Scout M44 Transformation

Ellsworth · 03-08-2008, 01:29 AM

So i've been wanting to change the M44 I got into a hunting rifle more practical for modern uses, so I got all the parts in today and put it together, i'll try my best to post some pics and the finished product encase someone else is thinking about doing the same thing.

Call me bubba if you want, but this 53 Hungarian was very far from being a prize

.

Parts List (Prices include shipping):

ATI Monte Carlo Stock: $59.94
New Century Optics 2-7 x 32 LER Scope with rings: $48.99
New Century rear scope mount: $16.99
Total Conversion: $125.92

The Original, hate to mess with it...but yeah here goes:

So first things first, I started out by "attempting" to remove the front scope mount and site, I say attempt because well I failed, they're still there so I might have to ::gasp:: put the dremel to it tomorrow.

Two pins next to the stock this was the easy part..:

Next I put the no smithing scope mount for the rear sight using a clamp to hold the mount in position would work best the steel plate is ridiculously hard to push down by hand and align the screws, by using a screw driver allen wrench worked the best for me probably took about half the time of the whole project.

Next a standard level to set the mount, the set screws actually hit he metal on the receiver, I would not advise this mount for anything of high quality, the S & K mount is much less abrasive.

Next came the stock, it might need some milling or carving to make it lay just right, the barrel floats slightly in the forearm, but i'm debating if that is the way they designed it or just how it worked out, I may bed the barrel later as suggested in earlier posts, If I do i'll post here on that as well.

Finished product! Not bad for a first gun project not knowing what i'm doing ... Hopefully by tomorrow i'll have the lug off and/or grinded down out of the way.

I just like the look and feel of it, the NCstar scope is much better than I thought it would be and we'll see how the scope mount works out after a few rounds. I'll post some patterns after I get to shooting it.

I think some coyotes, deer and elk are markin their territory earlier than they want to,

I love these little carbines, i'm going to have to pick up a high grade one for display.

Ellsworth

ArkansasHunter · 03-08-2008, 01:37 AM

Ellsworth can't you take a propane torch and heat the sites up some and then take a rubber mallet and knock them off.
Thats what I did to a Mauser rifle I have ? LOL

The stock looks great and I like what you did. The M44 is the Mossin I would like to have.
Good job feller !...A.H

Mooseman684 · 03-08-2008, 01:38 AM

If you are good and steady with a Dremel and a cutoff wheel, cutting those mount ears off would work...

SwedeSteve · 03-08-2008, 05:15 AM

So far, so good!

texnmidwest · 03-08-2008, 06:08 AM

That is actually a nice looking set up!

Not experienced with metal work but if the techniques with wood carry over I would advice using the dremel slowly cutting a little at a time. Takes longer but one can always cut more away...hard to add more though. I would also advise using a Foredom rotary tool if you have one. Or adding a shaft drive to your dremel. Shaft drive adds a little more control. Foredom adds more power and variable speed.

just_a_car · 03-08-2008, 06:12 AM

Lookin' good there!

Should probably take the barrel bands off, too, since they don't serve any function anymore.

Ferroflame · 03-08-2008, 10:42 AM

Very Nice. ^_^

ArkansasHunter · 03-08-2008, 10:44 AM

I agree with JAC the barrel bands need to go.

Geo M44 · 03-08-2008, 11:19 AM

Just a couple of future tips:

1. The mount was made as a universal mount. The second rear elevation screw is for the longer rear-site mount on the 91/30. Used on the carbines it only makes setting the elevation more difficult as the forward elevation screw is the contact point at the back of the rear sight mount.

2. It sounds like you left the rear sight spring in place (as you had to use a clamp to hold the mount down). If that is the case, next time take it out with the rear sight. The mount will drop right in.

3. Cut the mount to the length required. having a bunch of overhang just makes it hard to clean and oil the breech end of the barrel, and hides the markings.

I posted this picture on the other site, and maybe it will help future modifiers. Personally I like the original stock but the composit stocks seem to work ok as well.

Ellsworth · 03-11-2008, 09:28 AM

I finally got the bayo lug off with a LARGE cold chisel and a hammer.

