[SwedeSteve]

Billy HIT the nail on the head! And he loves that. .22LR/.410 is a "survival weapon". A true gamegetter in every sense of the word. Can I face down a rabid horde of squirrels? You betcha'. Will a .410 slug kill a deer? Quite well thank you! As far as a .223 taking deer, as a young teen I took several blactail/mule deer with a .222 Rem. In a perfect situation, I would have my M24V, a semi pistol , and something in 7.62x39 or 5.56. If I was stuck with only ONE firearm, my 24V would get the nod, with as much 22 & 410 as I could carry.

[e3mrk]

I would think a excellent Rifle would be a bolt action as there are less Parts to break.

[A7XFREAK]

Saw this while searching stuff, time for an almost 3 year revive. I personally have a Mosin Nagant, SKS, and Marlin Model 60, all of which, ammo is almost anywhere, except the mosin, but I can get that before the shtf too bad and smears it on the walls.

[CrazyIvan]

I think any gun in a survival situation is better than nothing. Depending on where you are and what the environment is like, the need for a different kind of 'survival' rifle would be different as well. Someone in an urban or suburban area or where they may run into people would be better suited to have a semi-auto rifle than a bolt-action. If you happen to get into it with anyone, it doesn't matter the size of bullet, generally the one who sends lead down range the fastest will be able to escape while supressing the enemy.

Out in the woods or country, sure...a bolt-action might be better.

As far as .223 for deer, why not? There are plenty of stories of people taking deer with as small as .22lr and up. Against the law? So what? If you are in a true survival situation, I don't think you are going to care if the gun you are hunting your life-sustaining food with is against the law...I'm not going to care anyway.

Living in the city, I want a rifle that can get me the hell out of here if I need to leave. A bolt-action just won't do it. I will take as much ammo and guns as I can from what I have, including a bolt-action Mosin being my largest caliber rifle and a Marlin 70PS being the smallest caliber rifle. But, if I can only take one gun or have to ditch my stock at some point on the road, it will be my 16"bbl AR-15.

If I had an AK, my one gun might be that one, but until then, it is one of my AR's.

[Ten Man]

Interesting that Kev made his Post, then disappeared.

The only exception I had to his original Post was the caliber of AR he was talking about. I agree that the AR15 is inadequate as a "long term Survival gun."

Evidently he had not heard of AR10 in 7.62x51/.308.

That is my GO TO gun for any and all survival situations. I have scoped 20" upper and carbine 16" upper. Universal applicability, when combined with a good .22 revolver and .45ACP semi-auto pistol.

Of course, we have the obligatory bolt action .308, .30-06, and lever action .30-30 as backups.

Remember, a variety of tools make the work easier.

[thrillbilly]

oh what the heck.... all ya need is a SUPREMELY VIABLE 10/22!









...and maybe a bolt-action .410... (for the ''serious'' work)

[stinkybriches]

the op is/was an idiot. obviously he hate's semi auto rifles.

am i the only one that saw the pic's and thought," gee, that looks like a tiny deer, and small hog".

if he needs a .280 to kill those little critters, he'd need a .338 to take on a wisconsin white tail.

ive killed so many squirells with #6 shot from a .410 between 25-35 yards its obsurd. if he needs #4 shot for squirell, does he need #1 buck to really anchor a turkey?

im pro .223 for deer. however im with ten man, my ar10 is going anywhere i go if tshtf.

[Ballbearing]

To put it simply: I'd get something that is incredibly rugged, shoots ammunition that is easy to obtain, relatively inexpensive and plentiful, and that doesn't require a great deal of maintenence other than a good cleaning when appropriate, and that doesn't have fragile parts or multiple, small parts that are easy to lose if dropped in the grass or on a carpet. Considering that, I recommend:
1. 1903 or 03/A3 Springfield in .30-06
2. Ishapore (India Manufactured) Lee-Enfield in 7.62 mm NATO
3. M1 Garand in .30-06
4. M14 (M1A civilian version) in 7.62 mm (.308 Win)
5. Ruger M77 International in either .30-06 or .308 Win. (Unfortunately Ruger doesn't manufacture the International any longer but they do have some comparable models that aren't quite as good, but close.

