by Muddog; 04-20-2008 at 10:25 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

04-21-2008, 01:59 AM	#15
TXplt Lost in the Ozone Again Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Fort Worth, TX Posts: 2,773 Images: 4 Blog Entries: 2	Try here: Product Line Listing After you ensure functioning, you can alternate speers and hardcast. Don't think you'll do alot better than this, but just an opinion. The .38's SWCJHP +P will expand well out of a snubby even; had good luck w/DPX from cor-bon as well. __________________ Old fighter pilots never die.....They just wind up in Texas

04-21-2008, 09:40 PM	#16
Muddog Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Northeast Kansas Posts: 125	Thanks TX but I was looking for something in .380 not .38. Something that isnt $1 a bullet would be nice too...

04-21-2008, 09:46 PM	#17
Palladin8 Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Las Vegas, NV Posts: 399	Muddog I read it in a magazine article back when I was stationed in Nor Cal in 94. I don't remember what magazine it was but I did a search and found this article. It seems pretty close but says nothing about the glaser safety slug or magsafe ammo. http://www.abaris.net/info/ballistic...ping-power.htm

04-22-2008, 12:02 AM	#18
TXplt Lost in the Ozone Again Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Fort Worth, TX Posts: 2,773 Images: 4 Blog Entries: 2	The link goes to the .380's -- (but they are quite pricey -- fast though). Just threw in the .38 stuff because this and the .45 colt from them has worked out well for me... Just making a suggestion...... I don't know if you'll get much higher performance but maybe. Best of luck and hope it works out well __________________ Old fighter pilots never die.....They just wind up in Texas

04-22-2008, 12:32 AM	#19
Muddog Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Northeast Kansas Posts: 125	Oh, ok thanks TX I see em. Thanks Palladin, thats what I was looking for...Bad news for my MC though, looks like I'm going to Holsters and More tomorrow for something better.

04-26-2008, 01:35 PM	#20
Phil Lozano Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: June-Dec. Arusha, TZ~Dec.-June PSL, FL. Posts: 188	I carry a Sig in 380 Auto. (quite a nice litle gun). What I did, I bought a bunch of different ammo and tried them all. I have Remington (heaviest of the bunch) up top, then a Cor Bon, Federal, Remington, Speer, and then some hard stuff, in the magazines (I always carry more than the 1 in the gun). One of the the loads will "hurt" bad enough to give anyone second thoughts. Make sure your gun will feed HP's ! Not just one box of each. Put more than a few boxes of each through it. If you have 1 failure, that load is out for good. JMO Best, __________________ Phil Lozano Phil Lozano Tanzania Trophy Expeditions