Cops Raid Wrong Place, Kick Man in Groin - Page 4

cubbieman · 06-10-2007, 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by countrymama

+1...very good!!
"...let he who has no sin cast the first stone..."

well... i've never kicked anyone in the nards

i expect to be held accountable for my mistakes, and kicking someone in the nards is a mistake punishable by getting some sense knocked into you

SilverRun · 06-10-2007, 09:45 PM

Sounds like a slam-dunk lawsuit, as it should be. I think the no-knock warrants should be reserved for capitol offenses (i.e. something involving the death penalty). They sure seem to be a violation of constitutional rights and just down-right stupid. I do worry about the cops messing up and some innocent person (namely me or my family) getting caught in the crossfire.

cubbieman · 06-10-2007, 09:47 PM

or what about the small child playing by the door? you break down a door with a kid in front of it and it's not gonna be good

ArkansasHunter · 06-11-2007, 03:29 AM

Calvin I want to Thank You for your post, my sons a cop and a good one. Sadly mistakes like accidents are waiting to happen and when they do the bashers howl.
Thanks for reminding us we all make mistakes...A.H

lefty o · 06-11-2007, 05:09 AM

not bashing all cops, just individual cops.

ezearln · 06-11-2007, 07:03 PM

While I agree cops are no more or less likely to make an error, I must point out that when LIVES are at stake they must make every effort to be sure absolutely certain of their actions. Are they where they are supposed to be? Is the residence they are about to enter the right one? What force is likely to be needed? The Badge gives them the Authority to enforce the Law, with that level of authority also comes an equally heavy responsibility! The officers (specifically the leadership) failed utterly in this situation. Such failure must be addressed and corrected, had this occurred in my home it is quite likely that at least one peace officer would have died and I'd have been killed by his fellows. That is simply too high a price for sloppy leadership....

Calvin · 06-13-2007, 06:48 PM

The Supreme Court has ruled that cops are allowed errors,providing they are not negligent in their purpose. Wrong people arrested and wrong houses raided are covered under the act.
Cops put their pants on the same way as anyone else. Everyone always finds faults with cops, so why is it such a big deal when there is a screw-up? Dishonest people kill,maim,rob,illiegally enter someone else's house all the time. Cops make mistakes,too. A man had his nuts racked in this incident and that's all- coulda been a whole lot worse.

Pred · 06-13-2007, 07:45 PM

The problem is when cops make a mistake, chances are someone could and will die, much like this case. If the owner had had a gun close by and killed a few cops, he would have gone to jail for doing the right thing. Someone kicks in my door, I'm firing first asking questions later, as would anyone else on this forum. On the other side, what if something much worse would of happened, and some kid got hurt, or the husband and or wife died or got wounded? You know, when I'm at work and screw up, about the worst thing that happens is I waste $2 and have to send out another plate for the press. If my wife screws up at work, somebody's appointment gets messed up. I realize cops put up with more then most, but it's part of the job. Theres been way to much of this wrong house crap going on as of late. Them having a rough job only goes so far, they picked the job, job didn't pick them. When I read the last part of your post, I get the funny feeling your actually saying "The guys lucky he's not dead", which I have a feeling you are. Problem is, the guy did nothing wrong, the cops did. The cops should be lucky that each and every one of them still has a job. Wearing the badge doesn't make you above the law, nor does it give you the right to stretch it, find loopholes in it, or break into someones home without cause.

ArkansasHunter · 06-13-2007, 09:54 PM

You know both of you are right, but Pred you seem to enjoy postting this stuff about cops screw up's. And this one did make me laugh.
When you consider all the towns and citys in the U.S that has Police departments.
I'd almost bet you the percentage of these screw up will be less than 1 percent. And thats to many still, but mistakes happen.
Let's don't bad mouth cops though some deserve it.
A lot of them don't... Mike

cubbieman · 06-13-2007, 10:54 PM

most don't deserve it, but these jackasses deserve more than they're going to get, you go around busting in people doors and you're lucky the dont greet you with a few shells

ezearln · 06-14-2007, 02:18 PM

The sad thing is A.H. I have had that badge on my chest and when having probationary patrolman with me I too often got asked why I was so very polite to the "BadGuys" the short answer was If I was certain they were Bad Guys I don't need to be as big an a**hole as they are! You carry a Badge and a sidearm, you serve warrants and seizure orders, you execute what is given you. HOWEVER If you are the HMFIC you had better make darned sure what you were doing was exactly what you were supposed to be doing. Period! These folks apparently had their signals crossed from the git go, and with the potential for loss of human life so high in serving "No-Knock" warrants so very high, extra care and attention should have been applied. Most Peace officers perform their duties in an exemplary manner with attention to every detail, however too often as of late the zeal to show progress against crime has caused some few to forget what it truly is they are striving for and that is the protection of the innocent!

