10-13-2009, 02:53 AM
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#41 | | Firearm Enthusiast
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 97
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have youall ever seen the tv show on vrs where they hunt bear with a compound bow thats what i want to do.
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10-13-2009, 07:55 AM
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#42 | | Firearm Zealot
Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Cumberland, MD
Posts: 3,227
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Midas  | Yes, I'm too big a wuss, I'm gonna stick to shooting the .500 Jeffery and smaller cartridges like the .458 Lott and .450 Rigby, I'll let the real "He-man" shoot the big guns. | Hey... what you tryin to say? I just like experimenting... and the 600 nitro express is really cool! I was reading on a bubba website, and he was saying the 600 has limited penetration with solids... it only penetrates 4 feet of oak at 50 yards! I'll take it!!!
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It isn't FT-LBS that kill, it's broken body parts!
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10-13-2009, 09:16 AM
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#43 | | Firearm Aficionado
Join Date: May 2009 Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 552
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The .600 does have a reputation for penetration problems. It's not that it doesn't penetrate well, but the 470 and 500 NE's penetrate better.
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10-13-2009, 10:48 AM
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#44 | | Firearm Zealot
Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Cumberland, MD
Posts: 3,227
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well if 4 feet is to little penetration.... then my 300 WSM is crap! It will be a fun caliber to play with
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It isn't FT-LBS that kill, it's broken body parts!
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10-13-2009, 12:29 PM
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#45 | | Firearm Enthusiast
Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Home On The Range
Posts: 127
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4-Feet!! Holy smokes! I'll take 2! One to keep on my mantle to look pretty! And one to Shoot/fly out of my hands! :O
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10-13-2009, 12:33 PM
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#46 | | Firearm Zealot
Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Cumberland, MD
Posts: 3,227
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yeah but the 500 NE will penetrate about 5 or so feet into oak.
__________________
It isn't FT-LBS that kill, it's broken body parts!
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10-13-2009, 01:02 PM
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#47 | | Firearm Enthusiast
Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Home On The Range
Posts: 127
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Well if it is one of those that fly out of your hands and gives you a sweet kiss on the forehead as its flying by I will say "Pass" lol
But heck I will shoot anything once! lol
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10-13-2009, 01:05 PM
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#48 | | Firearm Zealot
Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Cumberland, MD
Posts: 3,227
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if you know how to hold a "Large Magnum" you can shoot it fine. Just think of a 20 ga 3 inch hull after fired, add 149 grains of H50BMG and a 900 to 1000 grain bullet. and you have the 600 nitro express
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It isn't FT-LBS that kill, it's broken body parts!
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10-13-2009, 03:32 PM
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#49 | | Firearm Aficionado
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 1,343
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Quote:
Originally Posted by charles73 | Ok...I must admit I will probably never go to Africa and hunt Lion, Elephant, Leopard, or Cape, but I would like to hunt Grizzly someday. But forgetting I said all that what is the smallest cartridge you would go with? .375 H&H?? .338 Win Mag? I'm open to suggestions. I just don't know if I want to take a 30-06 to bag a Grizzly. I know it can do it....but....I think I would like a heavier payload than whats offered for the 30-06.
Maybe I have eaten too much pizza and I'm in need of some sleep. lol
Any thoughts? | Minimum dangerous game in Africa would be the 375 Ruger. 338 Win Mag is enough for the biggest bear in North America.
Jim
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10-13-2009, 03:37 PM
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#50 | | Firearm Enthusiast
Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Texas
Posts: 227
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 338RUM | Hey... what you tryin to say? I just like experimenting... and the 600 nitro express is really cool! I was reading on a bubba website, and he was saying the 600 has limited penetration with solids... it only penetrates 4 feet of oak at 50 yards! I'll take it!!! | ............................... 
There is not a firearm that can be fired from the shoulder that will penetrate four feet of OAK! The BUBBA who told you that has never even seen a 600NE much less fired one. The 600NE is notorious for poor penetration on head shots on elephant, and the 470NE, 500NE are far better penetraters. The average 600NE rifle weighs in at around 18 pounds,for a light one, and you certainly will not have to ask anyone if it went off when you fire it. I think you might be well advised to forego the Savage for this project, or better yet forget the 600NE all together, unless you intend shooting it with squib loads. I have an idea that a 458 LOTT will get your attention enough that you wont want to go bigger in a bolt rifle.
Any chambering larger than a 577NE is useless and is only a very expensive "LOOK AT ME!" toy to empress the guys at the local range.
