yet another head space question

saahole · 07-03-2009, 10:06 PM

just done the first step of the finish reaming of my barrell. with the barrel hand tight the bolt just closes on the go gauge. but it does not close on a empty cartridge. is this normal? one reason i ask is that the field gauge that came with my set is bad, NG, pos, in that it reads the same as the go gauge.
there is no mistake in this as the no-go gauge reads where it should.
any insight would be helpful.

sbowers5 · 07-03-2009, 11:11 PM

That empty case was shot in another chamber and you are trying to use it in a brand new chamber there are a lot of reasons that it will not fit,and you should never relie on an old fired case when setting the headspace on a rifle. all headpsacing must be done with the barrel in the action tight as it is when the gun is assembled and ready to fire, any measurments made other wise are useless. Not trying to be as smart ass just stating facts.
Steve

saahole · 07-03-2009, 11:50 PM

the empty case was is new, bought new never fired. a ready to fire store bought remington cartridge looks/measures the same. i can not 100% rely on my go gauge for the stated reason -one of the set was bad- maybe two, maybe all three. i'm asking should a stripped down bolt close on brand new cartridge with no effort what so ever. now is the time to find out, not after i wreck the new barrel because of a bum gauge.

add: i'm using walts and clints book to guide me through this. their method is reaming while the barrel is hand tight, measuring to a point where after final tightening brings it to the final spec. getting the bolt to close on the go gauge is the first step. anyways in makes sense in the book.

M14man · 07-04-2009, 06:39 PM

If you can't trust the gauges, stop there...it is guess work.I would assume a new shell would allow the bolt to close easily, but it could also be a sign that your gauges are no good. It will even get tighter when you torque it down which may mean you will need more application of the finishing reamer. Some new barrels are made short and require a finish reamer. Is is a new barrel, or a replacement GI? You may have to spring for new gauges rather than chance ruining the chamber.

saahole · 07-04-2009, 08:33 PM

it is a new barrel from cmp. well i have already finished the installation. doing the head space check it reads perfect. when you try it with a new un-fired cartridge it takes just a little finger pressure to close the bolt. i would not call it forcing it closed. with the rifle completely assembled the bolt will not close on a new empty shell with the force of the bolt under spring pressure( bringing the bolt to the shell slowly then letting go after the bolt touches the shell) .the bolt will close however when the bolt is driven closed with spring pressure and inertia-- like under firing conditions. when pulling the op rod back afterwords the shell is ejected nicely.
i'm thinking i will put a primered only shell in there to see what happens.

M14man · 07-04-2009, 08:43 PM

It sounds OK..maybe has minimum headspacing. You may run into problems if you reload. Sometimes even small base dies won't be able to shrink the cases down enough. Otherwise it sounds fine. Worse that could happen is when you were all done, you may have to make a few more passes with the finishing reamer if head space ends up a little too short.

saahole · 07-04-2009, 10:10 PM

i think the problem can be laid to rest. i wish to thank one and all for for their esponses. and helping this numb nuts along. i hope to be able to do the same some day. once it's range tested i'll post the results.
again thank you.

07-03-2009, 10:06 PM	#1
saahole Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 55	yet another head space question just done the first step of the finish reaming of my barrell. with the barrel hand tight the bolt just closes on the go gauge. but it does not close on a empty cartridge. is this normal? one reason i ask is that the field gauge that came with my set is bad, NG, pos, in that it reads the same as the go gauge. there is no mistake in this as the no-go gauge reads where it should. any insight would be helpful.

07-03-2009, 11:11 PM	#2
sbowers5 Super Moderator Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: sawyer, ok Posts: 1,072	That empty case was shot in another chamber and you are trying to use it in a brand new chamber there are a lot of reasons that it will not fit,and you should never relie on an old fired case when setting the headspace on a rifle. all headpsacing must be done with the barrel in the action tight as it is when the gun is assembled and ready to fire, any measurments made other wise are useless. Not trying to be as smart ass just stating facts. Steve __________________ For those who never fought for it, freedom has a taste the protected will never know.

07-03-2009, 11:50 PM	#3
saahole Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 55	the empty case was is new, bought new never fired. a ready to fire store bought remington cartridge looks/measures the same. i can not 100% rely on my go gauge for the stated reason -one of the set was bad- maybe two, maybe all three. i'm asking should a stripped down bolt close on brand new cartridge with no effort what so ever. now is the time to find out, not after i wreck the new barrel because of a bum gauge. add: i'm using walts and clints book to guide me through this. their method is reaming while the barrel is hand tight, measuring to a point where after final tightening brings it to the final spec. getting the bolt to close on the go gauge is the first step. anyways in makes sense in the book. Last edited by saahole; 07-04-2009 at 02:41 AM. Reason: add

07-04-2009, 06:39 PM	#4
M14man Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: FLA Posts: 1,151 Images: 10	If you can't trust the gauges, stop there...it is guess work.I would assume a new shell would allow the bolt to close easily, but it could also be a sign that your gauges are no good. It will even get tighter when you torque it down which may mean you will need more application of the finishing reamer. Some new barrels are made short and require a finish reamer. Is is a new barrel, or a replacement GI? You may have to spring for new gauges rather than chance ruining the chamber.

07-04-2009, 08:33 PM	#5
saahole Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 55	it is a new barrel from cmp. well i have already finished the installation. doing the head space check it reads perfect. when you try it with a new un-fired cartridge it takes just a little finger pressure to close the bolt. i would not call it forcing it closed. with the rifle completely assembled the bolt will not close on a new empty shell with the force of the bolt under spring pressure( bringing the bolt to the shell slowly then letting go after the bolt touches the shell) .the bolt will close however when the bolt is driven closed with spring pressure and inertia-- like under firing conditions. when pulling the op rod back afterwords the shell is ejected nicely. i'm thinking i will put a primered only shell in there to see what happens.

07-04-2009, 08:43 PM	#6
M14man Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: FLA Posts: 1,151 Images: 10	It sounds OK..maybe has minimum headspacing. You may run into problems if you reload. Sometimes even small base dies won't be able to shrink the cases down enough. Otherwise it sounds fine. Worse that could happen is when you were all done, you may have to make a few more passes with the finishing reamer if head space ends up a little too short.

07-04-2009, 10:10 PM	#7
saahole Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 55	i think the problem can be laid to rest. i wish to thank one and all for for their esponses. and helping this numb nuts along. i hope to be able to do the same some day. once it's range tested i'll post the results. again thank you.