New Turk?

Swede · 12-13-2002, 10:04 PM

Bought my third Turk at a gun show Sunday. The first two I bought were the average beat up and worn looking $39 rifles, good shooters though!
This one is in what appears to be unissued condition with all matching serial numbers! When I first saw it I thought it was a Swede it looked so good, then I looked closer and realized it was a Turk. I had to give up $150 for it probably a little high but I swear this thing is new. The stock is beatiful with crisp markings behind the trigger gaurd and as I said all parts including the bolt match, bore is in new condition.............Swede.

PAPA G · 12-13-2002, 10:53 PM

$150. in the condition you describe. sounds fair to me. i see beat up ones for alot more than they be worth.:right:

Swede · 12-14-2002, 08:31 AM

Thanks Papa, I'll let you know how it shoots.

Dale · 12-14-2002, 10:39 AM

Every now and then we get lucky and find something like that. Sounds like you got yourself a pretty good deal for $150.

I paid slightly more than that for my very good 88/38 which, btw, I am afraid to shoot due to the ammo controversy, lol.

I'm glad your happy and keep us posted on how the ol' boy barks.

PAPA G · 12-14-2002, 11:01 AM

for some mild loads, that would put you in business. also USA loaded sporting ammo is supposed to be loaded for the older actions too.

Swede · 12-15-2002, 10:07 AM

Ammo Controversy?

Dale · 12-20-2002, 11:31 AM

Swede, depending on who you listen to and what you read some sources say that the receiver and bolts of the 88/38 are strong enough to handle the older milsurp ammo but most say they aren't.

some say you can fire the J and not the JS rounds....some say you can fire the older ball ammo only.....some say to reload to lower loads, etc.

It's a confusing issue for me....one I am avoiding for safety reasons until I know for sure.

Papa G commented that the new manufacture sport loads are OK. The majority I have talked to agree but there are just enough that disagree that it concerns me.

I've talked to several gunsmiths but the problem lies in that there are very few gunsmiths who are knowledgable when it comes to older foreign military weapons. So, they, to me, are not a good source one way or the other.

Perhaps someday I will read something and it might sway me to try and shoot older milsurp ammo....who knows?

Swede · 12-21-2002, 10:19 AM

This would not apply to the 1940 era rifles marked K. KALE would it?

Dale · 12-21-2002, 10:24 AM

What I've read and heard it applies only to the Commission 1888/38 rifles (and even some of the German GEW rifles, I'm told) since they were made long before high pressure cartridges.

Some of the 88/38s were reworked to handle the newer rounds but no one seems to be able o distinguish which ones were.

One of the biggest problems here is that the Turks had very few guns to begin with and also that most gunsmiths are unfamiliar with them as a whole to really become proficient in diagnosis and working on them.

1940 era rifles whould be fine with the ammo issue as long as the chambers spec out OK and everything else is gun worthy.

Swede · 12-21-2002, 10:32 AM

Thanks Dale, that answers my qustion. My Turks should be OK as they are all forty's production. Guess the problem with the 88's must be similar to the heat treatment problems with the old turn of the century 03's.........Swede.

Calvin · 12-21-2002, 11:25 AM

The main concern is that the older Commission bores were .318 (J). The Germans changed that in the early 1900's to a bore diameter of .323 (JS), which was a more powerful round. The really confusing part is that some Turk Mausers were made from an inferior ordnance steel that was not very strong. The exact manufacturing dates are not well known at all. Both of my Turks were made by Mauser in Germany and restamped with the Turkish crests. If you try to convert one, or buy parts, you need to contact a very knowledegable gunsmith as certain parts are not available for certain variations of the Turks. Midway U.S.A. is a good place to check out. They helped me on my rebuild 2 years ago.
It's not much, but I hope it helps. Enjoy it and let us know how she does!

WyrTwister · 12-29-2002, 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dale
Every now and then we get lucky and find something like that. Sounds like you got yourself a pretty good deal for $150.

I paid slightly more than that for my very good 88/38 which, btw, I am afraid to shoot due to the ammo controversy, lol.

I'm glad your happy and keep us posted on how the ol' boy barks.

Slug the barrel to see what size bullet it needs .

Wyr
God Bless

Calvin · 12-29-2002, 04:03 PM

The bullet controversy is why the 8mm never really took off in the U.S.. The American factory loads for it are very low compared to the European loading. In reality, the 8mm is on par with the venerable .30-06 as far as power is concerned. The SAAMI specs for the 8mm were developed around the fact that some shooters may try to inadvertantly fire the .323 round in a .318 bore. As such, the factory fodder is low powered.

Swede · 12-29-2002, 08:52 PM

Well,
My son and I tool her to the range on X-Mas Eve and put ten rounds through her. The five at rounds at 50-yds punched out close to one hole! and the five at 100-yds held a good 1-inch group. I would have taken a few more shots but I was in a hurray and had to go, but I am happy at what she did compared to my well used Turk 38's!..........Swede.

12-13-2002, 10:04 PM	#1
Swede Registered User Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Arizona Transplant Posts: 31	New Turk? Bought my third Turk at a gun show Sunday. The first two I bought were the average beat up and worn looking $39 rifles, good shooters though! This one is in what appears to be unissued condition with all matching serial numbers! When I first saw it I thought it was a Swede it looked so good, then I looked closer and realized it was a Turk. I had to give up $150 for it probably a little high but I swear this thing is new. The stock is beatiful with crisp markings behind the trigger gaurd and as I said all parts including the bolt match, bore is in new condition.............Swede.