ArkansasHunter · 06-15-2007, 07:56 AM

Couldn't it be possible that the boss's get it wrong and the patrolmen are following orders that they think are right or think to be right ?
Or in other words some one in the department made the mistake,and the patrolmen carry out the orders.
Don't think I disagree with you, I would be kill'in mad if something like this happened to me.
My son's a patrolman and he does'nt make these kind of disisions, his boss's do...A.H

ezearln · 06-15-2007, 08:44 AM

Exactly A.H. (HMFIC anudder military slang term) means Head mudder fricker in charge, I am sure the Patrolman were only following the direction of the senior Officer in charge, that is the person that should be held accountable along with anyone else in the COC that was directly involved in preparing the warrants if they were in error and or the identification of the residence.

troy2000 · 06-15-2007, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ezearln

Exactly A.H. (HMFIC anudder military slang term) means Head mudder fricker in charge, I am sure the Patrolman were only following the direction of the senior Officer in charge, that is the person that should be held accountable along with anyone else in the COC that was directly involved in preparing the warrants if they were in error and or the identification of the residence.

I was wondering about that "HMFIC;" I'm more used to hearing BBMFIC instead (Big Bad muthah...).

cubbieman · 06-15-2007, 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ezearln

Exactly A.H. (HMFIC anudder military slang term) means Head mudder fricker in charge, I am sure the Patrolman were only following the direction of the senior Officer in charge, that is the person that should be held accountable along with anyone else in the COC that was directly involved in preparing the warrants if they were in error and or the identification of the residence.

anytime something like this happens someone needs to lose their job, and where else to start but the HMFIC?

ArkansasHunter · 06-16-2007, 11:14 AM

Here's a good example and I can tell it now Wednesday night my son's day off, received a phone call from his department ( between 8:30 pm and 9 pm ) to report in at 4 am.
( Thursday was his day off too ) he is currently working the grave yard shift.
He was told that the City Police dept. and county were going to work together and serve 68 warrents to bust "quote" drug delears. He was never made aware that this sting operation had been in the planning.
They also had a coulpe military helicopters involved and never in the history of our about 24000 population had a bust this huge been done.
They made 48 arrest out of the 68 with NO screw up's fortunitly.
My point is the patrolmen carry out what there told to do, so when they make mistakes please be a little more forgiving to the cop that carrires out these raids they don't make the disisions they ony carriy them out...
Blame the planners...A.H

ezearln · 06-16-2007, 12:17 PM

Sounds like your boys department did a well executed, planned and precisely performed operation. The numbers you quote alone are a testement to that. Well done to them! And I wasn't placing blame on the Patrolman actually making the arrests but in those in charge who obviously failed in the performance of their duties. When human life is at stake there is no such animal as "Over Prepared"

ArkansasHunter · 06-16-2007, 12:40 PM

ezearln I confess to be ignorant, after telling that ,If that happened to me and my wife I would go balistic !
I wouldn't kill them but I would put my life on the line and fist fight with them until they tased or pepper sprayed me or worst shot me even though I know the one's carring out the raid are doing there job.
I honestly have no fear of dieing when it comes to mistakes like this and protecting my wife. I can't let know one hurt my wife !

ezearln · 06-16-2007, 12:48 PM

A.H. You my friend are amongst the least ignorant people I have ever known so don't go there. But your response is typical of many of us here. Had this occurred to any one of us, there is every likelyhood that one or more patrolman simply doing their jobs would have been seriously injured or killed, and we ourselves injured or killed. That price for incompetancy on the part of the leadership in this case is simply unacceptable. Good cops doing good work in a judicious and professional manner are to always be commended, those that put innocent life in jeapordy without good cause deserve condemnation.

