Racial Profiling by Officers?

[pmspinnerb8]

http://news.mysanantonio.com/story.c...113961&xld=180

I just read this on the local newspaper site. This study kind of rubbed me the wrong way when you consider that this city has a larger "minority" population than a "majority" population. The chances are higher that you are going to pull a minority over for speeding. Tax money at work to find answers to questions that common sense should answer.

[Dale]

In my mind the claim of racial profiling is a way for a group of people to put so much pressure on the departments to get them to back off.

In my mind there is only one PRIMARY reason for that.....less hassle = the possibility to intimidate and the ability to conduct illegal operations with less concern or law enforcement detection.

If Officers are stopping or interviewing people based soley on color, neighborhood reputation, type of vehicle they drive, etc. that IS profiling.

Although, years ago we used to have a saying, "If two people are together it's a conversation. If three or more are grouped together it's a conspiracy." Of course, that is not necessarily true but that was just an old saying we had to lay to rest because of the higher ups getting pressure.

Often a cop has to rely on gut instinct and,through training and because of past experiences, that gut instinct is often accurate. I think if they suspect something is amiss they are obligated to check it out. Someone's life could depend on it.

If nothing looks suspicious and it doesn't 'feel' wrong then they need to leave it alone.

If they are stopping or interviewing a certain group of people based on investigative information that people of that group may, or are, responsible then that's clearly a viable investigative technique.

If they are innocent they need to suck it up and go on with life.

[Oxford]

pmspinnerb8:

Here's how I see this situation. In many cases, it would seem unlikely that LEO's have enough time to I.D. the race of a driver. When running radar guns it would seem that the officer has to watch the "readout" screen accurately as a first responsibility. To initially take notice of the driver's race would distract considerably from the already short time allowed when making a "normal" traffic stop.

Also, as you aluded, when living in an area where minorities, as considered to be nationally, are in fact the majority, those arrest statistics will certainly be likely to be skewed toward more minorities being arrested.

Of course, there's always minority groups who point to this arrest record as being the result of racial profiling.

[Doglips]

I've always thought the highway patrol had my picture and got extra points for finding me.....for a few years I seem to be haveing a lot of road side chats about my driveing style

Seriously Im sure there is a cop somewear doing this...not all probly not a majority but 1 or 2. I would ???? if some people dont go out of their way to attract attention...loud music ....lights....actions....what ever. Seems like acting saspicious would get you pulled over...comeing from a bad area etc. Im always amazed that cops dont park outside of bars at closeing time and just do a big round up each friday and saturday night. It would also seem like cops working a certin area would pull over more of one race than the other.....just happens to be the people driveing in that area.

[pmspinnerb8]

Officer to a speeder, "I've been waiting for you all day."

Speeder, "Well, I got here as fast as I could!"

Officer is laughing so hard he doesn't write the ticket.
I thought it was pretty funny.

[Dale]

Ox, I personally made referrence to situations of personal contact calls, observations of individual or groups, etc.

Of course, when monitoring traffic perspective changes, somewhat.

But it's still able to 'profile' motorists even in traffic enforcement situations.

edit: I'll say something that might well get feathers ruffled but if ANY Officer ever says they don't have SOME degree of preconceived perceptions about certain groups and people and the stereo-types of illegal activities they're lying out of their teeth.

Many Officers will deny it and steer clear of the discussion these days but human nature is human nature.

And this same human trait exists in every one of us.

The word 'minority' does not just apply to color and I'm not referring to just color here. I'm also referring to ethic groups, religious groups, behavioral groups, age groups, etc.

We need not go into specific situations of profiling activity and what one might assume but search your own hearts.

I know if I were approaching my home (out in the middle of nowhere---not a populated or well traveled neighborhood) and saw a KNOWN no-good drug user driving down my road only to find out in a matter of moments my home had been burglarize you can bet the first thing I'd think is that it was him that did it.

That's human nature. Not necessairly correct thinking but that's exactly how most would think.

[Dale]

DL, I can relate to what you might think about the staters singling you out.

But, in all reality, I doubt that is happening.

They have a miriad of things going on each day and I don't think they would have the ambition to consciously key in on you and look just for you without just cause.

It's possible, of course, and that would also depend on the amount of extra activity they have going on and if you're well known in a small area, etc.

You might dislike me saying this but maybe there is something about your driving that draws attention, lol, (and I said that in friendship and with tongue in cheek...yepper).

[Oxford]

Dale...your input comes from experience most of us don't have. Good to hear your views.