I set the barrel into a padded vice and held the barrel with the pinky and ring fingers while holding the chisel with the index thumb and middle, this held the barrel level and allowed me to hit the chisel head on, the lug came off in about 10 minutes. It's key to really smack the pewaddles out of it with their sturdy construction if you hit it square you will not mess up the gun, disassemble the trigger mount as much as possible, I didn't and ended up throwing the trigger pin out of the block...

I haven't removed the excess on the mount, I might later on but the scope is so large that even without the mount being so large the cleaning issues will remain, Plus the rings are pretty wide set with this scope so I might or might not.

Geo M44 · 03-11-2008, 02:59 PM

Definately different. Looks great. Have you taken it to the range yet?

I'm still working on a Claro walnut stock from Richards, but can't do a thing until my chest heals all the way (maybe late spring). The works from my 1947 M44 (shown earlier with scope) will go into that stock.

Again, looks great.

blue109 · 03-14-2008, 03:18 PM

wow. you didnt get bashed for posting a pic of a scouted mosin!! very nice. my only observation is that the scope mount you used looks to be one of the ebay style ones. they have a tendancy to loose zero on a regular basis. there is a guy on the mosin boards going by the name M39SCOUT who makes custom mounts just like that but with side supports. ive had mine on for a few hundred rounds and its rock solid. something to think about if you have trouble staying on target. otherwise it looks sweet.

fullMetalJack · 03-14-2008, 03:29 PM

sweet job man!

R5CYA · 03-14-2008, 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blue109

wow. you didnt get bashed for posting a pic of a scouted mosin!!

LOL! this is the gun and games forum. there's no bubba bashing here!

RANGE REPORTS, PLEASE!

Geo M44 · 03-14-2008, 04:16 PM

It is my theory (and found it to be true in my case) is that when using the scout scope "universal" mount on an M44, if you use both the rearmost elevation screw (which touches the breach (fat part) of the barrel) AND the inner rear elevation screw (which touches the back of the rear sight mount trench) it's almost impossible to keep a stable elevation for more than a few outings. This is because the contact point for the rearmost elevation screw is round so the mount has a tendancy to shift left or right causing both windage and elevation errors.

Everybody seems to think that you need to use all three elevation screws when in fact you don't (and shouldn't). This is a universal mount and the manufacturer supplies harware for any contingency.

The inner rear elevation screw makes solid contact on the flat area of the rear sight mount (for a reason), so is inherently stable in both planes.

If you use only the front and inner rear elevation screws (i.e. M38, M39, M44) then the mount (in my experience) is rock steady (and you don't scratch the receiver part of the barrlel). I'm pretty sure that the rearmost elevation screw was designed to be used on the longer 91/30 rear sight mount, but haven't tried it on the 91/30 yet.

Waddya think?

Ellsworth · 03-14-2008, 10:02 PM

It would make sense for the extended mount on a longer rifle, i'm probably going to take it out on sunday, hopefully my local free range is open so I can post some POI's i'll probably remove the excess on the mount as you suggest GEO it would just look better as well, but for this sunday i'll probably just screw the back elevation screw all the way up so it doesn't touch and secure the front two down tight, hopefully it will help me keep the zero.

I guess we'll see!

Thanks for the tip blue109, if this mount gets thrown off I will have to see if I can get one of those modified mounts.

Ellsworth

R5CYA · 03-14-2008, 10:50 PM

hopefully it'll stay where you put it. if not, the ones blue109 is talking about are darrels scout mount and they are REALLY nice. not cheap. but NICE!

spurrit · 03-14-2008, 10:56 PM

It may be lipstick on a pig, but it's fun, ain't it? I have a lot of fun on worthless projects.

SwedeSteve · 03-14-2008, 11:02 PM

Well, I wouldn't call it worthless.

spurrit · 03-14-2008, 11:16 PM

By worthless, I mean that he's not really in danger of making a profit, other than the pleasure of doing it. Oftentimes, that's the best kinda profit.

