Your Subdivision Survives, now what...

GatorDude · 07-30-2009, 09:43 PM

I'm not trying to troll here, but would like to know what you would do to help your community survive a disaster.

What would you do if simultaneous attacks destroyed central government at the federal and state level and suddenly left your community structurally intact but without any power, phone, water, sewer, or federal or state government services. Let's say your county or town government survives, but is overwhelmed with the needs for services and 50% of local government workers have abandoned their posts due to personal family situations. Let's say EMP has fried many electronics and communications apparatus, disables 50% of motor vehicles, and has temporarily overwhelmed the federal government. There may be unknown radiological or chemical hazards or forest fires that inhibit movement cross country. There is no foreign government invading and there is no sign of a foreign invasion. I don't want to posit a specific kind of attack. It could have been terrorists who smuggled WMDs into the country or a limited nuclear exchange with a major power.

The point of the exercise is to find out what you would do to reconstitute government in your community. What specific steps would you take?

larmus · 07-30-2009, 10:51 PM

sounds like the e-book "lights out" on the survival monkey web site...

jerry · 07-30-2009, 10:53 PM

I'm not telling

thrillbilly · 07-30-2009, 10:56 PM

subdivision? What's that, something ya'll city folks have? I don't have any of those...I feel left out, can ya eat a subdivision? or clean a gun with one? Are they purdy?

larmus · 07-30-2009, 10:57 PM

hahaha...^ some r shiney like bass boats....

M14man · 07-30-2009, 11:19 PM

Watch the movie "Lord of the Flies", the group starts out organized, then crumbles from within. Though an intact sub-division is not an immediate threat to the inhabitants, what threats lie beyond and those inside could cause the unity to come apart. Without utilities;that is electric, water, communication, new food supplies there are going to be those who want more than their fair share. They will want yours, or feel that supplies should be divided up. The rules have to be laid out from the beginning plain, and hard, and enforced.

Big Dog · 07-31-2009, 07:36 AM

I fully expect most of the folks in my slice of Sloburban Heck to move back into town with their families - mostly older folks out here and some younger ones who are NOT preppers. They will seek shelters, both Government and church-run.
Looters and vandals will be a big danger, til they have stripped the undefended homes, and been killed by the remaining defenders who ARE prepped. The LEOs will be tasked with guarding what's left of local government and stockpile locations. There won't be any 'law' out of town.
Disease will run rampant in the city, and many will die. That will actually ease food and supply logistics somewhat, for those who remain.
We still 'out of town' will band together and keep a low profile. I have a few buddies who also prep out here.
Small gardens will have to suffice, along with stored provisions, til some semblance of 'normalcy' returns. The local wildlife will be hunted out byt he bubbas pretty quickly - nobody will 'survive' long by hiding in the woods and hunting in this AO.

knightRider · 07-31-2009, 09:11 AM

can someone play bass for country boy will survive i have lead guitar and vocals.

woody1981 · 07-31-2009, 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by M14man

Watch the movie "Lord of the Flies", the group starts out organized, then crumbles from within. Though an intact sub-division is not an immediate threat to the inhabitants, what threats lie beyond and those inside could cause the unity to come apart. Without utilities;that is electric, water, communication, new food supplies there are going to be those who want more than their fair share. They will want yours, or feel that supplies should be divided up. The rules have to be laid out from the beginning plain, and hard, and enforced.

When I read the scenario, the first thing I thought of was the need for some type of central organization to fulfill people's needs. The "Lord" novel shows the problems everybody will be faced with, and even the newly formed group will be in danger. The result of this will most likely be several random and violent changes of "governments" until life gets better.

jrswanson1 · 07-31-2009, 10:53 AM

I think it will be more like Jerico. Unfortunately, I live about 30 miles SW of Washington, D.C., so I'm stuck with Feds no matter what happens.

Jim

Cyrano · 07-31-2009, 12:08 PM

If the members of the gun club can get together, there will be order.

Realistically, what I would do if I were in command would be to consolidate the survivors at a central location, probably a school, and use the 50% of vehicles still running to strip first the stores and restuarants and then the homes, bringing everything essential to the central location. The high school near my home would be my first choice because all the schools in town are located along one street, which would make setting up and securing a perimeter possible, and I believe it has an emergency generator. Housing would have to be dormitory-style at first because we are talking survival. it might be a couple of years before the town area was secure enough and had a rep that meant no one would attack us before I could consider expanding outside the perimeter; and then it would be to the few still-extant farms, and the pioneers there would still be living dormitory style becuase it would be a military discipline situation. (And I think the football field where the dumbjocks used to play a silly game would make a really good vegetable garden.)

