[Apollyon67]

Quote:       Originally Posted by Oxford

Just returned from filling up my SUV at Hy-V here in K.C. Paid $1.45 a gallon (Unleaded Regular) minus a 10 cent discount per gallon that they allowed to customers who bought anything from their food department. Saved about $1.50 from what I would have paid.

Ox, How Much a gal.?!?!

[jerry]

Does anyone know how many gal of what types of fuel come froma bbl of crude and what the average refining cost is?

$2.51 for regular unleaded :insane:

[Oxford]

Apollyon67...Hey...I missed that figure by exactly one dollar. Guess I was thinking it should be that low. :nod:

[Oxford]

Jerry, re: "Does anyone know how many gal of what types of fuel come from a bbl of crude and what the average refining cost is?"
No I don't know your answer exactly. But...I do know that crude oil varies considerably in it's exact make-up, depending upon where it's been found in the earth. And...that to a degree, refineries change how they break down crude oil into different distillates, according to market demands.

Check out the following link to see what I mean:
http://search.netscape.com/ns/boomfr...ine_prices.htm

Another useful link to help understand what one gallon of crude oil will yield is as follows:
http://search.netscape.com/ns/boomfr...il_refined.htm

[inuyasha]

i think the driving less and using more efficient cars thing is rather laughable actually... no matter what you do, prices will still rise pretty much. you can drive more efficient cars, but prices will rise to make it of little difference. you really think the arabs would let you take away their main money making thing? thatd be like saying no civvies in the us can own their own gun. it wouldnt occur without a fight

alot of people I know sold their big cars (like my Cadillac) and bought small 4 cylinder cars that use less gas..but they pay a lot more for parts and labor at repair time..I think it all evens out..I'll stick with my V8

[whirlwind]

my 01 dodge 1500 has a 25 gallon tank and gets 15 mpg...i dont get it...we are in pretty much total control over the largest oil fields in the world (iraq) and our gas prices just get higher? im all for G.W. in the white house but this is ticking me off! :full:

[Shaun]

lets see this last week Saudi officially changed hands and is no in the power of a king that supports the islamic schools that hate us. The USA consulate had to be closed this week to avoid danger to US citizens, Refinery Problems in two of the biggest refineries here in the states and then you have 14 different mixes of the gas for the smog crap.



MY solution DROP all SMOG related special mixes one mix for everyone. Max the refineries production out, open new refineries - while giving complete epa exemptions to each company.

Alcohol for Motor Fuels
by J.L. Smith and J.P. Workman 1

Quick Facts...

* The level of interest in using alcohol as a motor fuel has followed cycles of fuel shortages and/or low feed-grain prices.
* Alcohols burn more completely, thus increasing combustion efficiency.
* There are many disadvantages to using alcohols, particularly methyl and ethyl alcohol.
* Advantages of mixing alcohol with gasoline are that alcohol tends to increase the octane rating and reduce carbon monoxide emissions.
* Alcohols may corrode certain materials used in engines.

Alcohol has been used as a fuel for internal combustion engines since their invention. Reports on the use of alcohol as a motor fuel were published in 1907 and detailed research was conducted in the 1920s and 1930s. Historically, the level of interest in using alcohol as a motor fuel has followed cycles of fuel shortages and/or low feed-grain prices.

The properties of methyl, ethyl and butyl alcohol are compared with octane (high quality gasoline) and hexadecane (high quality diesel fuel) in Table 1. Note that octane and hexadecane (petroleum fuels) have higher boiling points, lower latent heats and are insoluble in water. The alcohols become more like petroleum fuels as their chemical weights increase.

Methyl alcohol has the lowest combustion energy of all the fuels listed. However, it also has the lowest stoichiometric or chemically correct air-fuel ratio. Therefore, an engine burning methyl alcohol would produce the most power. It also is possible to take advantage of the higher octane ratings of methyl (and ethyl) alcohol and increase the engine compression ratio. This would increase the efficiency of converting the potential combustion energy to power. Finally, alcohols burn more completely, thus increasing combustion efficiency.
Disadvantages of Alcohol

There are many disadvantages to using alcohols, particularly methyl and ethyl alcohol. Although these alcohols, when used near their stoichiometric air-fuel ratios, produce more power, a larger quantity of fuel is required to produce a specified power output. For example, in an automobile, more fuel is required for each mile driven.