03-08-2008, 01:29 AM	#1
Ellsworth Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Cheney, Washington Posts: 108	Scout M44 Transformation So i've been wanting to change the M44 I got into a hunting rifle more practical for modern uses, so I got all the parts in today and put it together, i'll try my best to post some pics and the finished product encase someone else is thinking about doing the same thing. Call me bubba if you want, but this 53 Hungarian was very far from being a prize . Parts List (Prices include shipping): ATI Monte Carlo Stock: $59.94 New Century Optics 2-7 x 32 LER Scope with rings: $48.99 New Century rear scope mount: $16.99 Total Conversion: $125.92 The Original, hate to mess with it...but yeah here goes: So first things first, I started out by "attempting" to remove the front scope mount and site, I say attempt because well I failed, they're still there so I might have to ::gasp:: put the dremel to it tomorrow. Two pins next to the stock this was the easy part..: Next I put the no smithing scope mount for the rear sight using a clamp to hold the mount in position would work best the steel plate is ridiculously hard to push down by hand and align the screws, by using a screw driver allen wrench worked the best for me probably took about half the time of the whole project. Next a standard level to set the mount, the set screws actually hit he metal on the receiver, I would not advise this mount for anything of high quality, the S & K mount is much less abrasive. Next came the stock, it might need some milling or carving to make it lay just right, the barrel floats slightly in the forearm, but i'm debating if that is the way they designed it or just how it worked out, I may bed the barrel later as suggested in earlier posts, If I do i'll post here on that as well. Finished product! Not bad for a first gun project not knowing what i'm doing ... Hopefully by tomorrow i'll have the lug off and/or grinded down out of the way. I just like the look and feel of it, the NCstar scope is much better than I thought it would be and we'll see how the scope mount works out after a few rounds. I'll post some patterns after I get to shooting it. I think some coyotes, deer and elk are markin their territory earlier than they want to, I love these little carbines, i'm going to have to pick up a high grade one for display. Ellsworth

03-08-2008, 01:38 AM	#3
Mooseman684 Super Moderator Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Alaska Wilderness Posts: 9,653 Images: 2	If you are good and steady with a Dremel and a cutoff wheel, cutting those mount ears off would work... __________________ You know you might be facing your doom,when all you get is a click when you're expecting a BOOM!

03-08-2008, 05:15 AM	#4
SwedeSteve Bullet Maintenance !! Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: The anchor point, Alaska Posts: 10,309 Images: 1	So far, so good! __________________ Thank God we don't get as much Government as we pay for! -Will Rogers

03-08-2008, 06:08 AM	#5
texnmidwest Listen to yur Inner Hippo Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: South east Wisconsin Posts: 3,403	That is actually a nice looking set up! Not experienced with metal work but if the techniques with wood carry over I would advice using the dremel slowly cutting a little at a time. Takes longer but one can always cut more away...hard to add more though. I would also advise using a Foredom rotary tool if you have one. Or adding a shaft drive to your dremel. Shaft drive adds a little more control. Foredom adds more power and variable speed. __________________ "Quando Omni Flunkus Moritati" (If all else fails play dead)

03-08-2008, 06:12 AM	#6
just_a_car Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Edmonds, WA Posts: 3,515	Lookin' good there! Should probably take the barrel bands off, too, since they don't serve any function anymore. __________________

03-08-2008, 01:37 AM	#2
ArkansasHunter Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: South Arkansas Posts: 10,684	Ellsworth can't you take a propane torch and heat the sites up some and then take a rubber mallet and knock them off. Thats what I did to a Mauser rifle I have ? LOL The stock looks great and I like what you did. The M44 is the Mossin I would like to have. Good job feller !...A.H

03-08-2008, 10:42 AM	#7
Ferroflame Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Kentucky Posts: 382	Very Nice. ^_^

03-08-2008, 10:44 AM	#8
ArkansasHunter Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: South Arkansas Posts: 10,684	I agree with JAC the barrel bands need to go.