Food rationing would begin at once, because it's too late in the season to get crops in, although we'd certainly harvest the apples and corn and whatever family gardens we could find.

A lot of people would be working in the school kitchens until the propane ran out (which would take awhile; there are two propane supply divisions in town), canning for the winter and learning how to smoke, salt and jerk meats. Come November, we'd take every deer we could find. The few pigs on the one local farm I know has them would be earmarked as breeding stock. It would be at least three years before there would be enough of them that we could harvest any pork.

I'd also be going through the farms and old houses with outbuildings, looking for animal-drawn anythings. Plows would be the most critical (see "The Trigger Effect" of Connections, Series One) but I want any 19th Century farm equipment I can find. We can't grow rice, but we can grow corn and if we have any seed wheat, we could grow that too.

Bottom line would be that we would probably revert to a sort of 14th Century social structure with mostly 19th Century technology including things like icehouses and iceboxes (there is a pond in town called Ice Pond - the water is exceptionally pure and a century ago ice was harvested from there in the dead of winter), with the little 20th Century technology still operational highly restricted until we could figure out how to power it. Fuel would be an issue. But we could survive here. Not as easily as the good ol' boys down South who never really bought into computerized everything and bedroom suburbs of metroplexes can, but we'd make it.

deadzero · 07-31-2009, 12:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thrillbilly

subdivision? What's that, something ya'll city folks have? I don't have any of those...I feel left out, can ya eat a subdivision? or clean a gun with one? Are they purdy?

I think subdivision has something to do with sharing your lunch...

thrillbilly · 07-31-2009, 01:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by larmus

hahaha...^ some r shiney like bass boats....

Bass Boats!!! I Like Bass Boats!

nathangdad · 07-31-2009, 01:15 PM

but our area is so broken into different homes with different employment there just is no sense of community. The neighbors don't really even know one another in most cases.

I would want to run away from our subdivision as fast as possible.

2dogs · 07-31-2009, 04:15 PM

A couple of years ago we had a pretty bad snow storm here in N. Georgia and after 4 days of no electricity most of these fine folks who complained about my wood burning heater smoking up the neighborhood finally made their way down to my house. My wife invited them in, prepared food for them on my Buck stove,,,most of the women had never seen anyone cook on a wood burning stove or knew how to use a Dutch oven to make bread,,,once the power came back on they all departed back to their homes with not so much as a thank you,,,kiss my ----,,,see ya or nothing else,,,what would I do for them in a SHTF scenario,,,NOTHING,,,,it's every man for himself,,,,SEMPER FI

waterdog · 07-31-2009, 06:23 PM

Take care of my family, loved ones and best friends, after that don't get in my food,water,livestock, land or FOV. and everything will be fine ,for all involved.

Lobo0311 · 07-31-2009, 07:09 PM

Probably utilize a slightly modified "neighborhood watch" to supplement local law enforcement, and work in tandem with that agency to find out what needs to be done in order to maintain some semblance of ...well.......order. I live in a small community ( about 1200 ppl), a lot of which are older people, not necessesarily elderly but in the 60+ age group. Anyway, I also have a lot of neighbors that are former military and/or retired from various construction fields ( electricians, framers etc..) so we would probably be able to erect shelters. Mainly we'd probably get a large group of "minutemen' together to ensure that the more "unsavory" type stay out or at least don't run rampant, by pulling shifts kind of like "firewatch" in the military, to ensure there are people maintaining vigilance 24/7 so we can notify what, if any, Law enforcement officials to anything that we cannot handle ourselves, then provide whatever support they need while they are on scene.

338RUM · 07-31-2009, 07:13 PM

sub-division.... isn't that what i did in math class?

larmus · 07-31-2009, 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thrillbilly

Bass Boats!!! I Like Bass Boats!

Now thats a good lookin boat!

SgtD · 07-31-2009, 08:19 PM

I have a friend with a ranch. That's where I'm going.

I pack my family, our food, water, guns and ammo and tools, then head there to help with security and any work that needs done.

Not much between me and him but rural roads, so there shouldn't be a problem getting there if need be.

As far as the government, they aint ever done much but take from me, so I aint gona sit around waiting for them to save me or bring me anything. Some folks did that back in 2005 and didn't fair too well. I figure, let the city folks deal with the government and stand in line waiting for handouts. If I ain't in the line, then I'm part of the solution I guess. So that's how I'll help the government; by keeping away.

