Ejection Problems

30 cal kaos · 06-15-2005, 03:46 PM

I bought an M-1 about 5 years ago from IAI and it's been in and out of the shop ever since. At one point they replaced everything but the stock. The problems have been whittled down to ejection issues. From time to time the spent casings are either barely kicked out or caught by the bolt on the way out. I was using the cheap Sellier ammo, and it worked fine for a while, then started doing it again. Remmington ammo was suggested, but it didn't help.
So I sent it out to the IAI repair shop on the east coast, who claimed (like everyone else) that they fired 50 rounds-no problem. I called them back and they said they were using Winchester. It is better but it has not eliminated the problem.
I would appreciate an suggestions other than "junk it" or pass it off on someone else.
I would also like to know if I am damaging my gun by shooting up the cheap ammo.
Thanks.

Thrawn · 06-15-2005, 03:54 PM

If it acts diferently depending on ammo used I'd say its a gas problem, maybe the piston. The cheap ammo should affect anything except you groups.

Thrawn · 06-15-2005, 03:56 PM

Can't say for sure though, never held a m1 carbine as of yet. don't know how they tick, just basing this on experiences with other gas operated rifles.

PAPA G · 06-15-2005, 07:10 PM

ooops i thought i read "erection" problems. nemer mind :jaw:

Thrawn · 06-15-2005, 08:06 PM

Otter · 06-15-2005, 09:04 PM

I've owned and used Military M1 Carbines for years, I' m not familiar with the IAI, The gas system can be tested by blowing air down the barrel, field strip the carbine, hold your finger over the chamber and blow down the barrel, the gas piston should operate freely. Plainfield carbines seldom worked properly, usually stopping with a spent case sticking out and the bolt closed on it. Changing the bolt to a military bolt usually cured that problem. I've fired thousands of rounds, usually surplus ball, from my Winchester without a stopage, my guess would be that the problem is in the bolt, and sending it back to the manufacturer gets junk parts replaced with more junk parts. Find an original bolt, round or flat, and try it. There isn't much that can malfuntion with such a simple design. You don't have to shoot the rounds to find bolt problems, just cycle live rounds, if you can't get through a fifteen round magazine by crisply snapping the charging handle, check the bolt and ejector, assuming it extracts.
hope this helps, keep us informed

Big Dog · 06-16-2005, 09:57 AM

Every company has it's lemons. My little IAI works fine, except for the pesky rear sight loosening and walking side to side.
My buddy's Plainfield has never given any problem either.
Maybe try to find a good older gunsmith who is experienced on the 'War Baby'?

Oxford · 06-16-2005, 12:26 PM

PapaG...erection problems could be the result of improper gas removal, too.

Big Dog · 06-16-2005, 01:23 PM

Or more likely a 'plugged bore'.

30 cal kaos · 06-17-2005, 11:09 AM

Thanks for the help- especially Otter. Don't know when I'll get around to trying the suggestions, but I'll post something when I do.

jimb2 · 06-21-2005, 08:21 PM

The symptoms you describe are caused by one of two problems, a weak/broken ejector spring or a bad extractor. The weak spring wold fail to throw the case clear and the broken extractor wouldn't hole the case in place long enough for the ejector to do its job. The only other possibility is the recoil spring. IF is is too strong/long, it could be preventing the bolt frome moving back far enough, but that usually manifests itself with a failure to cock the hammer problem as well. Check the edge of the extractor and oil the ejector and make sure that it moves freely. If there is a problem with either, then they will need to be replced.

Otter · 06-24-2005, 05:40 PM

When you check the extractor look for a rounded hook, when extractors wear the hook that pulls the case starts to wear off and becomes rounded, a temporary fix is to file the extractor to re-create the sharp claw, I've gotten by with dressing up the problem extractor with a file while I waited for the new extractor to arrive. Sometimes gun smithing is more that changing parts. Sometimes you have to make existing parts work.