03-11-2008, 09:28 AM	#10
Ellsworth Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Cheney, Washington Posts: 108	I finally got the bayo lug off with a LARGE cold chisel and a hammer. I set the barrel into a padded vice and held the barrel with the pinky and ring fingers while holding the chisel with the index thumb and middle, this held the barrel level and allowed me to hit the chisel head on, the lug came off in about 10 minutes. It's key to really smack the pewaddles out of it with their sturdy construction if you hit it square you will not mess up the gun, disassemble the trigger mount as much as possible, I didn't and ended up throwing the trigger pin out of the block... I haven't removed the excess on the mount, I might later on but the scope is so large that even without the mount being so large the cleaning issues will remain, Plus the rings are pretty wide set with this scope so I might or might not.

03-11-2008, 02:59 PM	#11
Geo M44 Senior Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: The Desert Posts: 2,176	Definately different. Looks great. Have you taken it to the range yet? I'm still working on a Claro walnut stock from Richards, but can't do a thing until my chest heals all the way (maybe late spring). The works from my 1947 M44 (shown earlier with scope) will go into that stock. Again, looks great.

03-14-2008, 03:18 PM	#12
blue109 Registered User Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 2	wow. you didnt get bashed for posting a pic of a scouted mosin!! very nice. my only observation is that the scope mount you used looks to be one of the ebay style ones. they have a tendancy to loose zero on a regular basis. there is a guy on the mosin boards going by the name M39SCOUT who makes custom mounts just like that but with side supports. ive had mine on for a few hundred rounds and its rock solid. something to think about if you have trouble staying on target. otherwise it looks sweet.

03-14-2008, 03:29 PM	#13
fullMetalJack Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Colorado Posts: 119	sweet job man! __________________ -What we do in life echoes in eternity...

03-14-2008, 04:16 PM	#15
Geo M44 Senior Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: The Desert Posts: 2,176	It is my theory (and found it to be true in my case) is that when using the scout scope "universal" mount on an M44, if you use both the rearmost elevation screw (which touches the breach (fat part) of the barrel) AND the inner rear elevation screw (which touches the back of the rear sight mount trench) it's almost impossible to keep a stable elevation for more than a few outings. This is because the contact point for the rearmost elevation screw is round so the mount has a tendancy to shift left or right causing both windage and elevation errors. Everybody seems to think that you need to use all three elevation screws when in fact you don't (and shouldn't). This is a universal mount and the manufacturer supplies harware for any contingency. The inner rear elevation screw makes solid contact on the flat area of the rear sight mount (for a reason), so is inherently stable in both planes. If you use only the front and inner rear elevation screws (i.e. M38, M39, M44) then the mount (in my experience) is rock steady (and you don't scratch the receiver part of the barrlel). I'm pretty sure that the rearmost elevation screw was designed to be used on the longer 91/30 rear sight mount, but haven't tried it on the 91/30 yet. Waddya think? Last edited by Geo M44; 03-14-2008 at 04:25 PM.

03-14-2008, 10:02 PM	#16
Ellsworth Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Cheney, Washington Posts: 108	It would make sense for the extended mount on a longer rifle, i'm probably going to take it out on sunday, hopefully my local free range is open so I can post some POI's i'll probably remove the excess on the mount as you suggest GEO it would just look better as well, but for this sunday i'll probably just screw the back elevation screw all the way up so it doesn't touch and secure the front two down tight, hopefully it will help me keep the zero. I guess we'll see! Thanks for the tip blue109, if this mount gets thrown off I will have to see if I can get one of those modified mounts. Ellsworth

03-14-2008, 10:50 PM	#17
R5CYA Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: San Bruno, Republic of Kalifornia Posts: 634	hopefully it'll stay where you put it. if not, the ones blue109 is talking about are darrels scout mount and they are REALLY nice. not cheap. but NICE!

03-14-2008, 10:56 PM	#18
spurrit Banned Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 60	It may be lipstick on a pig, but it's fun, ain't it? I have a lot of fun on worthless projects.

03-14-2008, 11:02 PM	#19
SwedeSteve Bullet Maintenance !! Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: The anchor point, Alaska Posts: 10,309 Images: 1	Well, I wouldn't call it worthless. __________________ Thank God we don't get as much Government as we pay for! -Will Rogers

03-14-2008, 11:16 PM	#20
spurrit Banned Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 60	By worthless, I mean that he's not really in danger of making a profit, other than the pleasure of doing it. Oftentimes, that's the best kinda profit.