07-30-2009, 09:43 PM	#1
GatorDude Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: FL for now Posts: 35	Your Subdivision Survives, now what... I'm not trying to troll here, but would like to know what you would do to help your community survive a disaster. What would you do if simultaneous attacks destroyed central government at the federal and state level and suddenly left your community structurally intact but without any power, phone, water, sewer, or federal or state government services. Let's say your county or town government survives, but is overwhelmed with the needs for services and 50% of local government workers have abandoned their posts due to personal family situations. Let's say EMP has fried many electronics and communications apparatus, disables 50% of motor vehicles, and has temporarily overwhelmed the federal government. There may be unknown radiological or chemical hazards or forest fires that inhibit movement cross country. There is no foreign government invading and there is no sign of a foreign invasion. I don't want to posit a specific kind of attack. It could have been terrorists who smuggled WMDs into the country or a limited nuclear exchange with a major power. The point of the exercise is to find out what you would do to reconstitute government in your community. What specific steps would you take? Last edited by GatorDude; 07-30-2009 at 09:52 PM. Reason: Trying to De-Troll Hypothetical

07-30-2009, 10:51 PM	#2
larmus Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: arizona Posts: 3,435	sounds like the e-book "lights out" on the survival monkey web site... __________________ Lawrence Home Defense: .45 and a Shovel...

07-30-2009, 10:56 PM	#4
thrillbilly Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Ozark Hill Country Posts: 3,184	subdivision? What's that, something ya'll city folks have? I don't have any of those...I feel left out, can ya eat a subdivision? or clean a gun with one? Are they purdy? __________________ *" I won't be wronged, I won't be insulted, and I won't be laid a hand on."* John Wayne

07-30-2009, 10:57 PM	#5
larmus Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: arizona Posts: 3,435	hahaha...^ some r shiney like bass boats.... __________________ Lawrence Home Defense: .45 and a Shovel...

07-31-2009, 07:36 AM	#7
Big Dog Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Tallahassee, Florida Posts: 14,052	I fully expect most of the folks in my slice of Sloburban Heck to move back into town with their families - mostly older folks out here and some younger ones who are NOT preppers. They will seek shelters, both Government and church-run. Looters and vandals will be a big danger, til they have stripped the undefended homes, and been killed by the remaining defenders who ARE prepped. The LEOs will be tasked with guarding what's left of local government and stockpile locations. There won't be any 'law' out of town. Disease will run rampant in the city, and many will die. That will actually ease food and supply logistics somewhat, for those who remain. We still 'out of town' will band together and keep a low profile. I have a few buddies who also prep out here. Small gardens will have to suffice, along with stored provisions, til some semblance of 'normalcy' returns. The local wildlife will be hunted out byt he bubbas pretty quickly - nobody will 'survive' long by hiding in the woods and hunting in this AO. __________________ "A bold spirit embiggens the smallest man!" Jebediah Springfield

07-30-2009, 10:53 PM	#3
jerry Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 13,758 Blog Entries: 1	I'm not telling

07-30-2009, 11:19 PM	#6
M14man Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: FLA Posts: 1,311	Watch the movie "Lord of the Flies", the group starts out organized, then crumbles from within. Though an intact sub-division is not an immediate threat to the inhabitants, what threats lie beyond and those inside could cause the unity to come apart. Without utilities;that is electric, water, communication, new food supplies there are going to be those who want more than their fair share. They will want yours, or feel that supplies should be divided up. The rules have to be laid out from the beginning plain, and hard, and enforced.

07-31-2009, 09:11 AM	#8
knightRider Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: you know where Posts: 3,777 Blog Entries: 17	can someone play bass for country boy will survive i have lead guitar and vocals. __________________ God doesn't give rights. Men have to fight for them.

07-31-2009, 10:53 AM	#10
jrswanson1 Senior Member Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 1,267	I think it will be more like Jerico. Unfortunately, I live about 30 miles SW of Washington, D.C., so I'm stuck with Feds no matter what happens. Jim