The relatively low boiling points and high vapor pressures of methyl and ethyl alcohol indicate that vapor lock could be a serious problem, particularly at high altitudes on warm summer days. Butyl alcohol, because of its low vapor pressure, is the least likely of the alcohols to cause vapor lock.

The relatively high latent heats of methyl and ethyl alcohol cause problems in mixing these alcohols with air and transporting them through the intake manifold of the engine. Heating the intake manifold may be necessary in cold weather or before the engine reaches operating temperatures. Without external heat to more completely vaporize the fuel, the engine may be difficult to start and sluggish for a considerable time after starting. Butyl alcohol is the least likely to cause starting difficulties or problems during warm-up. Note that its latent heat is almost the same as the latent heat of octane.

All of the alcohols are soluble in water, but butyl alcohol is relatively insoluble compared to methyl and ethyl alcohol. Less engine power is produced as the water content of an alcohol increases. Further, vapor lock, fuel mixing and starting problems increase with water.

Alcohol and Diesel Engines

Alcohol also has been used in diesel engines. In this case, the alcohol may be blended with diesel fuel to produce diesohol, or the alcohol may be added to the air intake of the engine. A system for adding a mixture of ethanol and water to the air intake of a turbocharged diesel engine is commercially available. The primary function of the system is to cool the turbocharged air (using the latent heat), and thereby to increase the volumetric efficiency of the engine and produce more output power. A similar result can be obtained using an intercooler. Control of the quantity of alcohol added to the air intake may be difficult and could cause erratic engine operation and/or failure if a large quantity of alcohol was added to the air intake.

Tests results using blends of ethanol in diesel fuel are shown in Figure 3. The engine used in these tests was naturally aspirated. As with gasohol, the primary effect of the ethanol was to lean the air-fuel mixture and produce more efficient combustion.

Methyl alcohol, because of its highly polar nature, does not mix with diesel fuel. Ethanol can be mixed with diesel fuel provided there is little water in the ethanol. A diesel engine normally will not operate on ethanol nor will ethanol provide lubrication for the fuel injection system. Another problem with adding ethanol to diesel fuel is that the cetane number (ignition characteristic) may decrease below the level recommended by the engine manufacturer.

Butyl alcohol can be mixed with diesel fuel in virtually any concentration. It does not separate as water is added or as the temperature is decreased. Further, butyl alcohol does not significantly change the cetane number of diesel fuel. In blends with diesel fuel, butyl alcohol tends to reduce the solidification temperature of the fuel at low temperatures.
Corrosiveness

Alcohols may be corrosive to certain materials used in engines. Generally, methyl alcohol is the most corrosive and butyl alcohol is least corrosive. Alcohols also can cause injury or physical harm if not used properly. People who use alcohol in motor fuels should observe warning labels and follow precautions to avoid problems.

http://www.ext.colostate.edu/pubs/farmmgt/05010.html

[BattleRifleG3]

One thing standing in the way of far more affordable alchohol production for fuel - A pesky little agency we allknow too well.

[Rufus Rhastus J]

$2.51 for reg. this morning

[Rave]

St Pete. Racetrack Fri $2.44.9 reg
Race track Mon. $2.51.9 reg.
Wal-Mart $2.51.9 reg
Shell 42.53.9 reg
BP $2.55.9 reg
Chevron $2.55.9reg
Tampa Shell $2.57.9reg
How high's the water Mama?

[BattleRifleG3]

I paid $2.55 for regular this evening.

[Rave]

I topped my tank off Saturday at $2.44.9 and considered myself lucky!

[BattleRifleG3]

Last friday I thought the same of $2.39.

[Shaun]

I found one station in town that still has super for 2.59.9

[Oxford]

Get ready for a major new jump in prices. In Kansas City, MO today unleaded regular is up to $2.65 :insane: