SHTF arsenal OK?

Metronome · 10-26-2009, 10:47 PM

Maybe it is just me, but I think you are in pretty good shape with the 12 gauges and the .30-30 (save for a military invasion or zombie horde), I would just hide away any guns you wouldn't shoot to save your life, and invest in a good handgun - say a high capacity 9mm (or three) with spare magazines in tactical places. I am all about military calibers (9mm, .223, .308) at the moment.

A quality autoloader couldn't hurt. A Ruger Ranch Rifle in .223 or 7.62x39 would do fine, or if money is tight, I will also say look at a nice clean SKS.

Dragunov · 10-27-2009, 01:10 AM

What I did:

I'm not sure if I'll bug out or bug in. Depends on the situation.

I bought a Marlin 795 .22lr, I normally keep about 700rnds around for it although I'm a little low at the moment.

I have a Bersa .380, yeah, I know.... everyone thinks it's underpowered, I don't agree. I didn't have the money for a .45 plus I had new shooters here at the time. All of us here are proficient with it and can empty an entire mag into the thoracic cavity at ten yards. Even with target loads, this would be lethal very quickly, even through heavy clothes. I have 500 rounds stored for it.

I bought an SU-16 as it can use both 5.56 and .223. It's very sturdy, folds up and fits in a backpack, stores extra mags in the stock, It's far more accurate than the Mini I used to own, easy to maintain and reguardless what you've heard, extremely reliable. It goes BANG everytime I pull the trigger. I have 400rounds of .223 and 300 rounds of 5.56 stored for it.

I have a Romy SKS, all original, mixed numbers. Accurate enough. 2.5 to 3 MOA. Good enough. I bought it because it was a good value and I don't need to tell you about reliability, we all know that. I have 1000rnds of wolf/golden tiger stored for it.

I have a Norinco SKS, Choate stock, matching numbers that is even more accurate than my SU. I keep 500rnds of Komada around for it, with another 1000 coming in a couple of weeks.

I want to buy a Saiga in .223 or .308 although I prefer a .30-06.

I'm looking at a Mossy 500 w/pistol grip. Not sure If I want a shotty or not. Great tools, but I personally don't prefer them. Not only that, I'm trying to keep the different calibers and types at a bare minimum. If I need to arm someone, they can have the .22, It's better than nothing.

I'm wanting a high powered rifle for long shots. I want a WA2000, but at $75,000 I don't think I'll be getting that anytime soon.

My first choice is a Tac-Ops "Tango" model, but I'm not sure I want to spend $4500 on a .30-06 right now.

I'm thinking I would like a Marlin XL7 in .30-06. (Unless I can pick up a Saiga) At $250 to 300 bucks, It's the best value I've seen in a while. I'll keep 200rounds around for that as I don't plan on using it in SHTF much.

All in all, In my situation, It wouldn't do to have more than three different calibers as I like the K.I.S.S. method. I can grab all ammo, weapons, camping gear and food and be out very quickly if needed, or bug in and have plenty of defense. You're situation may be a lot different.

GlockMeister · 10-27-2009, 10:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rifleman14

well im thinking an AR...but if the 5.56 is underpowered...i want a target gun with low recoil and be able to use it for SHTF and be very accurate. the AR in 223 fits this but is it too underpowered?
then after that, i'll probably get a rock island 1911 but i dont like the GI sights. i like the tactical 3 white dot sights...anyone know if RIA makes a standard length 1911 with these sights?

Then just get an AR in 6.8SPC...Problem solved.

Metronome · 10-27-2009, 11:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dragunov

I have a Bersa .380, yeah, I know.... everyone thinks it's underpowered, I don't agree. I didn't have the money for a .45 plus I had new shooters here at the time. All of us here are proficient with it and can empty an entire mag into the thoracic cavity at ten yards. Even with target loads, this would be lethal very quickly, even through heavy clothes.
Not only that, I'm trying to keep the different calibers and types at a bare minimum. If I need to arm someone, they can have the .22, It's better than nothing.
All in all, In my situation, It wouldn't do to have more than three different calibers as I like the K.I.S.S. method. I can grab all ammo, weapons, camping gear and food and be out very quickly if needed, or bug in and have plenty of defense. You're situation may be a lot different.

The Bersa is an excellent pistol that can be carried all day, every day; regardless of what caliber snobs say, it will get 98% of the jobs done.
I believe a houseful of .22's guns is in far better shape than one with a single AR or high end 1911.
If everyone in the household is proficient in the arms you have available, I would say you are in great shape! always K.I.S.S.

rifleman14 · 10-27-2009, 03:39 PM

whats K.I.S.S.?

dog party · 10-27-2009, 03:52 PM

Keep It Simple Stupid.

Metronome · 10-27-2009, 09:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rifleman14

whats K.I.S.S.?

Or: Keep It Super Simple

Basically anything along the lines of "less is more".

Dragunov · 10-27-2009, 09:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Metronome

The Bersa is an excellent pistol that can be carried all day, every day; regardless of what caliber snobs say, it will get 98% of the jobs done.
I believe a houseful of .22's guns is in far better shape than one with a single AR or high end 1911.
If everyone in the household is proficient in the arms you have available, I would say you are in great shape! always K.I.S.S.

I couldn't agree more. I have spent my life learning how to be resourceful and use what I have for maximum effect. Everyone in my house has their own firearm and each knows how to care for, operate, and use their individual firearm and are proficient enough with everyone elses.

Whootsinator · 10-27-2009, 10:42 PM

I've always heard and said Keep It Simple, Stupid.

OneHitWonder · 10-28-2009, 01:30 AM

1) A reliable pistol. Your revolver is a good tool if working properly. Get it fixed for less than a new auto-loader.

2) Rem 870 or Mossberg 500 your pick. Sounds like the Mossy is your fav. 12 gauge is effective. Stick with it.

3) Rifle? You have a nice 30.06. Perfect. The 3030 is a good choice if you are comfortable with it. It gets faster ratee of fire. That could be the thing you need most of the rifle for defense rather than hunting. Check your prioity needs.

What to change?

I would get a semi-auto rifle first, then a auto pistol in 9mm or .45.

A ruger ranch rifle is under rated and priced fair. New ones shoot accurate. Mags of 20 0r 30 are available. They are rock solid, easy to maintain, eat any ammo and always go boom on command. For an ultimate long gun for hunting and defense ,an AR with uppers in 556 and 6.8 that you can interchange in seconds. Of course this is $2000 and up.

Cyrano · 10-28-2009, 12:11 PM

I agree with Mav and Dragunov that you want a semi-auto in either 7.62x39 ComBloc or 7.62 NATO/.308 Win instead of anything in .223/5.56 NATO as your long gun. Quite aside from the Stoner action's notorious inability to tolerate dirt, mud, sand, grime and dust, the AR line has way too many parts. Its only virtue is the ability to change uppers and magazines and thus be able to shoot multiple calibers. But for SHTF work, reliability counts more than versatility - a lot more.

Were I you, I'd go with an SKS if you like 7.62 ComBloc; or a CETME/G3, or an FN-FAL in 7.62 NATO if you prefer that cartridge. All three are battle rifles as opposed to assault rifles. All are designed to get dirty and still function properly. All of them have scope mounts available if you want to scope them (I would). And compared to AR-type rifles, they are a cinch to maintain.

This is of course my personal opinion so you may accept it or not, as you like. But when you plan for SHTF, if you plan for the worst and then it's not as bad as that, you're better off. The infamous unreliability of the AR-15/M-16 line should cause everyone to drop it from their list of SHTF guns to consider.

don5544 · 10-28-2009, 05:50 PM

Guys my experience with an SKS and AK's is that they break.

Only thing on my AR's that has ever broken was the buffer of all things.

Good ar is hard to beat.

Dragunov · 10-28-2009, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by don5544

Guys my experience with an SKS and AK's is that they break.

Only thing on my AR's that has ever broken was the buffer of all things.

Good ar is hard to beat.

Wow! I've never broken my SKS, as a matter of fact, the only SKS I've ever heard of breaking was a Chinese that due to the firing pin being installed improperly, the firing pin broke. I have two SKS', a Romy and a Norinco. I've NEVER had them do anything bu go "BANG!" when I pull the trigger. As I've never owned an AK, I can't comment on that.

TACAV · 10-28-2009, 07:22 PM

Firearms are machines, some are made better than others and all of them will eventually break.. all of them. some just last a bit longer than others and some will take more wear and tear than others. But in the end none of them are indestructible.

