Just another 3rd model Dragoon.

madcratebuilder · 10-04-2009, 09:33 AM

I've been keeping an eye out for one of these shoulder stocked Dragoons for a long time. Finally found one. I know the military did field trials with 8 inch barreled Dragoons and shoulder stocks. I have many photo's of the originals. This ASM copy does a good job, particularly with the rear flip up sight. This is the first 18 inch I have seen. Handles nice considering the barrel length. The front sight was been changed, someone milled a slot then cold soldered a blade in. I did a quicky cleanup of the globes of solder and a cold blue patch, looks better. Scabbard cleaned good, I have some very nice wood to refinish. Shoulder stock has the normal dings but no gouges, so I can steam out the dings and oil it. All steel frame work on the shoulder stock, like the originals. Needs a new hand as carry up is short. I well re-blue this winter, need to decide if I'm going to defarb and if I'm going to leave it a 18 inch barrel.

SwedeSteve · 10-04-2009, 11:47 AM

Sweet Mama Joe !! Real nice !!

rebel727 · 10-04-2009, 01:24 PM

You da man MCB.

madcratebuilder · 10-04-2009, 02:18 PM

I think I want to cut the barrel back a bit, maybe a 12 inch barrel?????????? The front sight is a bit of a hack job. I would have to weld it up to make it look correct. If I weld it, then that area well not take bluing the same color.

JimBob · 10-04-2009, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by madcratebuilder

I think I want to cut the barrel back a bit, maybe a 12 inch barrel?????????? The front sight is a bit of a hack job. I would have to weld it up to make it look correct. If I weld it, then that area well not take bluing the same color.

Is the barrel thick enough to cut a dovetail in?I remember seeing some pictures of original Colt's revolvers with long barrels having a front sight set in a dovetail,maybe on a SAA.It did not look bad.Would give a period look.

Iron_Colonel · 10-04-2009, 03:23 PM

Well whatever you do, it looks great. Looks like some fun to shoot too!

rebel727 · 10-04-2009, 03:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimBob

Is the barrel thick enough to cut a dovetail in?I remember seeing some pictures of original Colt's revolvers with long barrels having a front sight set in a dovetail,maybe on a SAA.It did not look bad.Would give a period look.

He said somebody milled a slot and soldered the front sight in so the slot would have to be welded up and then dovetailed or the sight would have to be welded in.

JimBob · 10-04-2009, 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rebel727

He said somebody milled a slot and soldered the front sight in so the slot would have to be welded up and then dovetailed or the sight would have to be welded in.

Well,I missed that,was too busy looking at the pictures.

LOL I'm thinking about getting a percussion revolver myself,love looking at the pictures.

Love that scabbard.

madcratebuilder · 10-04-2009, 05:03 PM

Original Walkers had a front dovetail, after that they had a German silver blade on Dragoons and holster frame revolvers. The pocket frame revolvers had a German silver post. This is C&B, I don't know about SAA's. Seeing what has survived from that period people did custom work back then. I've seen some nicly cut down .44 and .36 holster frames that would fit in a coat pocket with no problem.

nathangdad · 10-04-2009, 06:48 PM

Personally, I would leave the longer barrel.

I do understand it would be more in line with historical accuracy to have the shorter barrel.

However, you do have a setup for longer range accuracy and that to me is the trump card.

Best wished on whatever choice you make.

Cyrano · 10-04-2009, 06:57 PM

Given what Rooster Cogburn had to say about a more conventionally-configured Colt's Dragoon, I would love to hear what he'd have had to say about that long-barrelled model! It puts me in mind of a Buntline SAA, but with that shoulder stock it's much more like a revolving rifle than a pistol. Could you give us some history on its design and use by the Union Army?

JimBob · 10-04-2009, 09:18 PM

A little information from R.L.Wilson's The Book of Colt Firearms on the Third Model Dragoon-The only shoulder stocked Dragoon model was the third model.There is no factory record of a barrel length longer than eight inches.Standard length on U.S.Army purchased pistols was seven and one half inches.The last government contract for this model was May 5,1856 for 50 pistols.Out of a total contract for aprox.4330 starting with the May 8,1851 contract for 2000 pistols till the last contract of May 5,1856 for 50 pistols only 946 were for "pistol carbines".They were issued in pairs.By the time of the Civil War the military designation of Dragoon was fast disappearing.Although some of these certainly saw usage in the war,the primary issue handgun would have been the Colt Model 1860 Army in .44 cal for the U.S.Army.The dragoon models were discontinued in 1861 with the introduction of what was called at that time the improved dragoon model,the Model 1860.

madcratebuilder · 10-29-2009, 08:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimBob

A little information from R.L.Wilson's The Book of Colt Firearms on the Third Model Dragoon-The only shoulder stocked Dragoon model was the third model.There is no factory record of a barrel length longer than eight inches.Standard length on U.S.Army purchased pistols was seven and one half inches.The last government contract for this model was May 5,1856 for 50 pistols.Out of a total contract for aprox.4330 starting with the May 8,1851 contract for 2000 pistols till the last contract of May 5,1856 for 50 pistols only 946 were for "pistol carbines".They were issued in pairs.By the time of the Civil War the military designation of Dragoon was fast disappearing.Although some of these certainly saw usage in the war,the primary issue handgun would have been the Colt Model 1860 Army in .44 cal for the U.S.Army.The dragoon models were discontinued in 1861 with the introduction of what was called at that time the improved dragoon model,the Model 1860.

