[jashoffa]

Quote:       Originally Posted by dannyboy90291

This post started out with some poor guy asking if he should buy a glock or a sig. then turned into a debate about which is a tactally better gun. Im not gonna rant about my quaifications but rest assured, they exist, and I own both brands of firearm. First addressing Glock haters. Why do you hate the glock? It is a very dependable weapon with ample accessories avaliable and better than par magazine capacity. The gun is a beast and will go bang everytime. What is more important than the gun going bang (I am of course adressing tactical issues because this is what the thread is debating because everyone here needs their weapon for the field lmao). Anyways, the glock is an accurate weapon so those of you saying that it isn't simply can not shoot or the gun is just on ergonomically the right fit for you. Don't buy a glock. "The gun is plastic". Shut up. Your knowledge of synthetic advancements in firearm production is below minimal and you clearly know little to nothing about guns." I can go on forever but the bottomline is the Glock is a great weapon and I would have no problem depending on it defense of me and my family's life. RELAX I WILL NOW TALK SHIT ABOUT GLOCK!!! There is one draw back to glock. The saftey or lack thereof. In a "combat" situation which you all know about due to your apparent abundance of tactical experience and clearly established histories of putting fire on the enemy LMFAO", the saftey on the glock can either save or cost you your life. If your going to be using the Glock as your primary weapon, for example, a police officer than I would hesitate with using the Glock. I know my argument seems moot because cops all sport Glocks but hear me out. When your a cop your going to be dealing with retarded scumbags that may try and reach for your weapon. Put your "nobody is taking my weapon" ego inflation aside and think about what happens if some 16 year old crackhead who has never shot a gun before takes your sidearm. Yeah cops, the next time you in line at starbucks ask yourself how hard it would be for the wierd looking guy behind you to take your gun. He can point and shoot and the gun will go bang. Your dead. The use of a sufficent combat holster, FOBUS is best in my opinion, can decrease the liklehood of your weapon being taken but said holster will also inherintly slow your draw time(i dont care how good you think you are). On the other hand, if you are not good under stress. If your giving the gun to a wife or daughter that may not have extensive experiecne or prctice with firearms, then the glock is good because it is point shoot. Now in more advanced combat environments where you are going to be close quarters with scumbag combatants instead of scumbag crackheads the liklihood that the saftey on the Sig is going to prevent your execution is minimal. It's not like the saftey takes a rocket scientist to figure out an the average AK toting hodgy will have no problem successfully discharging either your glock or your sig into your face. In addition, in the field, if you are using your sidearm as a primary weapon than something bad is happened. Either world war 3 was broken out and we dont have enough rifles to go around or your AR had a catastrohpic failure. Think about it, someone reaches for your glock, you out a 5.56 in their computer. NOt the biggest issue for combat operations. Lessons to be learned. The saftey on the Sig may in some cases be more beneficial than that of a glock. This could save your life in minute cases and in addition, cost your life in minute cases. However, the difference is minimal and most of us will never realize any such situation. Both are great firearms but I would have to say that I choose the Sig p226 in .40 for my primary combat sidearm. Relax though sig lovers because there is a glock on my ankle. You cant go wrong with either one and whatever is on the other end of either firearm is not in a good situation. For those of you that have no idea whatsoever what I am talking about think of it like this. The Glock is a Honda. Very reliable and nice weapon. Drives nice and is dependable. The Sig is BMW. Beautiful gun.

As qualified as you are, you are going to have to bring me up to speed, your Sig has an external manual safety? Mine doesn't, and I have seen a good number of Sigs and I have never seen one that has a manual safety. I have a decocker that decocks the hammer but after having decocked the gun it is in a ready to fire state, no safety to manipulate. Perhaps I am reading your post wrong but both Sig and GLOCK are in a ready to fire state after one is chambered, the only difference is the Sig is normally decokced (because it is a double action/single action pistol) and the GLOCK is a striker fired pistol and so requires no decocking.

[Double-D]

both have good reps right? I believe the military uses Sigs and a lot of law enforcement use Glocks. I looked at Sigs but in my opinion they are simply overpriced, so based purely on cost I'd say get a Glock

[double_O_Ro]

I was issued a Sig P229. Love it. Had the choice to carry a Glock but picked the Sig. If I had to buy my own duty firearm I probably would have went with the Glock 22 because of price. They are both good choices.

[big shrek]

If Sig made a 10mm, I might be tempted to go Sig.

[Pothole]

mmmmmm a 10mm Sig would be awesome, then i may be tempted to switch my carry gun (Glock .45 ACP) for a sig (which I also own in 9mm)

[1835]

I carry a sig on duty in south Texas. The mag started poping out when fired. Sig made it good rite away. Other than that it'sbeen flawless. My off duty is a Glock, also flawless. My guess is about three out of four officers have Glocks in thier holster down here. I never hear them complain that they don;t work. Bang for the buck, Glock is hard to beat. Can;t go wrong with either one. What ever you buy,practice,practice,practice!!!!!

Shoot Straight!!!!
Shoot often!!!!

[cb671]

I have shot both Glock's and Sig's but have owned only a Glock ... I haev only one complaint each for both gun's but they have shot well. The Sig's Grip felt too Big in my hand and the Glock was the Bottom of the Trigger Guard which irritated my middle finger shot after shot. Never had a Jam with my Glock and Friend never had a problem with his Sig when using factory loads. But when he started using "Dirty Reload's", his Sig would Jam .. also a friend with an USP .45 would jam with the Dirty Reload's.

[BarryHalls]

Glocks are good for the money and have that classic simple reliability. But I've seen the torture tests done to the Sigs. IMO they are THE most reliable semi autos in the world. Government tests support this. I may be wrong on the exact number but I believe in one particular government test 30,000 rounds each were fired from 10 Sig pistols for a total of 300,000 rounds. I believe there were 0 failures to fire. The SEALS use Sigs for this reason, and because they can tolerate salt water inside and out which makes them a cut above any pistol that I know of, ideal for CCW.

For SHTF/bug out the 226 is great because you can use the same pistol with different barrels and magazines for 9mm, .40, and .357 sig.

PERSONALLY, I prefer the Springfield XDM to either one, because I demand a safety, but of the 2 the Sig is by far my choice.

[GUNNUTZ13]

Sig P226

[BORIS]

Quote:       Originally Posted by GUNNUTZ13

Sig P226

From what I can tell by the serial number the second letter of the two letter date code on the bottom of the slide infront of the dustcover will be E or an earlier letter. IF that is the case then shame on you for owning a P226 that is 16 years old or older that looks like it has never been fired or in a holster!! example, the code will be KE for 1994, KD for 1993 and so on. A=0 and K=9

That SIG hates life right now. They were not designed for cushy carpet and gun safes!!

Here is a real gun pic for ya




The world is a much better place now.......

[GUNNUTZ13]

Quote:       Originally Posted by BORIS

From what I can tell by the serial number the second letter of the two letter date code on the bottom of the slide infront of the dustcover will be E or an earlier letter. IF that is the case then shame on you for owning a P226 that is 16 years old or older that looks like it has never been fired or in a holster!! example, the code will be KE for 1994, KD for 1993 and so on. A=0 and K=9 That SIG hates life right now. They were not designed for cushy carpet and gun safes!! Here is a real gun pic for ya The world is a much better place now.......

Actually...it's a West German whose date code is JJ or 1988...so it's around 22 years old. And yes, I take care of all 35 of my firearms. That SIG has been shot extensively...and is a tack driver.

And that Glock 19 looks like the owner threw it away...

What a waste of good plastic.

[BORIS]

Quote:       Originally Posted by GUNNUTZ13

Actually...it's a West German whose date code is JJ or 1988...so it's around 22 years old. And yes, I take care of all 35 of my firearms. That SIG has been shot extensively...and is a tack driver. And that Glock 19 looks like the owner threw it away... What a waste of good plastic.

That pic was taken after a couple days of being constantly soaked. There was already so much water in it and on it from being submerged from a couple creek crossings and constant rain, it made no difference.

Here is a pic from a normal clear day in the pac NW on range day.




That G37 has probably seen more rounds in one range visit than that SIG has in 22 years.



Guns on carpet pics are sooooo over rated and run of the mill.

Now about my SIGs I have had. My 1994 P226 saw a little more than 30,000 rounds from 1996 till 2009. Got carried hundreds if not a few thousand miles over all kinds of terain. The finish was worn to a dull grey. The top of the trigger was worn shiney where it rubs against the frame from all the swinging back and forth and the chamber hood was shiney from rubbing against the slide from being cycled.

We probably do not use the word "extensively" in the same context.

Look at the slide finish. Mine looked like yours when I first got it.


I replaced it with a newer black stainless P226 in 2005 but kept both together for a while. Here is a pic of my new one about to put an end to a nuisance raccoon.


My pistols are treated very well also, but I expect them to endure some hardships and work when I need them to. Aint nothing wrong with runnin' 'em hard as long as you treat them good in the end. Look at that brand new black finish!! That SIG of yours is screamin to be used!!

Like I said before, a SIG is like a high end VW, spectacular pistols. The way I use my pistols, GLOCKs just perform better. Now at the range lookin' pretty goes to the SIG while performing the same as a GLOCK. In the field over a long period a SIG will rust and require re lube. Not the GLOCK. Thats just an experienced point of view from shooting and using both styles ALOT.

Both are great, but overall, GLOCKs get the nod from me........

FWIW though, my largest deer kill with a pistol was with that first P226 loaded with M882 ball. Blew the spine out the other side of the neck on a 207 pound 6 point. The exit wound was the size of my fist. I can PM you the pic if you want. Might be too realityish for some of the peeps here to put out publicly....

If the day ever comes around I get back into range toys an all steel SA P226 will be high on the list of to gets........

Guess it all boils down to what you use them for, will determine what one you think is better.

[stalebiscuit]

sig is better

[Jim Rau]

Quote:       Originally Posted by stalebiscuit

sig is better

Yes it is!!!
I used three different Glocks (two 22's and a 23) both on and off duty over the last 10 years and now have a Sig P226 as a duty weapon and I like it A LOT better than the Glocks, off duty I use my SP101 or a 6906 and like both of them better than the 23!!!!
To each his own, but to carry a weapon cocked and unlocked (no active safety) is just asking for trouble!

[ChrisAR7]

if u get glock get the glock 4th gen

[stsimonoftrent]

The Glock 22: America's best-selling police pistol

Guns Magazine, July, 2008 by Massad Ayoob



There are more reasons than low bid why this 16-shot .40 leads in US police handgun sales.

More police departments seem to have adopted the Glock 22 than any other make and model. For years, the FBI has given new agents their choice of a 16-shot G22 or the slightly smaller 14-shot Glock 23.


From the frozen wasteland patrolled by the Alaska State Troopers to the 120-degree streets covered by Phoenix PD, the Glock 22 is standard issue along with numerous other state police agencies and countless sheriff's departments.
There are good reasons why the Glock 22 is as ubiquitous today, in law enforcement as the Smith & Wesson Model 10 M&P .38



Special revolver was when we were younger. Yes, cops buy on bid, and yes, the polymer frame Gaston Glock popularized greatly reduces the cost of the pistol. However, the market is now glutted with polymer handguns.



To understand the G22's popularity, we have to go back to the time of its birth. The year is 1990. From FBI on down, as the wave builds to sweep away the old service revolver and replace it with the semiautomatic pistol, firearms instructors and rank-and-file cops are split fight down the middle. Roughly half want firepower and, at the time, firepower meant a 16-shot 9mm auto such as the Beretta 92, the Sig P226, or the S&W 5906, all extremely popular back in the day.
But the other half want stopping power, colloquially characterized as "a caliber beginning with the number 4," and that means a .45 auto with typical cartridge capacity of eight rounds. FBI's John Hall, head of the Firearms Training Unit, has attempted to cut that Gordian knot with a compromise gun, the 10mm Auto, for which S&W gets the fateful and controversial contract. The Bureau decides on a mild subsonic load, 180-grain bullet at a bit under 1,000 feet per second.