The best minimum for the very large Alaskan coastal brown bear, is a 338 Win Mag, chambered in a CRF bolt action. However, I hunt everything in Alaska with a 375 H&H Whitworth African express, because where we hunt in the Mulchatna Valley, just west of the Katmai Natnl Park. The browns spend all summer there catching salmon to put on fat for the den up in late September, or early October. We hunt this area in Mid September, and the browns are migrating back to the hills west of us to dig their dens. These bears are used to being around people all summer, and are not timid about walking right into your camp and takeing what they want. They are not the least intimidated by your presence in camp. These are not the tiny little grizz you see in Yellow stone, and a year old coastal cub will be larger than a big male grizz in the Y S park. These bear look like a Volkswaggen with a fur coat on.
We have nothing less than a 375 H&H, shooting hot loads with a 300 gr Nosler Partition, or Swift A-Frame bullet. The only place we use a 45-70 is in an older 1895 Marlin with ballard rifleing instead of the micro groove. The loads in it are HOT for a very strong Ruger No1, with a full house load of IMR 3031 behind a .458 Dia North Fork CPS (cup point solid). This rifle was cut down to a 16 1/4" barrel, with a custom magazine tube that goes all the way to the muzzle. I was made into a TRAPPER so if need be it could be used inside a pop-up tent. It is fitted with a Ghost Ring rear sight and a 3/8ths " white front bead. This is a rifle that stays in camp all the time, hanging on a tent poll, in case someone gets caught away from his rifle. I wouldn't hunt Browns with a 45-70, but this little rifle is far better than any handgun you could carry, and is easier to hit something with than a pistol.
My MINIMUM for Alaska is a 338Win Mag, but prefere a 375 H&H !
My minimum for Africa is a 9.3X62, in a CRF bolt, or a 9.3X74R in a double rifle.
My CHOICE for a rifle for Lion cape buffalo, and elephant is 500NE double rifle. If however Buffalo is the top animal I'm going to hunt, then a 450NE 3 1/4" double rifle gets my vote!
No bolt rifle chambered for a cartridge that may be used to hunt dangerous game should ever be made on a PUSH FEED ACTION.
......................................... 
__________________
.........Mac >>>===(x)===>
Africa calls, and the double rifle is loaded!
Last edited by DUGABOY1; 10-13-2009 at 03:44 PM.
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10-13-2009, 03:49 PM
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#51 | | Firearm Aficionado
Join Date: May 2009 Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 552
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Dugaboy said it far better than I could. Listen to him.
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10-13-2009, 04:35 PM
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#52 | | Firearm Aficionado
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,080
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10-13-2009, 05:31 PM
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#53 | | Firearm Aficionado
Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Montana
Posts: 1,166
|  Well said
Quote:
Originally Posted by DUGABOY1 ...............................
My CHOICE for a rifle for Lion cape buffalo, and elephant is 500NE double rifle. If however Buffalo is the top animal I'm going to hunt, then a 450NE 3 1/4" double rifle gets my vote!
No bolt rifle chambered for a cartridge that may be used to hunt dangerous game should ever be made on a PUSH FEED ACTION.
......................................... | Don't rule out a 470 NE for Buffalo, etc.
My Sako Safari .375 is a push feed and has never failed me. I know, I know the controled feed mauser is supposed to be superior.
My other medium bore is a Purdey double in 450BPE.  | |
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10-13-2009, 05:43 PM
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#54 | | Chief Troll B' Gone
Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: NW Arkansas
Posts: 4,598
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DUGABOY1 ...............................
There is not a firearm that can be fired from the shoulder that will penetrate four feet of OAK! The BUBBA who told you that has never even seen a 600NE much less fired one. The 600NE is notorious for poor penetration on head shots on elephant, and the 470NE, 500NE are far better penetraters. The average 600NE rifle weighs in at around 18 pounds,for a light one, and you certainly will not have to ask anyone if it went off when you fire it. I think you might be well advised to forego the Savage for this project, or better yet forget the 600NE all together, unless you intend shooting it with squib loads. I have an idea that a 458 LOTT will get your attention enough that you wont want to go bigger in a bolt rifle.
......................................... | That is absolutely true!
I would bet money that a lot of the guys who come up with these "bright ideas" have no experience with anything larger than a .300 or .338 Mag
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NRA Life Member
God Bless the United States Military
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10-13-2009, 06:08 PM
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#55 | | Firearm Zealot
Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: SE Virginia
Posts: 1,507
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African guides recommend the minimum .375 H&H for Cape buffalo, elephant, li n, etc. Many african guides carry doubles in 416 Rigby, 404 Jeffries, 450 Nitro Express, etc. Note these are all.400 and larger long magnum cartridges.
Legendary market hunter "Karamojo" Bell took over 700 elephants with a 7mm mauser, and a 6.5 x 54 mannlicher-shoenauer.
