pre/post ban magazine capacity

Discussion in 'The Powder Keg' started by AR-tim, Apr 29, 2002.

  1. AR-tim

    AR-tim G&G Newbie

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    A friend of mine, was trying to tell me it would be illegal to put pre-ban(high capacity) mags in my post ban AR-15. He says I can't put a GI 30 round mag in my AR, I can only use the mags that hold 5, 10, and I think he says 20. Is he wrong???? I thought the only thing the gun ban affected was production of hi capacity mags, not the use. He says cause the gun comes with a 10 round mag, thats all I can use...I think he is wrong, other wise I am going to have some mags for sale.......

    -Tim
  2. BattleRifleG3

    BattleRifleG3 Retired Moderator

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    ONE gun dealer has told me the same. Everyone else says he's a dodo. And I'm pretty sure I read an ATF letter saying it's ok.
    If you find credible evidence otherwise, let us all know, for obvious reasons.
  3. azeeb

    azeeb G&G Newbie

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    I don't know about AR-15's, but for pistols it is fine to use pre ban mags with new guns. All high capacity magazines from para ordnance are pre ban and they sell them to use with new production guns.
  4. BattleRifleG3

    BattleRifleG3 Retired Moderator

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    The law doesn't discriminate between rifles and pistols. The only difference would be if using the hi-caps requires modification of an imported gun, like the HK-SL8 or the single stack AKs, in which case you'd have to first replace enough parts with US made ones to be legal.
  5. MessedUpMike

    MessedUpMike G&G Newbie

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    This is an old post but....

    The ban only affects the MANUFACTURE of new "high cap. mags" if they are legal to own in your state then they are legal in your gun. For instance it's illegal to buy/sell/trade/recieve mags over 20rnds within the state of Md. Ownership however is not illegal, ergo you go into Pa and Va. to buy them. Duh. If you own an AR or any other gun with a detachable magazine if it fits in the gun and it's not specifically outlawed by the state you reside in then you can use it. For more specific infromation on the Post-ban rules, and a ton of information on AR15s check http://www.Md-ar15.com



    Good luck
    Mike
  6. sniper762

    sniper762 G&G Enthusiast

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    The ban in question, I beleive is magazine capacity, post or preban. I beleive the ban on magazine capacity was in 1994. This was a federal ban, not a state, therefore any firearm manufactured after the ban, be it pistol or rifle, was prohibited from holding more than 10 rounds. Take the Beretta, 92 9mm pistol. They began being sold with 10 round magazines. Sure a 15 round magazine will work in it, but it would be illegal. The AR15 started being sold with 10 round mags. They were nothing but 20 round mags with blocks in them restricting them to 10 rounds. Larger capacity mags will still work but the gun would be illegal if the larger capacity mag was in it. Bottom line is that if a gun was manufactured after the 10 round magazine ban, then it would be illegal to posess it with a larger capacity magazine in it.
  7. AR-tim

    AR-tim G&G Newbie

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    Wow! Another one of my old threads. I don't even remember who told me that. Anyways... I believe it to be legal to use high cap mags in 'post ban' guns. I believe that Beretta is selling new 92's with the old 15 round mags. That, and the ban prohibits high cap production from my understanding. Either way, I am still going to use my 30 rounders in my AR.
  8. BattleRifleG3

    BattleRifleG3 Retired Moderator

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    New Bushmaster 308 rifles are shipped with pre-ban hi-caps as the only mag.

    ONE gun dealer has said it is illegal, and he was trying to sell me a pre-ban S&W pistol. Guns are marketed with that ability as a plus. Some, even many illegal things are not noticed or prosecuted, but this would be a friggin huge blatant obvious in everyone's face illegal thing if it were so.

    No, it is not illegal to put a pre-ban hi-cap mag in a post-ban gun.

    What is illegal is modifying a currently imported rifle to take a military mag without keeping the imported parts count aqt 10 or less. Or modifying a pre-ban mag to fit a different gun so much that the mag won't work in the original gun.

    This stuff is easy to get confused over.
  9. Logansdad

    Logansdad Guest

  10. Logansdad

    Logansdad Guest

    UNDERSTANDING THE FEDERAL "ASSAULT WEAPONS" BAN
    David S. Markowitz

    Slightly revised 4/23/2000.

    On September 13, 1994, a ban on newly-manufactured "assault weapons" went into effect. Aside from enacting a law of dubious Constitutionality and utility, Congress also created a field of landmines for law-abiding gun owners. I continually see posts in online discussion groups asking what constitutes an "assault weapon." I therefore have created this outline to help you understand this law. Note that the AWB and the high capacity magazine ban do not apply to the military or to law enforcement agencies.

    (Note: At the same time the AWB was enacted, a ban on "high capacity" or "large capacity" feeding devices (magazines) was also enacted. This will be dealt with after the AWB.)

    First off, the AWB only applies to semiautomatic guns manufactured after its effectivetured after its effective date, i.e., September 13, 1994. Guns manufactured before this date do not> need to be turned in or modified to comply with the law's provisions.