07-31-2009, 12:08 PM	#11
Cyrano Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: New York Posts: 8,147	If the members of the gun club can get together, there will be order. Realistically, what I would do if I were in command would be to consolidate the survivors at a central location, probably a school, and use the 50% of vehicles still running to strip first the stores and restuarants and then the homes, bringing everything essential to the central location. The high school near my home would be my first choice because all the schools in town are located along one street, which would make setting up and securing a perimeter possible, and I believe it has an emergency generator. Housing would have to be dormitory-style at first because we are talking survival. it might be a couple of years before the town area was secure enough and had a rep that meant no one would attack us before I could consider expanding outside the perimeter; and then it would be to the few still-extant farms, and the pioneers there would still be living dormitory style becuase it would be a military discipline situation. (And I think the football field where the dumbjocks used to play a silly game would make a really good vegetable garden.) Food rationing would begin at once, because it's too late in the season to get crops in, although we'd certainly harvest the apples and corn and whatever family gardens we could find. A lot of people would be working in the school kitchens until the propane ran out (which would take awhile; there are two propane supply divisions in town), canning for the winter and learning how to smoke, salt and jerk meats. Come November, we'd take every deer we could find. The few pigs on the one local farm I know has them would be earmarked as breeding stock. It would be at least three years before there would be enough of them that we could harvest any pork. I'd also be going through the farms and old houses with outbuildings, looking for animal-drawn anythings. Plows would be the most critical (see "The Trigger Effect" of Connections, Series One) but I want any 19th Century farm equipment I can find. We can't grow rice, but we can grow corn and if we have any seed wheat, we could grow that too. Bottom line would be that we would probably revert to a sort of 14th Century social structure with mostly 19th Century technology including things like icehouses and iceboxes (there is a pond in town called Ice Pond - the water is exceptionally pure and a century ago ice was harvested from there in the dead of winter), with the little 20th Century technology still operational highly restricted until we could figure out how to power it. Fuel would be an issue. But we could survive here. Not as easily as the good ol' boys down South who never really bought into computerized everything and bedroom suburbs of metroplexes can, but we'd make it.

07-31-2009, 01:15 PM	#14
nathangdad Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 6,035	I hope this does not sound too negative but our area is so broken into different homes with different employment there just is no sense of community. The neighbors don't really even know one another in most cases. I would want to run away from our subdivision as fast as possible.

07-31-2009, 04:15 PM	#15
2dogs Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Georgia Posts: 22	A couple of years ago we had a pretty bad snow storm here in N. Georgia and after 4 days of no electricity most of these fine folks who complained about my wood burning heater smoking up the neighborhood finally made their way down to my house. My wife invited them in, prepared food for them on my Buck stove,,,most of the women had never seen anyone cook on a wood burning stove or knew how to use a Dutch oven to make bread,,,once the power came back on they all departed back to their homes with not so much as a thank you,,,kiss my ----,,,see ya or nothing else,,,what would I do for them in a SHTF scenario,,,NOTHING,,,,it's every man for himself,,,,SEMPER FI

07-31-2009, 06:23 PM	#16
waterdog Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 758	Take care of my family, loved ones and best friends, after that don't get in my food,water,livestock, land or FOV. and everything will be fine ,for all involved.

07-31-2009, 07:09 PM	#17
Lobo0311 Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Northeast Kansas Posts: 699	Probably utilize a slightly modified "neighborhood watch" to supplement local law enforcement, and work in tandem with that agency to find out what needs to be done in order to maintain some semblance of ...well.......order. I live in a small community ( about 1200 ppl), a lot of which are older people, not necessesarily elderly but in the 60+ age group. Anyway, I also have a lot of neighbors that are former military and/or retired from various construction fields ( electricians, framers etc..) so we would probably be able to erect shelters. Mainly we'd probably get a large group of "minutemen' together to ensure that the more "unsavory" type stay out or at least don't run rampant, by pulling shifts kind of like "firewatch" in the military, to ensure there are people maintaining vigilance 24/7 so we can notify what, if any, Law enforcement officials to anything that we cannot handle ourselves, then provide whatever support they need while they are on scene. __________________ If ignorance is bliss, why aren't more people happy?

07-31-2009, 07:13 PM	#18
338RUM Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Lonaconing, MD Posts: 1,339	sub-division.... isn't that what i did in math class?

07-31-2009, 08:19 PM	#20
SgtD Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Kansas Posts: 56	I have a friend with a ranch. That's where I'm going. I pack my family, our food, water, guns and ammo and tools, then head there to help with security and any work that needs done. Not much between me and him but rural roads, so there shouldn't be a problem getting there if need be. As far as the government, they aint ever done much but take from me, so I aint gona sit around waiting for them to save me or bring me anything. Some folks did that back in 2005 and didn't fair too well. I figure, let the city folks deal with the government and stand in line waiting for handouts. If I ain't in the line, then I'm part of the solution I guess. So that's how I'll help the government; by keeping away. Last edited by SgtD; 07-31-2009 at 08:23 PM.