At Smith & Wesson, Tom Campbell, Paul Liebenberg, and Ed Hobbe realize these ballistics can be duplicated in a shorter cartridge based on Liebenberg's wildcat Centimeter round, short enough to fit a 9mm envelope and allow a double-stack magazine giving more ammo in a pistol of reasonable frame size. They approach Winchester, and the result is the .40 Smith & Wesson, debuting in January 1990 at the SHOT Show. It exactly splits the difference between the 16-shot 9mm and the 8-shot .45 paradigms--S&W's Model 4006 will hold 12.40 rounds.


Gaston Glock, at the show, sees the round and is intrigued. He orders a version of his tremendously successful Glock 17 9mm built around this cartridge. The first try off the drawing board is too weak for the powerful .40's vicious slide velocity, and the frame needs to be reinforced. The second incarnation is the charm, and sales take off.

Best Of Both Worlds
The geometry of the standard-size Glock has allowed it to be an 18-shot 9mm. Chambered for the new cartridge, the pistol designated Glock 22 becomes a 16-shot .40. The 12-shot conventional double action .40 autos of S&W and, subsequently, Beretta are the compromise guns they were meant to be. But in the Glock 22, law enforcement sees more than a compromise, it sees the best of both worlds.


On the one side, the 16-shot firepower of the traditional Beretta, Ruger, SIG, and Smith 9mms is not compromised at all if the G22 is adopted: it's a 16-shot pistol, too. On the other side, caliber potency, the 180-grain .40 S&W bullet at 990 fps is remarkably close to the most popular police .45 duty load of the day, 185-grain projectiles rated for 1,000 fps. And much of law enforcement asks itself, "Why should we compromise, when we can have it all?" With said realization, sales of the Glock 22 pistol rocket toward the dominance the model soon achieves in American police work.

The first generation of .40 S&W loads, the still-predominant 180-grain subsonic, was soon followed by a second generation of 155-and 165-grain JHPs going faster, and then by a third generation, a still faster 135 grain. A reduced recoil load from Federal and Speer, done for government spec, gave a fourth power level, a 165-grain at a 1,000 fps. Let's look at comparisons.


The 180 grainer roughly equals the old .38-40 revolver load of the Old West. Each comprises a 180-grain, 40-caliber bullet at approximately 975 to 1,000 fps.
The Border Patrol's 155-grain Federal JHP at 1,200 fps or Nashville Metro PD's 165-grain, 1,140 fps Winchester SXT Ranger both dropped bad guys like lightning when fired from the Glock 22s, bring us into the .357 Magnum's ballpark. Typical factory loading of a 158-grain .357 Mag round these days is around 1,235 fps.

The South Bend, Indiana police issue the 135-grain Cor-Bon .40 at 1,300 fps. Ballistics are roughly comparable to the typical .357 Sig police load, a 125-grain bullet at 1,350 fps. At the other end of the scale, you can stoke your .40 to a .38 Special hot-load level. The 165-grain subsonic at 1,000 is little different from the Cor-Bon .38 P load spitting a 158-grain lead hollowpoint at the same velocity.


Still, the Gen One 180-grain subsonic still seems to be the most popular LE load, followed by the snappier 155- and 165-grain options.

[stsimonoftrent]

GLOCK Users

Country Organization Model Australia A Glock 17 outfitted with a thumb safety was designed specifically for the Tasmania Police[56] Glock 17 Austria Austrian Armed Forces[57][58] Glock 17 (designated Pistole 80) Canada Numerous local law enforcement agencies including those of Calgary, Edmonton, Ottawa, Saskatoon, South Coast British Columbia Transportation Authority Police Service, and Toronto[58] - Czech Republic Non-standard sidearm issued to personnel on international deployments[59] Glock 17 Ecuador National Police[58] - Various special police units such as the GOE and GIR[58] - Fiji Tactical Response Unit[60] - Finland Primary service firearm of the police[61] - Defence Forces[62] Glock 17 (designated 9.00 PIST 2008) Department of Corrections (Vankeinhoitolaitos)[62] - Border Guard[62] - France Certain naval and parachute units of the French Army[63] Glock 17 Georgia Special forces[58] - Germany GSG 9 of the German Federal Police[58] - Greece EKAM[64] Glock 21 Greenland Siriuspatruljen[65] Glock 20
Hong Kong Special Duties Unit[58] Glock 17 Hong Kong Police Force[58]
India National Security Guards[58] Glock 17 Iraq Iraqi security forces (largest user, purchased 125,163 pistols)[69][70] Glock 19 Jordan Presidential Guard[58] - Kosovo Kosovo Police[71][72] Glock 17 Kosovo Security Force[71][72] Glock 17 Latvia Latvian Military[73] Glock 17 Lithuania Lithuanian Armed Forces[74] Glock 17, Glock 26 Malaysia Malaysian Armed Forces[77] - Royal Malaysian Police[77]