I don't recommend rifles in 7.62X39 because after all the surplus ammo has been exhausted and the foreign made ammo gets cut off from U.S. importation, I don't really know how easy it will be to find. I don't recommend the M1 carbine either, again for ammo scarcity. I hardly ever see the ammo on gun shop shelves anymore and there are tons of M1 Carbines, M1 replicas like the Iver Johnson version and Ruger Blackhawks chambered for it out there.

Personally, if I thought I could actually survive a SHTF scenario at my age and I was actually going to try, there are only two guns I would take. A standard goverment model 1911 A1 in .45 ACP and a semi-auto carbine like that one that Heckler and Koch put out a few years ago in the same caliber. I could carry lots of ammo in a couple of old .50 BMG Army ammo boxes, you know, the old U.S. Army kind with the
hinged lid. If money wasn't an object, I'd buy a Colt Ace .22 conversion kit for the 19911 and take that with me as well, with a 1000 rounds of .22 LR to boot. That and a good quality military fighting knife and a good quantity of rope or strong cord of some kind, a few fish hooks, a sharpening stone, a flint and tinder kit and some water proof matches and salt tablets and I'd be a rock, an island unto myself.

[animalspooker]

I have the perfect survival rifle and it has been mentioned twice in this post. The Savage Model (I think) 22 (or 21) and it is in a 22lr over a 410 shotgun. I can kill any and everything that lives within 500 miles of where I live. My "Only" concern with it is protecting my family as it is a single shot.

[Doc Jones]

Quote:       Originally Posted by animalspooker

I have the perfect survival rifle and it has been mentioned twice in this post. The Savage Model (I think) 22 (or 21) and it is in a 22lr over a 410 shotgun. I can kill any and everything that lives within 500 miles of where I live. My "Only" concern with it is protecting my family as it is a single shot.

Which is exactly the point. A true survival rifle must be a "jack of all trades".

It must be

- Light enough to pack around (rails aren't always your friend)
- Durable enough to survive in less-than-ideal conditions (no finicky ARs, if you want an AR get a good one).
- Chambered in a common caliber (as previously mentioned above)
- Quick to re-load in a fire fight (heaven forbid) (sorry, no bolt action or lever action much as I love 'em)
- Able to shoot as far or further than the carbines of your likely attackers (rules out pistol-caliber carbines, shotguns and .22s)
- Chambered in a caliber that can reliably knock down a deer/zombie without a "great" or "lucky" shot.

Some great potential candidates:

G3/Cetme in .308
FAL .308
M1A Scout or Socom in .308
High-end AR-10 (not a cheap/finicky one)
AK-47 (get a good one not a crappy one)
Ruger Mini-14 or Mini-30
High end AR-15
SKS (if you're handy with stripper clips)

Now, before someone has an aneurysm, let me say that a good .22, 30-30 lever, bolt action deer rifle, pistol-caliber carbine and shotgun would be wonderful tools for TEOTWAWKI but each falls short in at least one of the critical "Survival Rifle" jobs.

If you can only have one rifle, you'd better get one that can do all the jobs moderatley well. Then branch out with other, more-specialized tools.

Doc

[Piper17]

Quote:       Originally Posted by animalspooker

I have the perfect survival rifle and it has been mentioned twice in this post. The Savage Model (I think) 22 (or 21) and it is in a 22lr over a 410 shotgun. I can kill any and everything that lives within 500 miles of where I live. My "Only" concern with it is protecting my family as it is a single shot.

It was later called the model 24 over/under Savage. It came out in .22LR/410 and then .22LR/20 and .22WMR/20 and even the Hornet/20 with variations as years passed.

I had the .22WMR/20 gauge in 1971 and really liked it. Learned a lot from that combo rifle-shotgun.

It takes down easily too! A good choice for survival in the wilderness.

For survival in the wilderness and martial law I'd go for a SOCOM 16 or Colt LE M-4 "assault rifle."

.308 or 7.62 NATO or 5.56mm would be a very available ammunition supply either way.

[BarryHalls]

Quote:       Originally Posted by Ten Man

Remember, a variety of tools make the work easier.

Couldn't have said it better! And many hands make light work!

I'm seeing more and more that 'bugging out' isn't viable. I could bug out to my grandparents place, about 10 miles down the highway, and live on the farm, but that's about it. I need to be somewhere close to friends and family, but live right with my means of self sufficiency. I need some land, for privacy, cultivation, and hunting, with a brick/block house with a heck of a stocked gun room!