Midas · 06-16-2007, 01:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ezearln

A.H. You my friend are amongst the least ignorant people I have ever known so don't go there. But your response is typical of many of us here. Had this occurred to any one of us, there is every likelyhood that one or more patrolman simply doing their jobs would have been seriously injured or killed, and we ourselves injured or killed. That price for incompetancy on the part of the leadership in this case is simply unacceptable. Good cops doing good work in a judicious and professional manner are to always be commended, those that put innocent life in jeapordy without good cause deserve condemnation.

Agreed

06-11-2007, 07:03 PM	#66
ezearln Senior Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Texas Hill Country Posts: 3,175	While I agree cops are no more or less likely to make an error, I must point out that when LIVES are at stake they must make every effort to be sure absolutely certain of their actions. Are they where they are supposed to be? Is the residence they are about to enter the right one? What force is likely to be needed? The Badge gives them the Authority to enforce the Law, with that level of authority also comes an equally heavy responsibility! The officers (specifically the leadership) failed utterly in this situation. Such failure must be addressed and corrected, had this occurred in my home it is quite likely that at least one peace officer would have died and I'd have been killed by his fellows. That is simply too high a price for sloppy leadership.... __________________ "You can have my Freedom when I'm done with it!"

06-13-2007, 06:48 PM	#67
Calvin Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Columbus, Ohio Posts: 2,000	The Supreme Court has ruled that cops are allowed errors,providing they are not negligent in their purpose. Wrong people arrested and wrong houses raided are covered under the act. Cops put their pants on the same way as anyone else. Everyone always finds faults with cops, so why is it such a big deal when there is a screw-up? Dishonest people kill,maim,rob,illiegally enter someone else's house all the time. Cops make mistakes,too. A man had his nuts racked in this incident and that's all- coulda been a whole lot worse. __________________ If you don't like cops, call your local crackhead for help next time!

06-14-2007, 02:18 PM	#71
ezearln Senior Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Texas Hill Country Posts: 3,175	The sad thing is A.H. I have had that badge on my chest and when having probationary patrolman with me I too often got asked why I was so very polite to the "BadGuys" the short answer was If I was certain they were Bad Guys I don't need to be as big an ahole as they are! You carry a Badge and a sidearm, you serve warrants and seizure orders, you execute what is given you. HOWEVER If you are the HMFIC** you had better make darned sure what you were doing was exactly what you were supposed to be doing. Period! These folks apparently had their signals crossed from the git go, and with the potential for loss of human life so high in serving "No-Knock" warrants so very high, extra care and attention should have been applied. Most Peace officers perform their duties in an exemplary manner with attention to every detail, however too often as of late the zeal to show progress against crime has caused some few to forget what it truly is they are striving for and that is the protection of the innocent! __________________ "You can have my Freedom when I'm done with it!"

06-15-2007, 08:44 AM	#73
ezearln Senior Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Texas Hill Country Posts: 3,175	Exactly A.H. (HMFIC anudder military slang term) means Head mudder fricker in charge, I am sure the Patrolman were only following the direction of the senior Officer in charge, that is the person that should be held accountable along with anyone else in the COC that was directly involved in preparing the warrants if they were in error and or the identification of the residence. __________________ "You can have my Freedom when I'm done with it!"

06-16-2007, 12:17 PM	#77
ezearln Senior Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Texas Hill Country Posts: 3,175	Sounds like your boys department did a well executed, planned and precisely performed operation. The numbers you quote alone are a testement to that. Well done to them! And I wasn't placing blame on the Patrolman actually making the arrests but in those in charge who obviously failed in the performance of their duties. When human life is at stake there is no such animal as "Over Prepared" __________________ "You can have my Freedom when I'm done with it!"

06-10-2007, 09:45 PM	#62
SilverRun Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: AL Posts: 1,661	Sounds like a slam-dunk lawsuit, as it should be. I think the no-knock warrants should be reserved for capitol offenses (i.e. something involving the death penalty). They sure seem to be a violation of constitutional rights and just down-right stupid. I do worry about the cops messing up and some innocent person (namely me or my family) getting caught in the crossfire.

06-10-2007, 09:47 PM	#63
cubbieman Senior Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Alaska Posts: 1,481	or what about the small child playing by the door? you break down a door with a kid in front of it and it's not gonna be good

06-11-2007, 03:29 AM	#64
ArkansasHunter Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: South Arkansas Posts: 10,718	Calvin I want to Thank You for your post, my sons a cop and a good one. Sadly mistakes like accidents are waiting to happen and when they do the bashers howl. Thanks for reminding us we all make mistakes...A.H

06-11-2007, 05:09 AM	#65
lefty o Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: mn Posts: 4,811	not bashing all cops, just individual cops.