12-13-2002, 10:53 PM	#2
PAPA G Guest Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: somerset, kentucky Posts: 11	SOUNDS LIKE A WINNER!!! $150. in the condition you describe. sounds fair to me. i see beat up ones for alot more than they be worth.:right:

12-14-2002, 10:39 AM	#4
Dale Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Too Dang Hot, Arizona Posts: 4,284	Every now and then we get lucky and find something like that. Sounds like you got yourself a pretty good deal for $150. I paid slightly more than that for my very good 88/38 which, btw, I am afraid to shoot due to the ammo controversy, lol. I'm glad your happy and keep us posted on how the ol' boy barks. __________________ "It confuses me how some people can vigorously go against the 2nd. Amendment and still call themselves patriotic"-me

12-14-2002, 11:01 AM	#5
PAPA G Guest Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: somerset, kentucky Posts: 11	TRY RELOADING FOR THE 88/38 for some mild loads, that would put you in business. also USA loaded sporting ammo is supposed to be loaded for the older actions too.

12-20-2002, 11:31 AM	#7
Dale Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Too Dang Hot, Arizona Posts: 4,284	Swede, depending on who you listen to and what you read some sources say that the receiver and bolts of the 88/38 are strong enough to handle the older milsurp ammo but most say they aren't. some say you can fire the J and not the JS rounds....some say you can fire the older ball ammo only.....some say to reload to lower loads, etc. It's a confusing issue for me....one I am avoiding for safety reasons until I know for sure. Papa G commented that the new manufacture sport loads are OK. The majority I have talked to agree but there are just enough that disagree that it concerns me. I've talked to several gunsmiths but the problem lies in that there are very few gunsmiths who are knowledgable when it comes to older foreign military weapons. So, they, to me, are not a good source one way or the other. Perhaps someday I will read something and it might sway me to try and shoot older milsurp ammo....who knows? __________________ "It confuses me how some people can vigorously go against the 2nd. Amendment and still call themselves patriotic"-me

12-14-2002, 08:31 AM	#3
Swede Registered User Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Arizona Transplant Posts: 31	Thanks Papa, I'll let you know how it shoots.

12-15-2002, 10:07 AM	#6
Swede Registered User Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Arizona Transplant Posts: 31	Ammo Controversy?

12-21-2002, 10:19 AM	#8
Swede Registered User Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Arizona Transplant Posts: 31	This would not apply to the 1940 era rifles marked K. KALE would it?

12-21-2002, 10:24 AM	#9
Dale Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Too Dang Hot, Arizona Posts: 4,284	What I've read and heard it applies only to the Commission 1888/38 rifles (and even some of the German GEW rifles, I'm told) since they were made long before high pressure cartridges. Some of the 88/38s were reworked to handle the newer rounds but no one seems to be able o distinguish which ones were. One of the biggest problems here is that the Turks had very few guns to begin with and also that most gunsmiths are unfamiliar with them as a whole to really become proficient in diagnosis and working on them. 1940 era rifles whould be fine with the ammo issue as long as the chambers spec out OK and everything else is gun worthy. __________________ "It confuses me how some people can vigorously go against the 2nd. Amendment and still call themselves patriotic"-me Last edited by Dale; 12-21-2002 at 10:27 AM.

12-21-2002, 10:32 AM	#10
Swede Registered User Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Arizona Transplant Posts: 31	Thanks Dale, that answers my qustion. My Turks should be OK as they are all forty's production. Guess the problem with the 88's must be similar to the heat treatment problems with the old turn of the century 03's.........Swede.

12-21-2002, 11:25 AM	#11
Calvin Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Columbus, Ohio Posts: 2,073	The main concern is that the older Commission bores were .318 (J). The Germans changed that in the early 1900's to a bore diameter of .323 (JS), which was a more powerful round. The really confusing part is that some Turk Mausers were made from an inferior ordnance steel that was not very strong. The exact manufacturing dates are not well known at all. Both of my Turks were made by Mauser in Germany and restamped with the Turkish crests. If you try to convert one, or buy parts, you need to contact a very knowledegable gunsmith as certain parts are not available for certain variations of the Turks. Midway U.S.A. is a good place to check out. They helped me on my rebuild 2 years ago. It's not much, but I hope it helps. Enjoy it and let us know how she does! __________________ If you don't like cops, call your local crackhead for help next time!

12-29-2002, 04:03 PM	#13
Calvin Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Columbus, Ohio Posts: 2,073	The bullet controversy is why the 8mm never really took off in the U.S.. The American factory loads for it are very low compared to the European loading. In reality, the 8mm is on par with the venerable .30-06 as far as power is concerned. The SAAMI specs for the 8mm were developed around the fact that some shooters may try to inadvertantly fire the .323 round in a .318 bore. As such, the factory fodder is low powered. __________________ If you don't like cops, call your local crackhead for help next time!

12-29-2002, 08:52 PM	#14
Swede Registered User Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Arizona Transplant Posts: 31	Well, My son and I tool her to the range on X-Mas Eve and put ten rounds through her. The five at rounds at 50-yds punched out close to one hole! and the five at 100-yds held a good 1-inch group. I would have taken a few more shots but I was in a hurray and had to go, but I am happy at what she did compared to my well used Turk 38's!..........Swede.