[Henri]

Too close to Tuscumbia, you really need a 'weed' field and some paraquat.

[Dragunov]

Being that I'm a cheap B@$t@RDd, all my weapons must double as hunting/self defense weapons. 5.56 and 7.62X39 are by far the most common center fire rounds available, so I use those. Between those two rounds, I can fend off everything from hoards of vicious ankle biting squirrels, to two legged varmints to black bears.

[Deersniper]

My new one. Bushy 308. 4x12x40 scope on top. 19 in 10 seconds. 7.3 lbs before scope.

[Dragunov]

Quote:       Originally Posted by SilentSoul

I think a 7.62 would kill the animals in all the above situations. You would have to be a good shot to knock that squirrel out of the tree with an Ak BUT, I think billy could make it happen.(with his hatred for dimes a squirrel is nothing) It all comes down to How easy can you find that 280 ammo? I'm betting I can get 5.56 and 7.62 almost anywhere if SHTF. And can you afford to stockpile enough to keep yourself in ammunition? You want a caliber that is readily avaiable. And can you toss your Remington in the silt and mud pick it up and keep shooting??

I agree. We don't over look a good deer rifle, but we do try and get rifles that cover the widest range of possibilities. The SKS or the AR-15 (I do not agree that 5.56 is too small for deer). with the slight edge going to the AR due to the fact it's probably a little better for smaller game than the SKS. It would be impractical and dangerous to try and fend off more than like three raiders with a bolt act say, within 75 yds.

An SKS or an AR (I will include the AK47 also), will do that job more efficiently and still kill a deer out to 300 yds or better depending on the shooter. I DO agree that a bigger rifle caliber bolt act is probably better for deer, but impractical for defense. In my humble opinion, a 12g pump or semi auto that you can use buckshot or slugs in would be far more practical than a deer rifle. That's NOT to say that I'd leave behind a good Marlin or Stevens bolt act if SHTF. Far from it. You may NEED to take that 600 yd shot for some reason and if you do, you'll need the proper tool for that.

[Dragunov]

Quote:       Originally Posted by Deersniper

My new one. Bushy 308. 4x12x40 scope on top. 19 in 10 seconds. 7.3 lbs before scope.

Lucky B@$t@rd!

[animalspooker]

I again will be carrying the Savage 24 with a couple of thousand rounds of 22lr in my pack. I would like to carry an AR10 also, but you all are yet to give me one....Deersniper, that one will do!

But seriously, what will be more dependable/less likely to break down? An AR-10, Saiga 308, or some other 7.62x51, semi-automatic rifle? And remember, money is an issue!

[oldjarhead]

Quote:       Originally Posted by Ballbearing

I don't recommend rifles in 7.62X39 because after all the surplus ammo has been exhausted and the foreign made ammo gets cut off from U.S. importation, I don't really know how easy it will be to find. I don't recommend the M1 carbine either, again for ammo scarcity. I hardly ever see the ammo on gun shop shelves anymore and there are tons of M1 Carbines, M1 replicas like the Iver Johnson version and Ruger Blackhawks chambered for it out there.

I'm at a loss with your statement that .30 M1 Carbine ammo is scarce. CMP sells Aquila and now Remington ammunition for reasonable prices. A multitude of on-line sites sell it. As there are tons of carbines and cloned carbines, as well as pistols, it would make a very viable survival weapon. The ability to share ammo with family members and friends will be an important factor within groups. If every one has different calibers that will make survival more difficult...that being said, a small variety of calibers would be helpful as long as ammo can be shared.

When that all perfect, can-do-anything, survival weapon is discovered, I hope the finder will share the find; until then a good .22lr and easy-to-carry center fire will have to do. Small game, larger game, and protection.

[CrazyIvan]

How about a break-barrel double barrel shotgun? I prefer side-by-side myself. These were used for generations by people out in the boonies for everything from shooting small game to big game to defense of their families, livestock and property.

With a variety of shell-types, from bird shot to buck shot to slug shot, you have the ability to take down a huge variety of targets. Being a break-barrel, there are very few moving parts increasing the longevity of the firearm without much to worry about failing. And considering the lack of any type of automatic ammo feeding, they even will continue to work fine without cleaning for a huge extended period of time and after many shots have been taken if necessary. Do they have rifle barreled shotguns too for increased slug accuracy? That would be preferable as well.