06-13-2007, 07:45 PM	#68
Pred Banned Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Kentucky Posts: 3,873 Blog Entries: 3	The problem is when cops make a mistake, chances are someone could and will die, much like this case. If the owner had had a gun close by and killed a few cops, he would have gone to jail for doing the right thing. Someone kicks in my door, I'm firing first asking questions later, as would anyone else on this forum. On the other side, what if something much worse would of happened, and some kid got hurt, or the husband and or wife died or got wounded? You know, when I'm at work and screw up, about the worst thing that happens is I waste $2 and have to send out another plate for the press. If my wife screws up at work, somebody's appointment gets messed up. I realize cops put up with more then most, but it's part of the job. Theres been way to much of this wrong house crap going on as of late. Them having a rough job only goes so far, they picked the job, job didn't pick them. When I read the last part of your post, I get the funny feeling your actually saying "The guys lucky he's not dead", which I have a feeling you are. Problem is, the guy did nothing wrong, the cops did. The cops should be lucky that each and every one of them still has a job. Wearing the badge doesn't make you above the law, nor does it give you the right to stretch it, find loopholes in it, or break into someones home without cause.

06-13-2007, 09:54 PM	#69
ArkansasHunter Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: South Arkansas Posts: 10,718	You know both of you are right, but Pred you seem to enjoy postting this stuff about cops screw up's. And this one did make me laugh. When you consider all the towns and citys in the U.S that has Police departments. I'd almost bet you the percentage of these screw up will be less than 1 percent. And thats to many still, but mistakes happen. Let's don't bad mouth cops though some deserve it. A lot of them don't... Mike

06-13-2007, 10:54 PM	#70
cubbieman Senior Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Alaska Posts: 1,481	most don't deserve it, but these jackasses deserve more than they're going to get, you go around busting in people doors and you're lucky the dont greet you with a few shells

06-15-2007, 07:56 AM	#72
ArkansasHunter Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: South Arkansas Posts: 10,718	Couldn't it be possible that the boss's get it wrong and the patrolmen are following orders that they think are right or think to be right ? Or in other words some one in the department made the mistake,and the patrolmen carry out the orders. Don't think I disagree with you, I would be kill'in mad if something like this happened to me. My son's a patrolman and he does'nt make these kind of disisions, his boss's do...A.H

06-16-2007, 11:14 AM	#76
ArkansasHunter Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: South Arkansas Posts: 10,718	Here's a good example and I can tell it now Wednesday night my son's day off, received a phone call from his department ( between 8:30 pm and 9 pm ) to report in at 4 am. ( Thursday was his day off too ) he is currently working the grave yard shift. He was told that the City Police dept. and county were going to work together and serve 68 warrents to bust "quote" drug delears. He was never made aware that this sting operation had been in the planning. They also had a coulpe military helicopters involved and never in the history of our about 24000 population had a bust this huge been done. They made 48 arrest out of the 68 with NO screw up's fortunitly. My point is the patrolmen carry out what there told to do, so when they make mistakes please be a little more forgiving to the cop that carrires out these raids they don't make the disisions they ony carriy them out... Blame the planners...A.H

06-16-2007, 12:40 PM	#78
ArkansasHunter Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: South Arkansas Posts: 10,718	ezearln I confess to be ignorant, after telling that ,If that happened to me and my wife I would go balistic ! I wouldn't kill them but I would put my life on the line and fist fight with them until they tased or pepper sprayed me or worst shot me even though I know the one's carring out the raid are doing there job. I honestly have no fear of dieing when it comes to mistakes like this and protecting my wife. I can't let know one hurt my wife !

06-16-2007, 12:48 PM	#79
ezearln Senior Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Texas Hill Country Posts: 3,175	A.H. You my friend are amongst the least ignorant people I have ever known so don't go there. But your response is typical of many of us here. Had this occurred to any one of us, there is every likelyhood that one or more patrolman simply doing their jobs would have been seriously injured or killed, and we ourselves injured or killed. That price for incompetancy on the part of the leadership in this case is simply unacceptable. Good cops doing good work in a judicious and professional manner are to always be commended, those that put innocent life in jeapordy without good cause deserve condemnation. __________________ "You can have my Freedom when I'm done with it!"