Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 03-08-2005, 12:37 AM   #1
Firearm Zealot
 
Dennis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Texas
Posts: 2,118
German magazine article claiming european cowardice in Iraq

Matthias Dapfner, Chief Executive of the huge German publisher Axel Springer AG, has written a blistering attack in DIE WELT, Germany's largest daily newspaper, against the timid reaction of Europe in the face of the Islamic threat.

EUROPE - THY NAME IS COWARDICE (Commentary by Mathias Dapfner CEO, Axel Springer, AG)

A few days ago Henry Broder wrote in Welt am Sonntag, "Europe - your family name is appeasement." It's a phrase you can't get out of your head because it's so terribly true.

Appeasement cost millions of Jews and non-Jews their lives as England and France, allies at the time, negotiated and hesitated too long before they noticed that Hitler had to be fought, not bound to toothless agreements.

Appeasement legitimized and stabilized Communism in the Soviet Union, then East Germany, then all the rest of Eastern Europe where for decades, inhuman, suppressive, murderous governments were glorified as the ideologically correct alternative to all other possibilities.

Appeasement crippled Europe when genocide ran rampant in Kosovo, and even though we had absolute proof of ongoing mass-murder, we Europeans debated and debated and debated, and were still debating when finally the Americans had to come from halfway around the world, into Europe yet again, and do our work for us.

Rather than protecting democracy in the Middle East, European appeasement, camouflaged behind the fuzzy word "equidistance," now countenances suicide bombings in Israel by fundamentalist Palestinians.

Appeasement generates a mentality that allows Europe to ignore nearly 500,000 victims of Saddam's torture and murder machinery and, motivated by the self-righteousness of the peace-movement, has the gall to issue bad grades to George Bush... Even as it is uncovered that the loudest critics of the American action in Iraq made illicit billions, no, TENS of billions, in the corrupt U. N. Oil-for-Food program.

And now we are faced with a particularly grotesque form of appeasement... How is Germany reacting to the escalating violence by Islamic fundamentalists in Holland and elsewhere? By suggesting that we really should have a "Muslim Holiday" in Germany.

I wish I were joking, but I am not. A substantial fraction of our (German) Government, and if the polls are to be believed, the German people, actually believe that creating an Official State "Muslim Holiday" will somehow spare us from the wrath of the fanatical Islamists.

One cannot help but recall Britain's Neville Chamberlain waving the laughable treaty signed by Adolf Hitler, and declaring European "Peace in our time".

What else has to happen before the European public and its political leadership get it? There is a sort of crusade underway, an especially perfidious crusade consisting of systematic attacks by fanatic Muslims, focused on civilians, directed against our free, open Western societies, and intent upon Western Civilization's utter destruction.

It is a conflict that will most likely last longer than any of the great military conflicts of the last century - a conflict conducted by an enemy that cannot be tamed by "tolerance" and "accommodation" but is actually spurred on by such gestures, which have proven to be, and will always be taken by the Islamists for signs of weakness.

Only two recent American Presidents had the courage needed for anti-appeasement: Reagan and Bush.

His American critics may quibble over the details, but we Europeans know the truth. We saw it first hand: Ronald Reagan ended the Cold War, freeing half of the German people from nearly 50 years of terror and virtual slavery. And Bush, supported only by the Social Democrat Blair, acting on moral conviction, recognized the danger in the Islamic War against democracy. His place in history will have to be evaluated after a number of years have passed.

In the meantime, Europe sits back with charismatic self-confidence in the multicultural corner, instead of defending liberal society's values and being an attractive center of power on the same playing field as the true great powers, America and China.

On the contrary - we Europeans present ourselves, in contrast to those "arrogant Americans", as the World Champions of "tolerance", which even (Germany's Interior Minister) Otto Schily justifiably criticizes. Why? Because we're so moral? I fear it's more because we're so materialistic, so devoid of a moral compass.

For his policies, Bush risks the fall of the dollar, huge amounts of additional national debt, and a massive and persistent burden on the American economy - because unlike almost all of Europe, Bush realizes what is at stake - literally everything.

While we criticize the "capitalistic robber barons" of America because they seem too sure of their priorities, we timidly defend our Social Welfare systems. Stay out of it! It could get expensive! We'd rather discuss reducing our 35-hour workweek or our dental coverage, or our 4 weeks of paid vacation... Or listen to those who preach about the need to "reach out to terrorists. To understand and forgive".

These days, Europe reminds me of an old woman who, with shaking hands, frantically hides her last pieces of jewelry when she notices a robber breaking into a neighbor's house.

