Problem w/ my new M-1

[fishlore]

I finally got to the range and fired my new M1 for the first time. I absolutely loved it and got a few nice groups. I did run into a problem however. The rifle wouldn't eject the used casing and cycle the next round so I was stuck manually pulling the operating rod back every time.

I was using Remington 30/06 Springfield 150 grain rounds. I was using a McCann adjustable gas screw. I started with the biggest and worked my way through to the smallest screw and none of them worked. I even swapped out the adjustable screw for the normal one that came with the rifle and that didn't work either.

This week I'm going to disassemble the rifle and scrutinize the gas chamber. I'm hoping that there is some sort of residue or something in there since that sounds like the easiest fix I could hope for.

My question is, what else could a relative newbie look for in order to fix this problem? Is it possible there isn't enough energy in a 150 grain round to cycle the action (I highly doubt this)? If all else fails does anyone know of any M1 gunsmiths in the Northeast Ohio area and what would one expect to spend for this service?

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thank you for your time.

[HK770]

try this

Fulton Armory FAQ: M1 Gas Cylinders: Should I tighten the Gas Cylinder Lock Screw with a Breaker Bar?


Be sure gas port hole of barrel is clear !
Be certain that the gas port hole of the barrel is more or less centered in the gas cylinder's gas port window, which is clearly visible when looking into the mouth of the gas cylinder.

[fishlore]

Thank you for the suggestions and the link HK. I'll definitely take a look at the things you mentioned.

[M14man]

Try the GI gas screw(plug). If it does not extract then and feed properly,look at gas cylinder,lubrication,gas piston. Does the bolt move back at all, or not enough to extract/and/or feed?

[JimBob]

The problem you are having is called short stroking.Many times it is due to a bad operating rod spring.Another check is called a tilt test to check for binding of the operating rod here is a link to a thread with some video links http://www.odcmp.org/new_forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=50023 The reject dimensions on the op-rod piston is .5250 the gas cylinder reject is .532.When inspecting the gas cylinder be aware it is larger at the bottom end beyond the piston travel area.Also certain areas on the M1 require the application of grease to ensure correct operation,plastilube or Lubriplate 130 are specified but any HD wheel bearing grease will work.If possible procure some military .30-06 M2 Ball to check functioning with the issue gas cylinder plug.It is not advisable to shoot the M1 with commercial ammo unless the adjustable gas plug is used,otherwise there is a possibility of a bent operating rod.This problem can also be an indication of a rifle assembled from a welded together receiver.Usually detected by the drawing number on the front leg not matching that given for the serial number range.That defect is not a problem on rifles purchased from the CMP but is on rifles from gunshops and the auction sites.

[gunnerdave]

You may also find the pdf file I posted in the thread titled: "Lock-back?" helpful in the future.

Answers already posted are the most likely possibilities, I think.

HTH

Dave

[fishlore]

So I finally got a chance to disassemble my M1. I had a few questions.

1. Is there a trick to removing the gas chamber group? I've removed the gas cylinder lock screw, the gas cylinder lock, but can't for the life of me remove the gas chamber group. The book I have makes it sound like it should just slide off the barrel. The only reason I want to remove it is to assure the gas port is clean and clear.

2. Should the operating rod be 100% straight? There is a slight bow closer to the end where the gas interacts with the rod. It looks like it coincides with the dirtiest or most used part of the rod. Nothing crazy, but it is not straight as an arrow.

A few things I noticed which probably contributed to the issue I had...

1. There was a tremendous amount of grease everywhere inside, how much is too much, how much is not enough? This probably contributed to the problem.

2. The gas chamber was definitely dirty. There was some blue/green residue in there in addition to what a dirty barrel would look like. I've cleaned it out and hope it helps.

Thanks.

[Full MeTal Jack]

The gas tube should be clean. No grease no oil. Metal to metal.
Once you clean it up. Try this.
Remove action from stock. Leave handguards on.
Remove the oprod spring
Reassemble the action with op rod in gas cylinder and on bolt.
Tilt action back and forth greater than 45 degrees. the op rod/ action should freely operate. Bolt open, bolt close.
If not find whats holding. Fix it
Reinstall the op rod spring.

[JimBob]

The gas cylinder should be tight for a good fit.You may have to use a wood block and a hammer to GENTLY drive it off.Tap on the bayonet lug not the front sight base.If it is that tight soaking with penetrating oil or Kroil around the splined area overnight might help.No the op-rod is not straight,it has two bends in it.When the op-rod reaches the end of its travel excess gas does exit around the piston leaving gas residue on the rod and areas around it.It sounds as if your rifle needs to be taken down and completely cleaned of all old grease.The CMP site has an excellent tech site on Garands illustrating takedown and reassembly and the points that need greased and type of grease to use.To do a tilt test see my previous posting to a link with a video illustrating how to do it to check for free movement of op-rod.

