The REAL Jim Zumbo Apoplogy

[SPOCAHP ANAR]

[QUOTE=deerhunter;290658]My only concern is for the future of the sport.[QUOTE]

That is the problem; Read my post on why Zumbo can't be forgiven: http://www.gunandgame.com/forums/pow...jim-zumbo.html (Why we can NEVER forgive Jim Zumbo)

If you don't get it, then you never will. Which is why Zumbo has been given the treatment he has earned.

[knightRider]

deer hunter he called for BANNING GUNS!!!!!!

[knightRider]

right but just the word ban <=---- come on

[SPOCAHP ANAR]

Originally Posted by knightRider

deer hunter he called for BANNING GUNS!!!!!!

KR to be fair he only called for Banning them from Hunting. It was his more demeaning language that got him in trouble. Phrases like "we don't need" and "they have no place" and "these rifles terrorize" .
You could literally take his entire entry and remove all inference of hunting and insert Gun or Weapons and it would read like the AWB. That is why he is in trouble.
SEE:
"I must be living in a vacuum. The police in our community tell me that the use of AR and AK rifles have a rapidly growing following among homeowners. I had no clue. Only once in my life have I ever seen anyone using one of these firearms.
I call them “assault” rifles, which may upset some people. Excuse me, maybe I’m a traditionalist, but I see no place for these weapons among our community. I’ll go so far as to call them “terrorist” rifles. They tell me that some companies are producing assault rifles that are “tackdrivers.”
Sorry, folks, in my humble opinion, these things have no place in self defense. We don’t need to be lumped into the group of people who terrorize the world with them, which is an obvious concern. I’ve always been comfortable with the statement that homeowners don’t use assault rifles. We’ve always been proud of our “sporting firearms.”
This really has me concerned. As citizens, we don’t need the image of walking around our neighborhoods carrying one of these weapons. To most of the public, an assault rifle is a terrifying thing. Let’s divorce ourselves from them. I say governments should ban them from the streets and our nation.

Originally Posted by knightRider

right but just the word ban <=---- come on

Enough said for me! Ban and Firearm should NEVER be used in the same sentence!

See by changing 8 phrases you would think that it was written by Sarah Brady.

Originally Posted by deerhunter

but where is the sport in hunting with an assualt rifle.

Where's the sport in hunting with dogs? or using a high powered scope? or a high powered rifle? or with hunt clubs? or with scent blocker? or with scent enhancer? or with bait? etc......

One shot - One kill; can be done with a Bow, a mauser, an AK, or a pistol. I can get off 4 shots at a deer, not accurately, but I can with a bolt action. Who needs an Assault rifle to spray and pray?

And my first choice for hunting would not be an AR.

[troy2000]

The proper definition of an assault weapon refers to guns capable of fully-automatic fire. They're generally relatively light, short and easy to hold onto, fire a less-powerful round to make control easier on full auto, and they're designed for close-up fighting such as modern urban warfare.

Anti-gun activists managed to tag the name onto anything that LOOKS sort of like a modern assault weapon, and people who should know better bought into the demonization without even blinking: people like Jim Zumbo and our Congressional representatives.

When I stated that black guns "look scary to ignoramuses," I meant it quite literally; I wasn't trying to call you names. I would hope you aren't one of those who judge a gun primarily by its looks, and I apologise if you took my comment personally.

[deerhunter]

I actually am not trying to protect anybody, to include Zumbo. I do not believe any gun should be banned that would infringe upon our rights we all have under the 2nd amendment which I hold sacred! I own and use a 44 cal semi-automatic rifle and its a great gun especially in the brush. I obviously didn't do a good job of letting everyone know that I was trying to look at it from the position of the novice or new hunter. In my small circle of influence some people are thinking assualt rifles are like the type used by the military with the spray and pray, I know that is not necessarily true. As for what Zumbo said the only area of his message I was referring to was the mention of assualt weapons. I will reread his message to see if I might have misinterpreted it. I am not condoning what he said. If that is the way I came across then I did a poor job of communicating my meaning.

[Paper]

Deerhunter,
I understand where you're coming from, and I too, do not get into the whole tactical rifle thing.. But..

In the eyes of an anti gunner, a gun, is a gun, is a gun, and a ban, is a ban, is a ban..

Every ban takes away rights of gun owners. If someday down the line, your son or grandson is interested in shooting, but not hunting, and he wants to be able to shoot a match grade AR15 or other variant, how would you feel if he can't because they're banned??

Speaking of bans, here's a website dedicated to what is currently in the Democratic sites...

New Gun Bans List Pelosi Hilary Clinton Kennedy...

I know.. These guys are trying to sell FFL Dealer prep info.. The issue is that we don't need more bans.. Bans ONLY hurt law abiding shooters.. AKA You, I and everyone else on these forums.

The law breakers don't care because bans don't affect them. They're already breaking the law, so what's another broken law??

I don't know how much truth there is to the Morebans site. I don't want any bans.. Someday, I might want to shoot one of the banned guns in competition, and I want the ability to do so..

Will I ever hunt with one?? More than likely not.. But why take that right away another law abiding shooter?

[JBS]

Check this out...Look through some of the firearms related sites, and try to count how many times shooters and hunters refer to their firearms as "weapons". Just look back in this site and you'll see what I'm talking about. I wonder what, if any, difference it would make if we stopped referring to them as weapons and started calling them "guns". 'Cause they ARE guns. I know,,,,,we were taught to never call it a "gun" when we were in the military. They were weapons in the military beacuse they were for killing people. Well, my guns are guns. Not weapons. They aren't for killing people......Think about it. And yes, I own ARs, Mausers, Enfields, etc...and I shoot 'em all ...