Appeasement? Europe, thy name is Cowardice.
__________________
Submitted with respect to all
Dennis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2005, 12:40 AM   #2
Firearm Zealot
 
Dennis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Texas
Posts: 2,118
I am Glad Somebody over there can see the obvious shortfall of the european position on the war.
__________________
Submitted with respect to all
Dennis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2005, 01:02 AM   #3
Retired Moderator
 
Oxford's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Gladstone, Missouri
Posts: 15,705
That was an excellent article to post, Dennis. :right:
__________________
"If it's worth doing, it's worth doing right".
Oxford is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2005, 01:23 AM   #4
Firearm Zealot
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: socal
Posts: 1,818
good to know they're not all stupid.
gunssb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2005, 02:49 AM   #5
Firearm Zealot
 
Despoiler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: The Occupied Territory of California
Posts: 2,352
Wow! Did that really come out of Europe?
Despoiler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2005, 08:28 AM   #6
Firearm Zealot
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Somerset, Guntucky
Posts: 12,206
Angry

Quote:       Originally Posted by gunssb
good to know they're not all stupid.

just like here only the idiots get any press. i am sure there are many pro US folks in Europe, but they don't get the notice of the media.

Germany creating a Muslim Holiday, like thats going to make a difference???
__________________
MOE! LARRY! THE CHEESE!
Life Member the Elmer Fudd Hunt Club
PAPA G is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2005, 09:05 AM   #7
Retired Moderator
 
Shaun's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Nashville, TN
Posts: 8,868
looks like the germans are switching sides to the stronger economy following the 40% downturn in french export sales.
__________________
"Homeland Security is the responsibility of an armed citizen" ME
http://webpages.charter.net/s.s.v/
Shaun is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2005, 09:10 AM   #8
Senior Member
 
Rufus Rhastus J's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: West, Central Florida, Third World America
Posts: 6,342
I am surprised they (the germans) would attack the euro's actions (or, lack there of). It's great to see some back bone! Great post Dennis!
__________________
"They cannot be trusted.....The Romulans (our politicos) are without honor." Worf
Rufus Rhastus J is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2005, 10:55 AM   #9
Firearm Zealot
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: socal
Posts: 1,818
Talking

Quote:       Originally Posted by PAPA G
just like here only the idiots get any press. i am sure there are many pro US folks in Europe, but they don't get the notice of the media.
yup- just like all the folks in cali who are pro-gun...
gunssb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2005, 11:52 AM   #10
Retired Moderator
 
Oxford's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Gladstone, Missouri
Posts: 15,705
gunssb...You're one of many Californian's who support the pro-gun movement. I recognize that you're taking a lot of BS from g&g members, and other 2nd amendment supporters who erronously condemn all Californian's as an anti-gun state. Hang in there. We need individual people like you in California to keep fighting the home front battle in favor of favorable pro-gun legislation. :right: :cheer:
__________________
"If it's worth doing, it's worth doing right".
Oxford is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2005, 12:34 PM   #11
Firearm Zealot
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: socal
Posts: 1,818
thanks for the support Ox
gunssb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-09-2005, 02:13 AM   #12
Firearm Aficionado
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: CA
Posts: 886
Ox - If about half of the Pro-Gun people, that left California because of the Anti-Gun stance of the politicians, had stayed here, we might have been able to elect some real Pro-Gun politicians. We have many real Pro-Gun politicians, and they do the gun things like Skeet and Trap shooting, Sporting Clays, Target shooting and many of them are real hunters.

One of the problems we have here in California, with the NRA, is that the NRA seems to want to elect borderline Anti/Pro gunners, such as Schwarzenegger (who is really an Anti-Gun Kennedy RINO) so they can claim they elected the Governor (WHO IS PLAYING POLITICS?) rather than support a real Pro-Gun candidate. The ONLY Pro-Gun Candidate for Governor in the recall election, was State Senator Tom McClintock, and the NRA would not support him.

`
Gyrene is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-09-2005, 04:34 AM   #13
Firearm Enthusiast
 
Venanzio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: italy near Venice
Posts: 90
Quote:       Originally Posted by PAPA G
just like here only the idiots get any press. i am sure there are many pro US folks in Europe, but they don't get the notice of the media.

