Old 06-10-2005, 06:29 PM   #1
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Proposed Bill Would Outlaw Corporal Punishment For Children

as a former DCF investigator...thats HRS, DHRS or KGB depending on your state I think this is going way to far...disaplin now..or incarserate later.

Spanking Illegal In Massachusetts?
Proposed Bill Would Outlaw Corporal Punishment For Children

POSTED: 6:58 am EDT June 8, 2005
UPDATED: 8:32 am EDT June 8, 2005

BOSTON -- Should parents be allowed to spank their children? Massachusetts lawmakers will be debating that question following the filing of a bill that would ban corporal punishment in the commonwealth.

NewsCenter 5's Kelly Tuthill reported that state Rep. James Marzilli, Jr., of Arlington, Mass., is one of the sponsors of the bill, which prohibits everything from spanking to "hot saucing," which involves putting undiluted Tabasco sauce in a child's mouth.

In April, a Plymouth, Mass., father landed on the front page of local papers and behind bars after he used a belt to spank his son Josh, 12.

"He forgot his book. I went upstairs, I got my belt. I came downstairs. I gave him three swats on the rear end, with his pants on, like any concerned parent would do, and scared him, of course, you know. Hopefully I got the point across," Charles Enloe said.

But now, lawmakers are considering making "the willfull infliction of physical pain on children under 18," illegal. The measure would prohibit corporal punishment including whipping, spanking and pinching. Also forbidden would be washing a child's mouth out with soap and administering electric shocks.

The bill comes two weeks after Brookline, Mass., Town Meeting passed a non-binding resolution encouraging parents not to spank. The Supreme Judicial Court addressed the issue after a Woburn, Mass., minister used a belt to spank his 9-year-old son. In 1999, he was cleared when the SJC ruled that parents have a right to spank their children if it does not cause substantial risk of injury.

The bill appears to be unprecedented. Supporters said it's all about preventing abuse, not prosecuting parents.

Copyright 2005 by TheBostonChannel. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.
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Old 06-11-2005, 04:22 AM   #2
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NewsCenter 5's Kelly Tuthill reported that state Rep. James Marzilli, Jr., of Arlington, Mass., is one of the sponsors of the bill, which prohibits everything from spanking to "hot saucing," which involves putting undiluted Tabasco sauce in a child's mouth.
I hope this genius doesn't get re-elected.
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Old 06-11-2005, 10:14 AM   #3
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kids are the parents concern...not the friggin' government!
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Old 06-11-2005, 11:06 AM   #4
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Where did the Tabasco and electric shock thing come from?
My parents kept me so scared they only had to whip me about three or four times in my chidhood. I almost feel left out.
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Old 06-11-2005, 01:06 PM   #5
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I didn't get the belt often growing up, but the few times I did, I deserved it!
Hey, I think I turned out okay . . . .

This is a family matter - the Guvmint has no place here. Spanking and discipline are good things, when it's warranted. Injury and unjustified punishment is a different matter.
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Old 06-11-2005, 02:08 PM   #6
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Another horrific act of violence involving children has rocked the country; in only 5 months this is the 4th deadly shooting of school children by other children. Juvenile violence has been growing slowly but steadily in the US in the past 10 to 15 years. What has happened to cause young prepubescent boys to cooly plan and carry out their lethal attacks on their school mates? Is it the erosion of moral values? Or is it a complex and compounded process we are seeing, caused by a number of factors - all moving in the same direction?.

The immediate response has been to introduce legislation allowing the state to try and sentence children as young as six, as adults, including the death penalty. This punitive attitude is part of our growing "law and order" society. Much wringing of hands, praying, and draconian punishment, unfortunately, may not keep this from happening again and again, if we do not look for the causes. There are similarities in the way we practice medicine and the way we treat juvenile violence: by putting all the resources into treating the end result, in medicine, and punishment for the juveniles, rather than preventive measures..

What is missing is some kind of medical and scientific assessment of these children - a specially appointed panel of experts in a variety of fields, perhaps. Not criminologists and DAs, but specialists in child development, environmental medicine, nutritional status, etc. The evidence for environmental causes is monumental..

CHEMICALS: It is standard American medical practice now to inoculate infants a few months old with a variety of chemicals with unknown toxicity. The evidence for the DPT-vaccine causing encephalitis (brain inflammation) is even acknowledged by the FDA and pediatricians, widely documented, and ignored. These vaccinations are constantly being added to - last year the Hepatitis vaccine, acknowledged to affect a small subset population of needle users, prostitutes, etc. This year, a vaccine to prevent ear "infections." Parents must be getting hep to the ineffectiveness of antibiotics and ready for a new approach. Never mind that most cases of otitis medea have been proven to be caused by an allergic reaction to cow's milk, not an infective agent. The dramatic rise in ADHD (learning disabilities) and autism should be a red flag to scientists and public health officials. Added to these injections of chemicals throughout childhood, is the steady assault on young bodies and minds with a staggering array of chemical drugs from Tylenol, other fever reducers, cough medicine, and now Ritalin, Prozac, and other anti-depressants, asthma drugs, etc, to the almost prophylactic use of antibiotics throughout childhood. Add the ubiquitous heavy metals, lead in the streets where they play, fluoride, not only in the water but used extensively by dentists as a prophylactic. The stuff is so toxic that the manufacturers of fluoride toothpaste have now actually put a warning label on the toothpaste tube: poison, do not swallow..