But if you take even the most basic of preventative care and maintenance to any quality firearm platform they will all take a whole lot of punishment and serve you well.

Choose the right quality tools for the job or the situation at hand, train with them, know them in and out, have spare parts for them in your SHTF stores and know how to replace them, know their strengths and limitations, and then train some more with them whether it be a 1911 or a Glock, or an AR or an AK, a double barrel shotgun, or a blackpowder muzzle loader.

gunadvocate · 10-29-2009, 01:12 PM

owned an AK for 6 years and it has never not gone bang... Ive had my AR jam up in the early periods before the break-in (it works flawlessly now with normal cleaning) but the AK does not break and is an extremely reliable gun. I have only had an sks not go bang when someone altered the magazine configuration to accept 30 rounders that caused jamming.

A good combo for rifles/weapons in SHTF is something hi cap sighted rifle with an assault caliber round for mid range shooting, a long range higher caliber sniper configuration, a close range P.D.W. like a 12 gauge, and a pistol either in 9mm or .45 ACP... and a good knife

IMHO

10-26-2009, 10:47 PM	#21
Metronome Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Northern California Posts: 951	Maybe it is just me, but I think you are in pretty good shape with the 12 gauges and the .30-30 (save for a military invasion or zombie horde), I would just hide away any guns you wouldn't shoot to save your life, and invest in a good handgun - say a high capacity 9mm (or three) with spare magazines in tactical places. I am all about military calibers (9mm, .223, .308) at the moment. A quality autoloader couldn't hurt. A Ruger Ranch Rifle in .223 or 7.62x39 would do fine, or if money is tight, I will also say look at a nice clean SKS. __________________ I take my coffee how I take my women: bitter and overbearing.

10-27-2009, 01:10 AM	#22
Dragunov Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Peoples Repooblik of Kaliforniastan. Posts: 609	What I did: I'm not sure if I'll bug out or bug in. Depends on the situation. I bought a Marlin 795 .22lr, I normally keep about 700rnds around for it although I'm a little low at the moment. I have a Bersa .380, yeah, I know.... everyone thinks it's underpowered, I don't agree. I didn't have the money for a .45 plus I had new shooters here at the time. All of us here are proficient with it and can empty an entire mag into the thoracic cavity at ten yards. Even with target loads, this would be lethal very quickly, even through heavy clothes. I have 500 rounds stored for it. I bought an SU-16 as it can use both 5.56 and .223. It's very sturdy, folds up and fits in a backpack, stores extra mags in the stock, It's far more accurate than the Mini I used to own, easy to maintain and reguardless what you've heard, extremely reliable. It goes BANG everytime I pull the trigger. I have 400rounds of .223 and 300 rounds of 5.56 stored for it. I have a Romy SKS, all original, mixed numbers. Accurate enough. 2.5 to 3 MOA. Good enough. I bought it because it was a good value and I don't need to tell you about reliability, we all know that. I have 1000rnds of wolf/golden tiger stored for it. I have a Norinco SKS, Choate stock, matching numbers that is even more accurate than my SU. I keep 500rnds of Komada around for it, with another 1000 coming in a couple of weeks. I want to buy a Saiga in .223 or .308 although I prefer a .30-06. I'm looking at a Mossy 500 w/pistol grip. Not sure If I want a shotty or not. Great tools, but I personally don't prefer them. Not only that, I'm trying to keep the different calibers and types at a bare minimum. If I need to arm someone, they can have the .22, It's better than nothing. I'm wanting a high powered rifle for long shots. I want a WA2000, but at $75,000 I don't think I'll be getting that anytime soon. My first choice is a Tac-Ops "Tango" model, but I'm not sure I want to spend $4500 on a .30-06 right now. I'm thinking I would like a Marlin XL7 in .30-06. (Unless I can pick up a Saiga) At $250 to 300 bucks, It's the best value I've seen in a while. I'll keep 200rounds around for that as I don't plan on using it in SHTF much. All in all, In my situation, It wouldn't do to have more than three different calibers as I like the K.I.S.S. method. I can grab all ammo, weapons, camping gear and food and be out very quickly if needed, or bug in and have plenty of defense. You're situation may be a lot different. Last edited by Dragunov; 10-27-2009 at 01:13 AM.