I wouldn't try to repeat that feat.
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"Yeah I'm playing with a full deck, all Jokers of course" | |
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10-13-2009, 06:18 PM
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#56 | | Firearm Zealot
Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: SE Virginia
Posts: 1,507
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DUGABOY1 ...............................
There is not a firearm that can be fired from the shoulder that will penetrate four feet of OAK! The BUBBA who told you that has never even seen a 600NE much less fired one. The 600NE is notorious for poor penetration on head shots on elephant, and the 470NE, 500NE are far better penetraters. The average 600NE rifle weighs in at around 18 pounds,for a light one, and you certainly will not have to ask anyone if it went off when you fire it. I think you might be well advised to forego the Savage for this project, or better yet forget the 600NE all together, unless you intend shooting it with squib loads. I have an idea that a 458 LOTT will get your attention enough that you wont want to go bigger in a bolt rifle.
Any chambering larger than a 577NE is useless and is only a very expensive "LOOK AT ME!" toy to empress the guys at the local range.
The best minimum for the very large Alaskan coastal brown bear, is a 338 Win Mag, chambered in a CRF bolt action. However, I hunt everything in Alaska with a 375 H&H Whitworth African express, because where we hunt in the Mulchatna Valley, just west of the Katmai Natnl Park. The browns spend all summer there catching salmon to put on fat for the den up in late September, or early October. We hunt this area in Mid September, and the browns are migrating back to the hills west of us to dig their dens. These bears are used to being around people all summer, and are not timid about walking right into your camp and takeing what they want. They are not the least intimidated by your presence in camp. These are not the tiny little grizz you see in Yellow stone, and a year old coastal cub will be larger than a big male grizz in the Y S park. These bear look like a Volkswaggen with a fur coat on.
We have nothing less than a 375 H&H, shooting hot loads with a 300 gr Nosler Partition, or Swift A-Frame bullet. The only place we use a 45-70 is in an older 1895 Marlin with ballard rifleing instead of the micro groove. The loads in it are HOT for a very strong Ruger No1, with a full house load of IMR 3031 behind a .458 Dia North Fork CPS (cup point solid). This rifle was cut down to a 16 1/4" barrel, with a custom magazine tube that goes all the way to the muzzle. I was made into a TRAPPER so if need be it could be used inside a pop-up tent. It is fitted with a Ghost Ring rear sight and a 3/8ths " white front bead. This is a rifle that stays in camp all the time, hanging on a tent poll, in case someone gets caught away from his rifle. I wouldn't hunt Browns with a 45-70, but this little rifle is far better than any handgun you could carry, and is easier to hit something with than a pistol.
My MINIMUM for Alaska is a 338Win Mag, but prefere a 375 H&H !
My minimum for Africa is a 9.3X62, in a CRF bolt, or a 9.3X74R in a double rifle.
My CHOICE for a rifle for Lion cape buffalo, and elephant is 500NE double rifle. If however Buffalo is the top animal I'm going to hunt, then a 450NE 3 1/4" double rifle gets my vote!
No bolt rifle chambered for a cartridge that may be used to hunt dangerous game should ever be made on a PUSH FEED ACTION.
......................................... | I've tried to induce failure to feed on my Sako, even upside-down,, and it still feeds every time you cycle the bolt fully, no matter how fast you work the bolt. So the generalisation that push feed bolts are unreliable versus mauser-style bolts is debunked. Even my old Mohawk 600 works perfect, every time.
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"Yeah I'm playing with a full deck, all Jokers of course" | |
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10-13-2009, 06:34 PM
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#57 | | Firearm Enthusiast
Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Home On The Range
Posts: 127
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Whootsinator! Holy Crap Man! That is literally field artillery! Ha Ha But you know for the price that's not too bad! lol
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10-13-2009, 11:07 PM
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#58 | | Firearm Zealot
Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Cumberland, MD
Posts: 3,227
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well I apologize for not having knowledge beyond the 375 H&H But I will soon find out I guess, I only have knowledge from what I have read so don't blame me.
__________________
It isn't FT-LBS that kill, it's broken body parts!
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10-14-2009, 03:06 AM
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#59 | | Firearm Zealot
Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Northwest, FL
Posts: 6,574
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well, there's always the .577 Tyranosaurus Rex...
Pansies need not apply.
__________________ Marlin & Calico Specialist
I'm not just Trigger Happy, I'm Trigger Ecstatic!!   | |
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10-14-2009, 03:02 PM
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#60 | | Firearm Enthusiast
Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Home On The Range
Posts: 127
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Big Shrek, whoa is all I can say bout that! lol But I imagine that .577 kills on both ends!
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