There is now a substantial body of evidence linking the estrogenic effects of chemicals to breast cancer. Surely, these hormone-like effects would be equally harmful and disruptive to the male hormone, testosterone. Add to that the untold amounts of steroids consumed in hamburgers, the staple diet of all American children. All of these chemicals have a disastrous effect on immature brains and nervous systems..

GUNS: Guns in kids' hands kill 5 kids every day. We've become accustomed to the slaughter and become numb to it. Much as the kids who watch violence on TV every day of their lives; they become desensitized, it's no longer anything to be upset about...it's all a game. Unfortunately, with almost every citizen in the country now armed, guns are readily accessible to children. No matter that they are locked up, that the children are "trained" in gun safety, none of these things will keep guns out of the hands of children now. Guns are glorified, made into toys, part of the culture. At what cost? Fourteen children a day..

They say a picture is worth a thousand words. shown on the news was a snapshot of the 13 yr. old in the recent Arkansas shooting, shown posing as a little boy, four or five years old, with a gun twice his size. He was also wearing army fatigues. The perfect National Rifle Association poster boy..

Another important factor is the economic necessity for both parents to work - leaving many children on their own after school. There were over 5,000 teens arrested in the past year in the 4 hours after school. We invest millions of dollars in schools - why not keep school recreational facilities open till dinner time? There are solutions and they cost less than one fighter plane..

There is no doubt that the estimated 18,000 images of violence seen by children on TV over their young years, has some effect. Billions of dollars in advertising are spent every year based on just that premise; that repetitious imagery makes people buy products - in this case, acceptance of guns and violence as ordinary. We know that consistent exposure to violence desensitizes, and probably brutalizes. And children tend to copy adult behavior - they even learn to shoot like adults - but they may not understand the difference between what they see, and actually killing a real person with a gun..

Our children are showing signs of what researcher Weston Price, DDS foresaw as a trend in the degeneration of the human species - from the radically depleted and processed diet consumed in the past 80 or so years. His research, as well as that of Pottinger and his cats, proved that a devitalized diet not only leads to a weakened body and illness, but has psychological manifestations as well, eroding moral and sexual behaviors. He must be thrashing in his grave these days. And his research was done well before the onslaught of chemicals in the environment, before violence on TV, and the easy accessibility of weapons. Add on these factors and you have a recipe for disaster. What an intolerable burden we have placed on our children. Does anyone care?.

They are the future. .

Article by Irene Alleger, Editor.
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Old 06-11-2005, 06:15 PM   #7
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"GUNS: Guns in kids' hands kill 5 kids every day. We've become accustomed to the slaughter and become numb to it. Much as the kids who watch violence on TV every day of their lives; they become desensitized, it's no longer anything to be upset about...it's all a game. Unfortunately, with almost every citizen in the country now armed, guns are readily accessible to children. No matter that they are locked up, that the children are "trained" in gun safety, none of these things will keep guns out of the hands of children now. Guns are glorified, made into toys, part of the culture. At what cost? Fourteen children a day.."

Obvious and demonstrably inaccurate statements from a rabid anti-gun writer . . . but I digress.

The blatant drugging of 'troubled kids' these days, the total lack of discipline and direction, especially when both parents work. The insistence on making the schools try to teach morality and ideals - this is the parents' job.
The unwillingness to realize that some kids are simply 'bad seeds' - despite what the self-important psycho-doctors say.
People who simply can't see the indicators that their kids are having trouble, and it's getting to a dangerous level.

Looking at today's society, we really haven't progressed much at all. High tech toys are a sorry excuse for the state of our civilization.

Time to step off the soapbox now . . .
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Old 06-11-2005, 06:38 PM   #8
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9-Year-Old Girl Accused of Killing Playmate
Tuesday, May 31, 2005

Lionel Tate Ordered Held Without Bond
NEW YORK — A 9-year-old girl fatally stabbed an 11-year-old girl in the chest with a steak knife during a fight over a ball, authorities said.

The 9-year-old, a fourth-grader whose name wasn't released, was charged with manslaughter.

Police spokesman Paul J. Browne told The New York Times that he was "unaware of anyone younger implicated in such an act in New York City."

The victim, Queen Washington, 11, was pronounced dead at a hospital. Family members said the fifth-grader was a straight-A student who loved books, dancing and playing double Dutch jump rope.

"I don't understand how this could happen," Joyce Porter, Queen's grandmother, told the Times. She said Queen's mother had called her earlier that afternoon. "She told me, 'Queen is dead,"' Porter said, adding, "It was over a ball."

Queen's grandfather Earl Washington described her as the "star of the family. She was going places."