Ox:nod:

I always figured that if you look like trouble...you'll find trouble..and if you're not paying attention you could find yourself in the middle of a great big mess of trouble :nod:

[oneastrix]

:quote: Of the 39 locations, Lamberth found four areas where officers stopped blacks at rates that were higher than their proportion of drivers. The areas are near Broadway and Mulberry Avenue; Interstate 10 and Wurzbach Road; Interstate 10 and Fredericksburg Road; and Lombrano and Hamilton streets.

The review showed two areas where Hispanics were stopped at higher rates: U.S. 90 and Military Drive, and near North Star Mall. :quote:

LMAO....hmm.....well....let's see.........Broadway and Mulberry.....nothing but Brackenridge Park homo's, crack heads, and hookers.....


US90 and Military Drive....pretty much all Hispanic over there.

North Star Mall area....well, that's tough because it's right on Loop 410.....all kinds of people coming thru there.

IH10 and Fred Road....well, that pretty much goes both ways. Some decent places and some cra-holes as well.

I have no idea where Lombrano and Hamilton is.

[Dale]

Ox, one thing I've found over 28 years is that the old timers have a different thought and slant on things than many of the newer generation of Officers.

But one thing will remain consistant, I believe, is if you line up 50 Officers and posed a thought to them you're liable to come up with as many different responses, thoughts, philosophies, etc.

Setting aside, of course, training, policy, laws and politically correct responses.

Me...I was (and remain) OLD school. Pure and simple. I was often criticized for not making changes as they occurred in the political views and I told it like I saw it and didn't care if it struck nerves. And I received a lot of career flak over that.

All the more reason I looked forward to retirement.

I refused to compromise my ethics and kiss !!! and I was another old dinosaur (as I was sometimes affectionately...and sometimes not affectionately....referred to) they couldn't wait to replace with a puppet.

In a way I feel for the new Officers (like Matt) and those, like Lenny, who are considering getting out there in the trenches with their butts exposed to more than just the bad guy on the street and not being able to determine who is their back-up or who is their back stabber.

I feel my BP rising so I'd better take a break.

Dang, I promised my wife I'd quit talking cop shop chit and I was doing good until now, lol.

I apologize to all for this rant....I'm sorry.

[Oxford]

Take a break Dale and come on back. That was the best post I've read in a long time. Direct, honest, spoken after much experience, not PC, emotional, critical, and much more. Hey...maybe in 30 years or so Matt, Lenny2, and some other relatively new LEO's on G&G can tell it like that, too. They're doing a da mn job now so they'll only get better.

The last 10 years of my career I had an immediate boss who was just like that. He said what he thought, was forceful with his directives, demanded loyalty, was highly supportive of his subordinates, expected and demanded that subordinates work together as a team and a few other personal traits which I very much appreciated and supported.

As a result, he trusted that I would do what I said, that I would meet his goals, that I could be trusted with his private opinions and thoughts. In turn I tried to use the same traits in dealing with the 150+/- subordinates that worked for me.
Da mn! I miss that old team. Our system worked and we did the best possible job each day that we could do.

[Rufus Rhastus J]

there's nothing wrong with profileing. If it walks like a duck....but, i see how this tactic could be abused. Let's face it, some folks are just prone to be bad guys. That's the way it is. I expect the PC amoungst us will leap on me for that, saying I'm being racist, again..... But, the truth of the matter is, if you don't go there, you won't be caught there, like the crack house, bad side of town, ect. Yes, some are trapped but, darn few. Most like it just fine.:nod:

[Doglips]

Dale
since I learned too drive I have not had the road side meetings with FHP I use to....silly story when I was going to UCF I drove SR520 which was notiiourius for spped traps....I purchased a top of the line radar detector....the thing would go off if I got near a grocery store (radar on the automacit doors).....but police rada seemed to not bother it at all (this is before lasers).....They set up this big..20+ police car spped trap on a section of 520 that had a lot of crashes....more radar guns than you can imagin....of course I got the oppertunity to stop on the side of the road and hang out with a nice FHP officer while he filled out the ticket.....radar detector not makeing a sound....not a freaking beep....and Im watching moter cycle cops 10 ft from me zapping cars......the officer hand the ticket into the window for me to sign.....and the thing goes off the scale....the officer busted out laughing..."Boy thats things pretty good...it detected you getting a ticket" .... Needless to say it went to the pawn shop and the $$ went to the ticket.

[Oxford]

Doglips...that's a "humor forum" story for sure.