Thanks jimbob. I guess I should buy Wilsons book, sounds like a lot of detailed info. I think I well leave the barrel it's current length, not many long ones around. I have some 3rd gen Colt Dragoons and I think I well cut the frame of one for the shoulder stock and try and find a rear sight. I sure would like to mount the shoulder stock on my Walker put no way I'm going the cut on a 2nd gen.

10-04-2009, 09:33 AM	#1
madcratebuilder Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Northern Orygun Posts: 2,395 Images: 3	Just another 3rd model Dragoon. I've been keeping an eye out for one of these shoulder stocked Dragoons for a long time. Finally found one. I know the military did field trials with 8 inch barreled Dragoons and shoulder stocks. I have many photo's of the originals. This ASM copy does a good job, particularly with the rear flip up sight. This is the first 18 inch I have seen. Handles nice considering the barrel length. The front sight was been changed, someone milled a slot then cold soldered a blade in. I did a quicky cleanup of the globes of solder and a cold blue patch, looks better. Scabbard cleaned good, I have some very nice wood to refinish. Shoulder stock has the normal dings but no gouges, so I can steam out the dings and oil it. All steel frame work on the shoulder stock, like the originals. Needs a new hand as carry up is short. I well re-blue this winter, need to decide if I'm going to defarb and if I'm going to leave it a 18 inch barrel. __________________ Make peace with your past so it won't screw up the present.

10-04-2009, 11:47 AM	#2
SwedeSteve Suspected Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Anchortown, Alaska Posts: 23,576 Images: 1	Sweet Mama Joe !! Real nice !! __________________ Thank God we don't get as much Government as we pay for! -Will Rogers

10-04-2009, 01:24 PM	#3
rebel727 Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Heidelberg, Mississippi Posts: 2,209	You da man MCB. __________________ North-1 South-0 HALFTIME!

10-04-2009, 02:18 PM	#4
madcratebuilder Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Northern Orygun Posts: 2,395 Images: 3	I think I want to cut the barrel back a bit, maybe a 12 inch barrel?????????? The front sight is a bit of a hack job. I would have to weld it up to make it look correct. If I weld it, then that area well not take bluing the same color. __________________ Make peace with your past so it won't screw up the present.
	1 members found this post helpful.

10-04-2009, 03:23 PM	#6
Iron_Colonel Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Washington St. Posts: 3,282	Well whatever you do, it looks great. Looks like some fun to shoot too! __________________ Mosin Nagant evangelist on a mission to convert YOU!

10-04-2009, 05:03 PM	#9
madcratebuilder Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Northern Orygun Posts: 2,395 Images: 3	Original Walkers had a front dovetail, after that they had a German silver blade on Dragoons and holster frame revolvers. The pocket frame revolvers had a German silver post. This is C&B, I don't know about SAA's. Seeing what has survived from that period people did custom work back then. I've seen some nicly cut down .44 and .36 holster frames that would fit in a coat pocket with no problem. __________________ Make peace with your past so it won't screw up the present.

10-04-2009, 06:48 PM	#10
nathangdad Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 5,175	Every coin has two sides Personally, I would leave the longer barrel. I do understand it would be more in line with historical accuracy to have the shorter barrel. However, you do have a setup for longer range accuracy and that to me is the trump card. Best wished on whatever choice you make.

10-04-2009, 06:57 PM	#11
Cyrano Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: New York Posts: 6,933	Given what Rooster Cogburn had to say about a more conventionally-configured Colt's Dragoon, I would love to hear what he'd have had to say about that long-barrelled model! It puts me in mind of a Buntline SAA, but with that shoulder stock it's much more like a revolving rifle than a pistol. Could you give us some history on its design and use by the Union Army?

10-04-2009, 09:18 PM	#12
JimBob Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: East Central Illinois Posts: 725	A little information from R.L.Wilson's The Book of Colt Firearms on the Third Model Dragoon-The only shoulder stocked Dragoon model was the third model.There is no factory record of a barrel length longer than eight inches.Standard length on U.S.Army purchased pistols was seven and one half inches.The last government contract for this model was May 5,1856 for 50 pistols.Out of a total contract for aprox.4330 starting with the May 8,1851 contract for 2000 pistols till the last contract of May 5,1856 for 50 pistols only 946 were for "pistol carbines".They were issued in pairs.By the time of the Civil War the military designation of Dragoon was fast disappearing.Although some of these certainly saw usage in the war,the primary issue handgun would have been the Colt Model 1860 Army in .44 cal for the U.S.Army.The dragoon models were discontinued in 1861 with the introduction of what was called at that time the improved dragoon model,the Model 1860. Last edited by JimBob; 10-05-2009 at 12:17 AM.