    Generally speaking, it is the part of the gun bearing the serial number which determines when the gun was manufactured. This is virtually always the receiver or frame, although the SN may also be stamped elsewhere on the gun, such as the slide, in addition to being on the frame. For example, on the AR-15 and its clones, the serial number is stamped on the lower receiver. This is the part by which the date of manufacture will be determined.

    Please note that the definitions of "assault weapon" and many other terms in this law are specific to this law. They are not necessarily the definitions used by the people who actually use these weapons, like the military, or will be found in a knowledgeable source such as my own Glossary of Firearms Terms.

    Rifles:

    Any semiautomatic rifle made after 9/13/94, which can accept a detachable magazine and which has two or more of the following characteristics is a banned AW:

    Folding or telescoping stock,
    Pistol grip which protrudes conspicuously below the action of the gun,
    Bayonet mount,
    Flash suppressor or a threaded barrel designed to accommodate a flash suppressor,sh suppressor,
    Grenade launcher.
    I have seen AR-15 clones advertised which, although they aren't fitted with a flash hider, do have a muzzlebreak on the end of the barrel. If this is threaded on the gun would appear to posses the threaded-barrel feature, even if there's no flash suppressor on the gun. For this to be legal, the muzzlebrake must be permanently attached, e.g., with silver solder. Be careful!

    Pistols:

    Any semiautomatic pistol made after 9/13/94 which can accept a detachable magazine and has at least two of the following characteristics is a banned AW:

    The magazine attaches to the gun outside of a magazine well inside the pistol grip,
    Threaded muzzle which can accept a flash suppressor, barrel extension, etc.,
    As manufactured, a weight of 50 ounces or more unloaded,
    Barrel shroud/heat shield which allows the shooter to grasp the weapon with the offhand when shooting without getting burned,
    A semiautomatic version of a fully automatic weapon.
    Shotguns:

    Any semiautomatic shotgun manufactured after 9/13/94 that has at least two of the following features is a banned AW:

    Folding or telescoping stock,lescoping stock,
    Pistol grip which protrudes conspicuously below the action of the gun,
    Fixed magazine capacity of more than 5 rounds,
    The ability to accept a detachable magazine.
    Exceptions to the AWB:

    Guns manufactured on or before the effective date of the AWB, 9/13/94.
    Any firearm listed in 22 U.S.C. §922, Appendix A, as such were manufactured before 10/1/93, and replicas/duplicates of such guns. Most of these guns are historic or hunting weapons, not typical AWs.
    Manually operated guns, e.g., bolt action, slide action, or lever action.
    Semiautomatic rifle which cannot accept a detachable magazine, e.g., unmodified military-issue SKS carbines.
    Semiautomatic shotguns which cannot hold more than five rounds in the magazine.
    Firearms considered "antiques" under federal law, e.g., made before 1898 or muzzleloaders.
    Guns modified so that they can never be fired (i.e., "rendered permanently inoperable").
    The High Capacity Magazine Ban:

    Also part of the 1994 Crime Bill was a ban on newly-manufactured detachable magazines (aka "clips") which hold more than 10 rounds. The ban also was supposed to applywas supposed to apply to tubular magazines which do not detach from the magazine and hold ammunition other than .22 rimfires. However, an exception has been effected for tubular magazines on lever action centerfire rifles. For example, you can legally buy Winchester 94s in .45 Colt which hold more than 10 rounds, and which were made after 9/94.

    Penalties for Violating the AWB or the High Capacity Magazine Ban:

    If you get caught violating either law, you are subject to a $5,000 fine and/or up to 5 years in prison. Since this is a felony, you also lose your right to ever again own a firearm, unless you can get the right back from a court (which is not likely).

    In conclusion, regardless of their Constitutionality or effect on crime, it is in your best interests as a gun owner to understand the provisions of the 1994 AWB and high capacity magazine ban.
  11. sniper762

    sniper762 G&G Enthusiast

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    Lot of jargon you posted there Logansdad. Call me stupid I guess, but what I got out of that is that if the gun was manufactured after 1994, it cannot be posessed with a magazine larger than 10 rounds. Is this what it says?
  12. Logansdad

    Logansdad Guest

    the way it was explained to me was a post ban weapon is not to be loaded with a pre ban magazine...but people have done it with inpunity and to my knowledge it has never been enforced :insane:
  13. BattleRifleG3

    BattleRifleG3 Retired Moderator

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    The ban is on making the feeding devices. It says NOTHING about using them in guns made after the ban. Kel Tec, Armalite, Bushmaster, everyone has made guns with the selling point of taking pre-ban hi-caps. ATF letters on the subject have explained how modifying a mag for a new gun would and wouldn't be legal.

    Find me any law or ATF letter saying hi-caps can't be used in a post-ban gun, and I will bake you a cake... and eat it myself in your honor.
  14. Logansdad

    Logansdad Guest

    and this is why we have lawyers..
  15. BattleRifleG3

    BattleRifleG3 Retired Moderator

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    If only they worked for cake...
  16. sniper762

    sniper762 G&G Enthusiast

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    I t would be a good question for ATF to answer. I would like to see the answer from them.
  17. Logansdad

    Logansdad Guest

    it will be a moot point 14 Sept 2004 :right:
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