Ok found out I like makeing smoke clouds and my gun club has monthly black powder shoots that Id like to get involved in. Budget is a big factor as is the Black Pwder shoot's rules....no inlines.. black pwder.. patch/ball only..Now Im looking at 2 rifles that seem to fit the bill..A Traditions Panther or CVA Bobcat....both have 1:48 twist..and are side locks. Both are around $99 so fits my budget for a new toy....any recomendations as too theses 2 rifles? Any real diffrence? Any big problems?
Don't waste your money........By that I mean that you need to find a side-lock w/ 1:60 twist for patch and ball (in 50cal.). There are plenty of manufactures that make these twist rates but price is going to be a problem. The $99 dollar specials are usually not side-locks but in-lines designed for first time hunters....not for range use or competition. Check w/ your local range and club members for a used one.
JimT
I have the CVA BobCat. It just sits in the cabnet, I could never get it to hit the same place twice. I now shoot a Thompson Center High Plains Sporter, it shoots stright and true. I wish I never wasted my money on the CVA rifle. I cant even trade that thing in on anything, I wouldnt wish that thing on anyone.
You didn't say what the twist rates were on these two m/l's. I believe that given the two brands to choose from, I would go for the T/C any day of the week, but!!!!! Have you tried different loads, patches, conicals and sabots (various weight bullets together w/different sabots make a tremendous change! It's the nature of the game to keep looking for the right combination. Suggestion............Call or write Cecil @ Precision Rifle and see if he can offer something to get that CVA on "paper". Let me know how you make out from there. JMHO
JimT
Guess I got lucky with my Bobcat... .15 patched roundball shoots very well indeed. Then again, I lapped the barrel and got those rough spots out.
My biggest beef with the gun is the stock. It seems to be designed to fracture your face. And the barrel wedge seems rather poorly fit. I lost mine and had to mill one out of brass. I'd like a steel wedge, so if the guy who has the bobcat just sitting in his cabinet would be nice enough to send me his, I'll send him some roundballs in exchange
My best load is 65 grains of Goex FFFg behind a .15 patched roundball.
Guess Im the weirdo in the group. I think my T/C scout is a total peice of crap....the thing could not hit a target 2x in the same area if I taped it to the muzzle.....Ive tried sabbots..conacals..ballets..patch balls....Pyrodex..black powder light to heavy loads and fialy just greased it up and put it in the safe (I dont like to sell guns even junk ones)
My Traditions Panther seems to love patch/ball and at up to 100 yards it smokes soda cans day in day out....I can almost perdict were diffrent loads will hit on a target....with the only exception of Ball-ets which dont do well in any of my 2 rifles.... Sabots do very well in the Traditions but for plinking I just use the patch ball.
Finaly I found the traditions panther to be a lot less finaky in terms of continouse fire (20+ shots) than the T/C...with the T/C If I push the patch down too far it pushes the crud over the fire hole and gun no go boom. The Traditions keeps going. I have noticed that after about 10-15 shoots (shoot reload shoot) the barrel gets a little hot to the touch.
All and All I will probly never buy a nother T/C....traditions on the other hand has got my attention and if I get a diffrent rifle $$.
hey troll i got a bobcat that shoots extremely tight groups. in fact if i had a wood stock for it id take mine to some club shoots. if your is the wood stocked bobcat,id take it off your hands if the price was right enough. if its wood wish it on me lol
I got lucky with my first muzzleloader, A Lyman Great Plains Rifle .50. I paid $260 for it, the guy bought an in-line and sold the Lyman on consignment through the local gunshop. Unfired for $260... I personally love everything about the rifle. Wouldn't have another one.
Seems like whats being said here is, a man might get a good rifle, either by design or by accident in any one model he might choose.
Long ago, I bought a Jukar, most called them junkers from spain, I'd put that cheap ol' rifle up against any other rifle made. So go figure, whether you pay $400, $100, or $25 like i paid for my Jukar, you just might get lucky, smiles.
Traditions Panther or CVA Bobcat????????? 
Seems this is self explanatory 