"Life is too important to be taken seriuosly."

Bass-smasher · 06-25-2005, 10:36 PM

I have a IBM carbine my dad bought from the army corp in Anniston Al. back in 1964. Paid 20.00 and was delivered in the mail, still have receipt from army, Pretty cool. Over the years I dont shoot it much but have the same problems described above. Took to military gunsmith so he says. He ought to retire so he wont screw up any other weapons. Says no problems. I have tried with 5/10/15 and 30 rd magazines and without magazines shooting singly still have problems. Used military ball ammo and new stuff. Gas piston moves ok, ejector looks ok, extractor looks but no new ones to compare with. It has a flat bolt, if I try a new bolt will have any headspace problems? Any better ones to buy? Any ones to stay away from?

jimb2 · 06-30-2005, 05:23 PM

A failure to eject problem is NEVER the bolt. Don't replace it. If the piston moves freely, then it is not likely to be a gas port/piston problem. I work on and even rebuild carbines, so I have a pretty fair amount of experience. You need a bolt tool to disassemble the bolt. When you do, check the extractor first then the extractor spring. If it is weak the extractor could be slipping over the rim. If the extractor and spring are ok then check the ejector. It is possible to have a weak or broken spring there too. If neither the extractor or the ejector are the problem then it could be the recoil spring, but that is rare.

06-15-2005, 03:46 PM	#1
30 cal kaos Registered User Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 2	Ejection Problems I bought an M-1 about 5 years ago from IAI and it's been in and out of the shop ever since. At one point they replaced everything but the stock. The problems have been whittled down to ejection issues. From time to time the spent casings are either barely kicked out or caught by the bolt on the way out. I was using the cheap Sellier ammo, and it worked fine for a while, then started doing it again. Remmington ammo was suggested, but it didn't help. So I sent it out to the IAI repair shop on the east coast, who claimed (like everyone else) that they fired 50 rounds-no problem. I called them back and they said they were using Winchester. It is better but it has not eliminated the problem. I would appreciate an suggestions other than "junk it" or pass it off on someone else. I would also like to know if I am damaging my gun by shooting up the cheap ammo. Thanks.

06-15-2005, 09:04 PM	#6
Otter Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Vermont Posts: 955 Images: 6	I've owned and used Military M1 Carbines for years, I' m not familiar with the IAI, The gas system can be tested by blowing air down the barrel, field strip the carbine, hold your finger over the chamber and blow down the barrel, the gas piston should operate freely. Plainfield carbines seldom worked properly, usually stopping with a spent case sticking out and the bolt closed on it. Changing the bolt to a military bolt usually cured that problem. I've fired thousands of rounds, usually surplus ball, from my Winchester without a stopage, my guess would be that the problem is in the bolt, and sending it back to the manufacturer gets junk parts replaced with more junk parts. Find an original bolt, round or flat, and try it. There isn't much that can malfuntion with such a simple design. You don't have to shoot the rounds to find bolt problems, just cycle live rounds, if you can't get through a fifteen round magazine by crisply snapping the charging handle, check the bolt and ejector, assuming it extracts. hope this helps, keep us informed __________________ Life is too important to be taken seriously.

06-16-2005, 09:57 AM	#7
Big Dog Moderator Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Tallahassee, Florida Posts: 10,219	Every company has it's lemons. My little IAI works fine, except for the pesky rear sight loosening and walking side to side. My buddy's Plainfield has never given any problem either. Maybe try to find a good older gunsmith who is experienced on the 'War Baby'? __________________ Moderator of: AR15/M16, M14/M1A, New/Beginning Shooters and Militaria/Collectables.

06-16-2005, 12:26 PM	#8
Oxford Super Moderator Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Gladstone, Missouri Posts: 13,023 Blog Entries: 4	PapaG...erection problems could be the result of improper gas removal, too. __________________ "If it's worth doing, it's worth doing right".