10-28-2009, 01:30 AM	#30
OneHitWonder Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 13	3 gun rule is good. 1) A reliable pistol. Your revolver is a good tool if working properly. Get it fixed for less than a new auto-loader. 2) Rem 870 or Mossberg 500 your pick. Sounds like the Mossy is your fav. 12 gauge is effective. Stick with it. 3) Rifle? You have a nice 30.06. Perfect. The 3030 is a good choice if you are comfortable with it. It gets faster ratee of fire. That could be the thing you need most of the rifle for defense rather than hunting. Check your prioity needs. What to change? I would get a semi-auto rifle first, then a auto pistol in 9mm or .45. A ruger ranch rifle is under rated and priced fair. New ones shoot accurate. Mags of 20 0r 30 are available. They are rock solid, easy to maintain, eat any ammo and always go boom on command. For an ultimate long gun for hunting and defense ,an AR with uppers in 556 and 6.8 that you can interchange in seconds. Of course this is $2000 and up.

10-28-2009, 07:22 PM	#34
TACAV Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 1,538	Firearms are machines, some are made better than others and all of them will eventually break.. all of them. some just last a bit longer than others and some will take more wear and tear than others. But in the end none of them are indestructible. But if you take even the most basic of preventative care and maintenance to any quality firearm platform they will all take a whole lot of punishment and serve you well. Choose the right quality tools for the job or the situation at hand, train with them, know them in and out, have spare parts for them in your SHTF stores and know how to replace them, know their strengths and limitations, and then train some more with them whether it be a 1911 or a Glock, or an AR or an AK, a double barrel shotgun, or a blackpowder muzzle loader. __________________ Zombies don't hold grudges, discriminate, or negotiate- Neither should you. -The Zen of Zombie-

10-29-2009, 01:12 PM	#35
gunadvocate Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Knoxville Posts: 274	owned an AK for 6 years and it has never not gone bang... Ive had my AR jam up in the early periods before the break-in (it works flawlessly now with normal cleaning) but the AK does not break and is an extremely reliable gun. I have only had an sks not go bang when someone altered the magazine configuration to accept 30 rounders that caused jamming. A good combo for rifles/weapons in SHTF is something hi cap sighted rifle with an assault caliber round for mid range shooting, a long range higher caliber sniper configuration, a close range P.D.W. like a 12 gauge, and a pistol either in 9mm or .45 ACP... and a good knife IMHO __________________ "Love my country, fear my government..."
	1 members found this post helpful.

10-27-2009, 03:39 PM	#25
rifleman14 Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Indiana Posts: 436	whats K.I.S.S.?

10-27-2009, 03:52 PM	#26
dog party Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Virginia Posts: 275	Keep It Simple Stupid.

10-27-2009, 10:42 PM	#29
Whootsinator Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 582	I've always heard and said Keep It Simple, Stupid.

10-28-2009, 12:11 PM	#31
Cyrano Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: New York Posts: 6,933	I agree with Mav and Dragunov that you want a semi-auto in either 7.62x39 ComBloc or 7.62 NATO/.308 Win instead of anything in .223/5.56 NATO as your long gun. Quite aside from the Stoner action's notorious inability to tolerate dirt, mud, sand, grime and dust, the AR line has way too many parts. Its only virtue is the ability to change uppers and magazines and thus be able to shoot multiple calibers. But for SHTF work, reliability counts more than versatility - a lot more. Were I you, I'd go with an SKS if you like 7.62 ComBloc; or a CETME/G3, or an FN-FAL in 7.62 NATO if you prefer that cartridge. All three are battle rifles as opposed to assault rifles. All are designed to get dirty and still function properly. All of them have scope mounts available if you want to scope them (I would). And compared to AR-type rifles, they are a cinch to maintain. This is of course my personal opinion so you may accept it or not, as you like. But when you plan for SHTF, if you plan for the worst and then it's not as bad as that, you're better off. The infamous unreliability of the AR-15/M-16 line should cause everyone to drop it from their list of SHTF guns to consider.

10-28-2009, 05:50 PM	#32
don5544 Member Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 34	Guys my experience with an SKS and AK's is that they break. Only thing on my AR's that has ever broken was the buffer of all things. Good ar is hard to beat.