[jmp8927]

I have no shooting experience with SIGs, and have only held their new .380, but I really love Glocks. To me they're beautiful and extrodinarily comfortable. Being lighter than any other full size pistol also helps a lot. I would love to shoot a SIG, but I for one refuse to pay as much as SIG charges for their pistols. They're blandly overpriced. Oh, and Glock are the safest pistol to date that I've ever handled in person. They are not capable of firing under any circumstances short of being thrown in a fire unless the trigger is pulled.

[stsimonoftrent]

GLOCK Users

Country Organization Model

Australia A Glock 17 outfitted with a thumb safety was designed specifically for the Tasmania Police Glock 17

Austria Austrian Armed Forces Glock 17 (designated Pistole 80)

Canada Numerous local law enforcement agencies including those of Calgary, Edmonton, Ottawa, Saskatoon, South Coast British Columbia Transportation Authority Police Service, and Toronto -

Czech Republic Non-standard sidearm issued to personnel on international deployments Glock 17

Ecuador National Police-
Various special police units such as the GOE and GIR[58] -

Fiji Tactical Response Unit-

Finland Primary service firearm of the police -
Defence Forces Glock 17 (designated 9.00 PIST 2008)

Department of Corrections (Vankeinhoitolaitos)[62] -
Border Guard -

France Certain naval and parachute units of the French Army Glock 17

Georgia Special forces -

Germany GSG 9 of the German Federal Police-
Greece EKAM Glock 21

Greenland Siriuspatruljen Glock 20

Hong Kong Special Duties Unit Glock 17
Hong Kong Police Force Glock 17

Iceland Icelandic National Police -Víkingasveitin -
ICRU

India National Security Guards-Glock 17

Iraq Iraqi security forces (largest user, purchased 125,163 pistols) Glock 19

Jordan Presidential Guard -

Kosovo Kosovo Police Glock 17

Kosovo Security Force Glock 17

Latvia Latvian Military Glock 17

Lithuania Lithuanian Armed Forces Glock 17

Luxembourg Unité Spéciale de la Police of the Grand Ducal Police Glock 17, Glock 26

[stsimonoftrent]

More GLOCK USERS:


Mexico Secretaria de Marina[58] -
Montenegro Military of Montenegro[78] Glock 17
Netherlands Military of the Netherlands[79] Glock 17 Dutch police (about 250 pistols in use as a stopgap measure)[80][81][82] Glock 17
New Zealand New Zealand Police[83] Glock 17
Norway Royal Norwegian Army[58] Glock 17 (designated P-80)
Philippines Philippine National Police[58] - National Bureau of Investigation[58] - National Intelligence Coordinating Agency[58] - Philippine Drug Enforcement Agency[58] -
Poland Polish police[84] Glock 19
Portugal Portuguese Marine Corps[85] Glock 17 Republican National Guard[85] Glock 19 Public Security Police[85] Glock 19
Russia Ministry of Internal Affairs (MVD)[86][87] -

Spain Guardia Civil's UEI[88] Glock 17
Sweden Swedish Armed Forces[89][90] Glock 17 (designated Pistol 88), Glock 19 (designated Pistol 88B) Swedish Customs Service - Swedish Coast Guard -
Switzerland Police (Gendarmerie) Cantonal of Geneva[91] Glock 19
Thailand National police (2,238 pistols)[58] Glock 19
United Kingdom Specialist Firearms Command of the London Metropolitan Police Service[92] - Scottish Police Specialist Firearms Units[93] Glock 17
United States Department of Treasury IRS Criminal Investigation Division[94] - Drug Enforcement Administration[95] - Thousands of other law enforcement agencies at the national, state, and local levels[2] -
Venezuela [58]