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Discussion Starter #1
I picked up a "spare" ar-15 upper and it didn't take very long until I just had to build it out. I already have some parts sitting in a box and only needed a few more. I have a nice Midwest industries 7" handguard, low pro gas block, and a 5.56 bolt and CH. The election happened and I decided it was now or maybe never? so anyways I ordered a 7.5" 1/8 .300 blackout barrel from Bear creek arsenal, along with a 5/8x24 FH to top it off. They were in stock with free shipping $110 out the door for barrel and FH. I wanted a Ballistic advantage but couldn't find one in stock. I've also picked up a pistol gas tube, dust port cover and a FA Derlin plug. thats right. I dont need an FA on this pistol. someone makes a nice little black derlin plug that pins in where the forward assist would be. its light, problem free, and keeps it sealed up.

eventually I'll get a new BCG and bolt dedicated to the .300 and hopefully another pistol lower, but we'll see if that is possible...

This will be my second upper build. hopefully it will go a little smoother, I think i've got a better hand on it going into it so that is promising!

So it begins with a box of "Spare parts"

blkbox.jpg
 

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Discussion Starter #2
I just added it all up, $195.

Upper $50
barrel and FH $110
gas tube, dust port cover and FA plug $35


this all includes shipping.

ANNNNDDDD THHHEENNNN

$125 for 100 rounds of 125gr HPBT PriviPartisan .300aac black out ammo!!!!!!!

definitely the most expensive ammo i've ever bought. well ok, maybe i spent $20 on 20 rounds of .380 HP, but still.. thats totally different.

but hey, i figure 100 rounds is enough to function check, zero and have a few loaded mags. better than nothing.

I recently sold a old .22mag rifle and a .22lr pistol, so that is funding this. I planned to use those funds to buy another 9mm pistol. but i realized i dont need that, couldnt find what i wanted, and would rather have this.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
ok, Irons, or RDS?

I could take the rds off my 5.56 pistol upper

I want to keep this thing as simple and basic as possible. Which has me leaning to just plain old irons. I have a few good rear irons to choose from, folding and fixed, but could use a better front sight.

I'll probably mount a light on it, and thats it! oh and i gotta figure out how i want to set up a sling for it.
 

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You only need sights for day time and a light for night. LOL I have found if you want to shoot skunks in the dark a cheap laser will save ammo. Otherwise less is more and the less stuff to snag or have to push buttons or levers on the better. If you walk around in the dark a lot, a tritium front sight is worth the money, I say that because you are in Colorado and my prior comment about having to walk past a bear in the dark, twice actually, once in New Mexico also. Not much more fun than a wolfing bear up close when you cannot see it. But that will be a good gun for that chore. Hurry up and tell us how it shoots.
 
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You only need sights for day time and a light for night. LOL I have found if you want to shoot skunks in the dark a cheap laser will save ammo. Otherwise less is more and the less stuff to snag or have to push buttons or levers on the better. If you walk around in the dark a lot, a tritium front sight is worth the money, I say that because you are in Colorado and my prior comment about having to walk past a bear in the dark, twice actually, once in New Mexico also. Not much more fun than a wolfing bear up close when you cannot see it. But that will be a good gun for that chore. Hurry up and tell us how it shoots.
That's exactly what i have planned for it. A truck camping/ mountain exploring gun. It's defensive only so the fact that its limited to 150 yards or so isn't an issue. and I want it to just work, the irons will never run out of batteries, even if the light does. tritium or some sort of glow in the dark front sight is a great idea!

Trust me I cant wait for parts to start arriving!
as i usually do, I ordered over the weekend so none of it has even shipped yet!
 

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ok, Irons, or RDS?

I could take the rds off my 5.56 pistol upper

I want to keep this thing as simple and basic as possible. Which has me leaning to just plain old irons. I have a few good rear irons to choose from, folding and fixed, but could use a better front sight.

I'll probably mount a light on it, and thats it! oh and i gotta figure out how i want to set up a sling for it.
Depends on your vision.

Irons are a little slower but accurate if you practice shooting them (I was surprised at what I was able to do with the standard M1 irons at the 3-800 yard range several weeks back). A RDS is better for speed and at lower light IMHO. Some type of variable optic is also a thought.

I have a glow post on one of my MP-15 sports. It's OK but you can only adjust the height based on a full turn (i.e. you lose the part where the tritium faces away which may or may not be important depending on how the thing zeroes). And for not that much more $ you can get something like a holosun or Sig Romeo RDS. The very basic (cheap) sight marks have done better than I thought they would on a few uppers as well.

I don't know if I'd suggest pulling stuff off a zeroed upper at this point because there is significant time and energy in re-zeroing whatever (as well as ammo); if you think you might use the upper later with the optic I'd probably just leave it on and try a set of irons and see how you like them. If you make them like an MBUS (Tacticon has some rugged and decent sights that are cheaper than the Magpuls) you can always add an optic later and still have the zeroed backup irons.
 

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ok, Irons, or RDS?

I could take the rds off my 5.56 pistol upper

I want to keep this thing as simple and basic as possible. Which has me leaning to just plain old irons. I have a few good rear irons to choose from, folding and fixed, but could use a better front sight.

I'll probably mount a light on it, and thats it! oh and i gotta figure out how i want to set up a sling for it.
If you truly intend to use it as a "pistol," then iron sights should be sufficient. Additionally, there is nothing that can go wrong with them (short of smashing them off the gun). As TXplt said, it depends on what you are going to use it for.

I look at a "truck gun" as a weapon of opportunity, or desperation, depending on the circumstances. I consider it part of the "Emergency Gear" in the vehicle. 150 years ago, men rode open country on horseback, so needed to have a hand gun and a rifle at the ready. These days, few folks venture very far into "wild country" and when they do, it is usually for the purpose of adventure, and they take the appropriate firearms with them for that intended purpose. The rest of the time, the "truck gun" just sits in the vehicle, ready for whatever. Iron sights do not decay or go dead by sitting and waiting.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Excellent points Tenman and Txplt!