Relatives said the girls' mothers were best friends, and Queen had been invited to the 9-year-old's home in the East New York section of Brooklyn for a Memorial Day barbecue.
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Old 06-11-2005, 06:41 PM   #9
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Quote:       Originally Posted by Big Dog
Obvious and demonstrably inaccurate statements from a rabid anti-gun writer
I cut and pasted the whole article even though I didn't (and still don't) agree with all of it..it would have been disingenuous of me to edit it to my liking
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Old 06-11-2005, 06:46 PM   #10
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7-Year-Old Accused in Baby's Beating Death

By VICKIE CHACHERE, AP ONLINE

TAMPA, Fla. (AP) - In the days after little Jayza Laney Simms died, detectives asked her 7-year-old half brother if he knew what had happened to the baby girl.

At first he said he had dropped the baby. In the second interview, he blamed everyone in the family for Jayza's death.

Finally, on the third meeting with detectives, the boy admitted to what the horrendous evidence showed - that he had punched and kicked his 7-month-old sibling and hit her on the head with a two-by-four, authorities said.

The boy, who was known to be jealous of the baby, told detectives he hit the child because she would not stop crying.

The baby's parents were outside of their Tampa home visiting with friends during the May 22 nighttime attack. They never heard a thing, police said.

Now the Hillsborough County State Attorney's Office is facing the dilemma of what to do with a child so young accused of such a vicious attack. It is a rare, troubling situation.

Each year, there are less than a half dozen cases of children 8 or younger who commit murder, experts say. In 2002, the most recent year available, there were just three, the FBI reports.

But in recent days, there has been new attention paid to the issues surrounding very young killers. In New York, a 9-year-old is accused of stabbing her 11-year-old playmate to death at a Memorial Day gathering.

British police on Thursday were questioning two 11-year-olds arrested on suspicion of attempting to murder a 5-year-old boy.

But those who study young killers say the law does not allow for prosecution of children who might not know their actions are wrong and who would not be competent to stand trial on such weighty charges.

"These are children who still believe in the tooth fairy and the Easter Bunny and Santa Claus. Their view of reality is much different than those of adults," said Arthur Busch, a former prosecutor in Michigan who handled the 2000 case of a 6-year-old boy who shot his classmate to death.

In the Tampa case, experts agree it would be unlikely for prosecutors to press charges against the boy because of his age. English common law dating back centuries has established that children 7 or younger cannot be held accountable for their actions, and those between 7 and 14 are presumed to be unable to form criminal intent.

"Fortunately these cases are exceedingly rare and the response should be one of compassion and understanding rather than punishment," said Steve Drizin, assistant director of Bluhm Legal Clinic at Northwestern University School of Law.

Little is known about the unidentified boy, who has been released to live with his mother in Lakeland while prosecutors decide whether to press charges. The Florida Department of Children & Families declined to comment on the case Thursday.

The boy had been visiting his father in Tampa, where the father lives with his girlfriend and their two daughters, police said. The second girl, a toddler, was not injured.

Police said the couple were outside of their town home visiting with friends after the children were asleep. The boy came outside around midnight to tell his father the baby was bleeding.

The couple rushed inside to find the baby with a bloody nose and not breathing, Tampa Police spokeswoman Laura McElroy said. By the time they reached an emergency room, the baby was dead.

McElroy said the boy showed no remorse when questioned by detectives.

University of South Florida criminologist Kathleen Heide said it would be very unusual for a child that young to understand what he had done. Heide said children often don't show remorse because they don't fully understand what they have done.

"I attributed some of that to what I call the 'cartoon phenomenon,"' Heide said. "They see their favorite character's head shot off or a boulder rolled over them, and in the next frame they see the character alive. Children don't understand the reality of death, meaning that in death someone is forever gone and death is permanent."

The issue of what to do with this child is not much different from the question that faced Busch, the former prosecutor who had to make the decision in the 2000 slaying of Kayla Roland at Buell Elementary School in Mount Morris Township, Mich.

Busch said there was no question in his mind that he couldn't prosecute the 6-year-old boy who shot Kayla.

"The law requires showing of intent," said Busch, who is now in private practice. "At that age their minds are not mature enough to develop criminal intent. The second part of it was, even if you could make the argument with a straight face, juries are extremely reticent to convict children that young."

That boy was removed from the custody of his mother and remains in a home for troubled children. Busch said he's hopeful the child will one day be able to overcome the damage of his early years.

"If we are a society which gives up on 7-year-olds, God help us," Busch said.

06/03/05 02:48 EDT
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Old 06-11-2005, 07:33 PM   #11
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I don't know about corporal punishment in regards to murderous children :insane:
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Old 06-11-2005, 11:50 PM   #12
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LD is back to ranting I see, LOL.

Glad the down arrow works and I just go over 'em.
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Old 06-12-2005, 01:42 AM   #13
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they don't whoop them around here anymore. they say is cruel .
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Old 06-12-2005, 08:28 AM   #14
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Quote:       Originally Posted by Dale
LD is back to ranting I see, LOL.

Glad the down arrow works and I just go over 'em.
I didn't want to read about them either Dale..btw Tommy that's everywhere..but alot still get their buttwhoopins around here
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