06-16-2005, 01:23 PM	#9
Big Dog Moderator Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Tallahassee, Florida Posts: 10,219	Or more likely a 'plugged bore'. __________________ Moderator of: AR15/M16, M14/M1A, New/Beginning Shooters and Militaria/Collectables.

06-15-2005, 03:54 PM	#2
Thrawn Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Okeefenokee Posts: 1,618 Images: 6	If it acts diferently depending on ammo used I'd say its a gas problem, maybe the piston. The cheap ammo should affect anything except you groups.

06-15-2005, 03:56 PM	#3
Thrawn Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Okeefenokee Posts: 1,618 Images: 6	Can't say for sure though, never held a m1 carbine as of yet. don't know how they tick, just basing this on experiences with other gas operated rifles.

06-15-2005, 07:10 PM	#4
PAPA G Guest Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: somerset, kentucky Posts: 12	ooops i thought i read "erection" problems. nemer mind :jaw:

06-15-2005, 08:06 PM	#5
Thrawn Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Okeefenokee Posts: 1,618 Images: 6

06-17-2005, 11:09 AM	#10
30 cal kaos Registered User Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 2	Thanks for the help- especially Otter. Don't know when I'll get around to trying the suggestions, but I'll post something when I do.

06-21-2005, 08:21 PM	#11
jimb2 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Ohio Posts: 513	The symptoms you describe are caused by one of two problems, a weak/broken ejector spring or a bad extractor. The weak spring wold fail to throw the case clear and the broken extractor wouldn't hole the case in place long enough for the ejector to do its job. The only other possibility is the recoil spring. IF is is too strong/long, it could be preventing the bolt frome moving back far enough, but that usually manifests itself with a failure to cock the hammer problem as well. Check the edge of the extractor and oil the ejector and make sure that it moves freely. If there is a problem with either, then they will need to be replced. __________________ I am a nobody. Nobody is perfect. Therefore, I am perfect...

06-24-2005, 05:40 PM	#12
Otter Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Vermont Posts: 955 Images: 6	When you check the extractor look for a rounded hook, when extractors wear the hook that pulls the case starts to wear off and becomes rounded, a temporary fix is to file the extractor to re-create the sharp claw, I've gotten by with dressing up the problem extractor with a file while I waited for the new extractor to arrive. Sometimes gun smithing is more that changing parts. Sometimes you have to make existing parts work. "Life is too important to be taken seriuosly." __________________ Life is too important to be taken seriously.

06-25-2005, 10:36 PM	#13
Bass-smasher Registered User Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Chandler Arizona Posts: 12	I have a IBM carbine my dad bought from the army corp in Anniston Al. back in 1964. Paid 20.00 and was delivered in the mail, still have receipt from army, Pretty cool. Over the years I dont shoot it much but have the same problems described above. Took to military gunsmith so he says. He ought to retire so he wont screw up any other weapons. Says no problems. I have tried with 5/10/15 and 30 rd magazines and without magazines shooting singly still have problems. Used military ball ammo and new stuff. Gas piston moves ok, ejector looks ok, extractor looks but no new ones to compare with. It has a flat bolt, if I try a new bolt will have any headspace problems? Any better ones to buy? Any ones to stay away from?

06-30-2005, 05:23 PM	#14
jimb2 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Ohio Posts: 513	A failure to eject problem is NEVER the bolt. Don't replace it. If the piston moves freely, then it is not likely to be a gas port/piston problem. I work on and even rebuild carbines, so I have a pretty fair amount of experience. You need a bolt tool to disassemble the bolt. When you do, check the extractor first then the extractor spring. If it is weak the extractor could be slipping over the rim. If the extractor and spring are ok then check the ejector. It is possible to have a weak or broken spring there too. If neither the extractor or the ejector are the problem then it could be the recoil spring, but that is rare. __________________ I am a nobody. Nobody is perfect. Therefore, I am perfect...