Certainly most Italians support Usa, I am one of them, but reporters show only the idiots most reporter are radical-chic they haven't seriously worked in their life not represent people but only themselves.
As well they are all anti-gun
Venanzio is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-09-2005, 05:26 AM   #14
Firearm Zealot
 
Big Dog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: North Florida - the Gunshine State!
Posts: 15,425
Venanzio, it sounds like the European reporters are cut from the same cloth as most in the USA.
I don't personally know anyone from the other European nations, but we have a few expatriate Brits here - they tend to be more Conservative and a couple are even gun owners/hunters/NRA members.
__________________
USAF - 1976 - 1980
USN - 1980 - 1986
FLDOE - 1990 - present
Big Dog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2008, 02:23 PM   #15
Firearm Enthusiast
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 6
Quote:       Originally Posted by PAPA G View Post
just like here only the idiots get any press. i am sure there are many pro US folks in Europe, but they don't get the notice of the media.
I happen to be a german who is VERY pro-gun and america. There are a FEW like me in germany still but the ones that are move to the US if they can afford too, so that makes fewer and fewer ppl back in germany to fight the euro-hatred of the US.

cali being an anti-gun state? yes but it can be much worse. Cali is getting closer and closer to euro-style gun "rights"... (that only police and millitary can have guns and if u have a gun u got it from the black market or your american friend).

Cali is more anti-millitary, mainly san fran. you really got to be low to insult a NATO millitary officer like me not just the GIs that go thru san fran. (u would expect the ppl in san fran wouldnt even know wht NATO is).
Klaus F. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2008, 03:05 PM   #16
Firearm Zealot
 
cremley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Southern New Mexico
Posts: 3,985
Quote:       Originally Posted by Klaus F. View Post
I happen to be a german who is VERY pro-gun and america. There are a FEW like me in germany still but the ones that are move to the US if they can afford too, so that makes fewer and fewer ppl back in germany to fight the euro-hatred of the US.

cali being an anti-gun state? yes but it can be much worse. Cali is getting closer and closer to euro-style gun "rights"... (that only police and millitary can have guns and if u have a gun u got it from the black market or your american friend).

Cali is more anti-millitary, mainly san fran. you really got to be low to insult a NATO millitary officer like me not just the GIs that go thru san fran. (u would expect the ppl in san fran wouldnt even know wht NATO is).
+1

one of my friends who lives in Dresden Germany always tells me about your "gun rights" and it makes me sad.

anyway, Welcome to Gun and Game!

Chris
__________________
Well done is better than well said - Benjamin Franklin
cremley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2008, 03:05 PM   #17
Firearm Zealot
 
Coeloptera's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 3,561
I'm just gonna throw one thing out here.

Until we went there, Iraq was not home to Islamic militant organizations because Hussein hated them and they undermined his dictatorship.

"For his policies, Bush risks the fall of the dollar, huge amounts of additional national debt, and a massive and persistent burden on the American economy - because unlike almost all of Europe, Bush realizes what is at stake - literally everything."

Yeah, way to go, Dubya. Way to stir up a hornets' nest that didn't exist there until we showed up.

Hussein was a bad guy, but he also stomped the militants down in his own country. We should have concentrated on them in other places because before we deposed him, fleeing to Iraq was not a good option for them. We could have trapped them in Afghanistan and played a tougher hand with Pakistan. Iran wasn't good for them either, because of the whole Shia/Sunni thing our administration seemed to have no clue about.

Appeasement won't work with the Islamic militants. But giving them a place to run to and regroup when we went for their initial leadership did not help us any. We should have left them with no options to but to try to run to stable countries that wouldn't have wanted them to come in. Then we could have stomped them into the dirt, cut off from any external support or places to flee to.

- Coeloptera
Coeloptera is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2008, 03:10 PM   #18
Firearm Enthusiast
 
Death Metal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Fredericksburg, VA
Posts: 227
Id like to see the link for that article is possible. could be one of those internet rumor articles .....
Death Metal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2008, 03:49 PM   #19
Firearm Zealot
 
cremley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Southern New Mexico
Posts: 3,985
Quote:       Originally Posted by Death Metal View Post
Id like to see the link for that article is possible. could be one of those internet rumor articles .....
+1
__________________
Well done is better than well said - Benjamin Franklin
cremley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2008, 03:53 PM   #20
Сергей Иванович Мосин.
 
FS00008's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Virginia
Posts: 2,456
snopes.com: Mathias Dopfner on Europe Cowardice
FS00008 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Gun & Game - The Friendliest Gun Forum on the Internet > General > The Powder Keg

Tags
article, claiming, cowardice, european, german, iraq, magazine

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:02 PM.




Recent Discussions

Connect with us!
Advertisement



"It don't cost nuthin' to be nice." -- Mike West