[gunnerdave]

You may find this link useful:

Collecting and Shooting the U.S. M1 Garand .30 Rifle - HISTORY


Click on the items of interest on the right near the top of the page.

HTH

Dave

[Iron_Colonel]

Thanks for the posts guys. I wonder if it would be beneficial to get an op rod spring from Orion 7? I got one for my Garand, and can't really notice any difference, but it was highly recommended. But it sounds like a good cleaning will help the issue. Fish, let us know how it turns out after you get it all cleaned up

[Orlando]

Sounds like you found the problem, a dirty gas cylinder. When cleaning rifle turn it upsidedown so solevants etc dont run through the gas port into the cylinder.
Get the cylinder clean, no oil and I would replace the Op Rod spring with one from Orion 7. Its cheap insurance

[wilbur46]

Not extracting the round. Check the case if the edge is torn off its a dirty chamber. then check extractor. take a fired round and snap in into the bolt by hand. Does it work??? If not probably dirty. Your gonna have to clean it

CMP web site. Tech box. Clean clean clean lube lube oil oil!!!
Start with carb cleaner. it melts cosmoline right now. When its all nice, oil everything, then wipe pretty dry. Boat trailer bearing grease stay where you put it, and is a lot cheaper than gun products. Whatever-- use something.
The tech site shows where.
Easy check on op-rod....when assembled and bolt closed..wiggle the handle.If it will move up and down by a lot, the op rod probably needs an O'haul.
James Swartz in Ohio does a nice, reasonable job of it.
Go to range, find someone who has a nice one and look for the difference between yours and his
Regards, Bill

[fishlore]

Thank you all for the replies. I field stripped it and cleaned the gas cylinder well, cleaned the chamber well, removed the old grease, re-greased, performed and passed the tilt test, reassembled and cycled it several times. This rifle was severely neglected as I went through well over 50 patches between the barrel, the gas cylinder and the chamber.

Unfortunately I won't be able to test it out until Saturday at the earliest. The only thing I didn't do is replace my current op rod spring with the new one I got from Orion because I couldn't pull the piece (forgot the name) out of the end of it. If the rifle still fails to cycle after my next test, that will be the next thing I try. The spring seemed to be in good condition so I wasn't overly worried about it at this time.

Thanks again to this wonderful community of helpful people and I'll be sure to report my results this weekend. Fingers crossed!!!

[Orlando]

Replace the Op Rod spring. What part are you having problems with. I can walk you through it.

[Full MeTal Jack]

fishlore, one other item to be addressed. You may know this already but here goes.
Get a muzzle protector / guide. That way you wont put extra wear on the muzzle.
I use Shooter's Choice bore cleaner. It can be left in barrel over night. Run another patch the next day. Leave some shooters choice in barrel. Repeat. Couple days copper should be gone.
Congrats on your new contageous disese, Garanditis.

[Orlando]

Or just a Dewey Coated rod

[fishlore]

Originally Posted by Orlando

Replace the Op Rod spring. What part are you having problems with. I can walk you through it.

The problem I'm having is removing the follower rod (I think that's what it's called) from the end of operating rod spring. I simply can't get the two pieces apart. I was really yanking on it, but was afraid I'd deform the spring which might not really be a problem but I thought that it might tighten the grip on the follower rod if I continued to do that. I've tried twisting and pulling as well to no avail.

Originally Posted by Full MeTal Jack

fishlore, one other item to be addressed. You may know this already but here goes.
Get a muzzle protector / guide. That way you wont put extra wear on the muzzle.
I use Shooter's Choice bore cleaner. It can be left in barrel over night. Run another patch the next day. Leave some shooters choice in barrel. Repeat. Couple days copper should be gone.
Congrats on your new contageous disese, Garanditis.

I do have a Dewey muzzle protector. I might have to check out Shooter's Choice. I've been using Hoppes #9 and have left some overnight several times and I've still got a little residue on the patches. I just can't believe how dirty this thing was.

Thanks for the ideas, and you aren't kidding about this becoming a disease, the guy at the range said, "You again" last time I went.

I did think of another question.... What tool do you use to remove the gas screw? The biggest screwdriver I can find in the stores 3/8" isn't big enough, I'm guessing a 1/2" might work, but before I scour the internet looking for one, I wanted to be sure that was the right tool.

Thanks again everyone.

[JimBob]

A short 1/4 inch drive socket extension and ratchet works pretty good or several places have a tool made to fit it.If you haven't tried it already,try twisting the op-rod spring in the opposite direction to which it is wound while turning the follower rod in the other direction.

[Orlando]

I agree with Jimbob, 1/4 inch drive with extension. As already said just twist rod the other direction, it will come off easily