[frozentorso]

I really must question your being a long time hunter. ANYONE who knows either hunting or guns knows that you dont hunt with fully automatic weapons. I know of only one person who is licensed for a fully auto weapon. Do you know any? I've never even heard of anyone doing this. I hunt predators with an AR15 because it is more accurate than my Howa's, Winchesters, Remingtons, Rugers, or Marlins. Deadly accurate. Thats what matters and what Zumbo didnt consider. Its the first rifle my young son grabs whenever we hunt coyotes. And I think I'm going to buy a .308 upper which will make it my rifle of choice for anything. Maybe we should ban Ferraris because they look fast.

[Mooseman684]

I'm an Old timer and I can't believe what I am hearing from these posts. A gun is a weapon,like a knife or a bow and arrow is a weapon whether you use it to kill or defend your family, or shoot cans or holes in paper targets...It is a weapon, a Firearm, a Gun !
Thats an Argument that won't wash Period.Don't try to feed word games.
As far as Deerhunters statement about Children, and future hunters, for several reasons that upsets me. IF we don't win this battle against the anti-gunners , there wont be any hunting for future generations, Hunting is NOT PROTECTED under the 2nd amendment, it is Only a priveledge allowed by the States themselves, NOTHING Constitutional or Federal about hunting. When you start saying stuff like" what will Young hunters think" and "Do we want the sport to move in that direction", The Sport has already moved in that Direction in some cases like varmit Hunting, and Young hunters have to be EDUCATED FIRST. There is plenty of sport in hunting with a semiauto rifle, I deer hunted with a 30/06 Autoloader for years, and if it took Multiple shots to put meat on my table, who cares, I'm the one who had to clean it and butcher it. I am The Rangemaster for our local shooting club and I have brought more young people into the sport by letting them shoot some Homeland Defense Rifles like the AR-15, the Ak47, and the SKS. They get Interested real fast when they can shoot multiple times at a target without having to reload and don't get their shoulder hurt from recoil like most hunting Rifles do to them.
My final statement is This, Children/Young hunters have NO say in what we are fighting now, they can't vote. The Brady Bunch are using "Children getting access to weapons " or "Killing their Schoolmates" to try and get our Guns Banned Here And Now and with statements Like Jim Zumbo made, who is a TV Camera Hunter and a MEDIA Person in the Limelight so he is really an ACTOR that has Influence... if you believe his fancy hunting show Garbage, Then you have to realize it is a Big difference if John Q. Citizen says the same thing Vs. somebody with a TV show that is wanting the world to watch Him and what he does and says. We Didn't force him to say what he said, We just pointed out how Wrong he was about what he said being in the "Position" that he Held.

[SKS NOOB]

Even though I'm not that old, I classify myself as an "old timer" as well. Being that I grew up around those people who would fight and die to continue any right stated in our constitution and bill of rights. I can see how easily things can be twisted to fit the needs of a changing and sometimes radical culture. Troy2000, now you know why I left California. Soon my SKS will be here. I will be plink shooting and hunting with it. I will DIE before I let them take it away because of a few people in power are too afraid in the world to make the right choices. Thats why the Constitution and The Bill of Rights is there: To keep things in check.

That being said, we as responsible people should try not to over-glorify guns and what they do. Hollywood and our anti-gun activists have done that pretty well. "With great power comes great responsiblity," I have often heard. Let's teach our children that with gun in hand instead of "with a gun at the head"...not litterally, of course.

[JBS]

Sorry to put a burr under your blanket old timer. A gun ain't a weapon until you use it to hurt someone just like an ashtray, or a barstool. Like it or not, that's fact, not word games. But, it's really a moot point. Just an observation I happened to make. I don't have the time or inclination to continue this.....Sorrrry

[troy2000]

I know you mean well, JBS. But it sure looks like word games to me...unlike an ashtray or a barstool, a gun's primary purpose, when used as designed and intended, is to inflict damage on someone or something. The fact that the damage can be something as minimal as holes in paper doesn't negate its function.

I don't wave my weapons in people's faces, but I'm not going to be mealymouth about them, either.

[JBS]

Forget I ever posted.

[SKS NOOB]

A gun isn't a weapon until you use to hurt something? That's like sayin a sword isn't a weapon until you cut something with it. Or a screwdriver isnt a tool until you use it to... ah.. screw. . Anyway, that's the logic I saw and I appologize if that wasn't what you were trying to get across but just because ANYTHING is just sitting there not doing what it was intended to do does NOT take away from what it is. Of course, if you take a car and run over somebody with it, does that make IT a weapon?

ALSO I think he was tryin to say that a GUN isn't a WEAPON unless it is used to KILL or damage something. That would mean I could call a gun a KEY if I tried to open a door with it. hmmmmmm... let's run that by the anti-gun acitvists and see what they say.

[JBS]

What a bunch of DIP SHiiiTS

[troy2000]

Relax, JBS. We're all on the same side here.

But I don't think we're going to win over many anti-GUN activists by calling them GUNS instead of weapons...

[Rufus Rhastus J]

Originally Posted by Mooseman684

Plus, He has NOT adressed the Issue of the Brady Bunch anti-gunners using his statement...

Moe-Ron! Mooseman is correct, at least he should have used a dis-claimer!