I'm going to start with folding irons.


Now, I may have identified an issue.
the barrel I ordered supposedly comes with a gas port drilled to .125", which based on my research is at the max large end of the gas port size recommendations. So ive reached out to the mfg to see if that is in fact the case, and if its meant for all types of .300 blk or only subs. I suppose an adj gas block would solve the issue if it is one.
 

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If you truly intend to use it as a "pistol," then iron sights should be sufficient. Additionally, there is nothing that can go wrong with them (short of smashing them off the gun). As TXplt said, it depends on what you are going to use it for.

I look at a "truck gun" as a weapon of opportunity, or desperation, depending on the circumstances. I consider it part of the "Emergency Gear" in the vehicle. 150 years ago, men rode open country on horseback, so needed to have a hand gun and a rifle at the ready. These days, few folks venture very far into "wild country" and when they do, it is usually for the purpose of adventure, and they take the appropriate firearms with them for that intended purpose. The rest of the time, the "truck gun" just sits in the vehicle, ready for whatever. Iron sights do not decay or go dead by sitting and waiting.
I really do intend for this to be a 0-50 gun. if i needed to shoot to 100 i probably could. but its purpose is self defense from large 2 or 4 legged critters. I have no delusions of a 200 yard deer shot with it.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
If you truly intend to use it as a "pistol," then iron sights should be sufficient. Additionally, there is nothing that can go wrong with them (short of smashing them off the gun). As TXplt said, it depends on what you are going to use it for.

I look at a "truck gun" as a weapon of opportunity, or desperation, depending on the circumstances. I consider it part of the "Emergency Gear" in the vehicle. 150 years ago, men rode open country on horseback, so needed to have a hand gun and a rifle at the ready. These days, few folks venture very far into "wild country" and when they do, it is usually for the purpose of adventure, and they take the appropriate firearms with them for that intended purpose. The rest of the time, the "truck gun" just sits in the vehicle, ready for whatever. Iron sights do not decay or go dead by sitting and waiting.
I really do intend for this to be a 0-50 gun. if i needed to shoot to 100 i probably could. but its purpose is self defense from large 2 or 4 legged critters. I have no delusions of a 200 yard deer shot with it. (which some might argue is possible)

I had biult a 10.5" 5.56 pistol for this purpose, but found it not quite meeting that goal very well. its still fairly large and heavy, and the 5.56 does in fact loose alot of OOMPH at that velocity. i think this will be much better suited to this use. I wont just leave it im my truck 24/7. only taking it when warranted. for times when an actually handgun isnt quite adequate, but i dont need a full sized rifle(carbine). is amazing how full my vehicle gets when fully loaded for an overland trip. and having this small package will make stowage and access easier/ better.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Depends on your vision.

Irons are a little slower but accurate if you practice shooting them (I was surprised at what I was able to do with the standard M1 irons at the 3-800 yard range several weeks back). A RDS is better for speed and at lower light IMHO. Some type of variable optic is also a thought.

I have a glow post on one of my MP-15 sports. It's OK but you can only adjust the height based on a full turn (i.e. you lose the part where the tritium faces away which may or may not be important depending on how the thing zeroes). And for not that much more $ you can get something like a holosun or Sig Romeo RDS. The very basic (cheap) sight marks have done better than I thought they would on a few uppers as well.

I don't know if I'd suggest pulling stuff off a zeroed upper at this point because there is significant time and energy in re-zeroing whatever (as well as ammo); if you think you might use the upper later with the optic I'd probably just leave it on and try a set of irons and see how you like them. If you make them like an MBUS (Tacticon has some rugged and decent sights that are cheaper than the Magpuls) you can always add an optic later and still have the zeroed backup irons.
My vision is as small and light as possible.

Irons i think are the way to go. Im probably better with them than i am rds's. i only recently got my first and only RDS and i cant say its my favorite sighting option. i'd much rather have a 1x prism, but not looking to buy that right now. LPVO's are great, but large and heavy.
 

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My vision is as small and light as possible.

Irons i think are the way to go. Im probably better with them than i am rds's. i only recently got my first and only RDS and i cant say its my favorite sighting option. i'd much rather have a 1x prism, but not looking to buy that right now. LPVO's are great, but large and heavy.
Ha I get it !

Think that’ll work fine.

MY vision isn’t as good as it once was — that’s why I use RDS and big dots more than I used to. On peeps with larger distances between them it’s less of an issue but focusing on that front post with shorter sight distances is harder so I’m using more optics, RDS, and big dot sights these days.
 
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Ha I get it !

Think that’ll work fine.

MY vision isn’t as good as it once was — that’s why I use RDS and big dots more than I used to. On peeps with larger distances between them it’s less of an issue but focusing on that front post with shorter sight distances is harder so I’m using more optics, RDS, and big dot sights these days.

Ha jokes on me! I was taking the "what direction do you want to go with this build interpretation!"

On the "eye sight" version of "vision" my vision isnt as good as it used to be either, Particularly regarding astigmatism, so, dots are more like starbursts than dots unless I have my glasses on. chances are if i need this gun for defense outdoors I dont have my glasses on. so, thats one reason im not crazy about red dots. plus, it adds weight and just something to go wrong.
 

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Discussion Starter #16 (Edited)
Ha I get it !

Think that’ll work fine.

MY vision isn’t as good as it once was — that’s why I use RDS and big dots more than I used to. On peeps with larger distances between them it’s less of an issue but focusing on that front post with shorter sight distances is harder so I’m using more optics, RDS, and big dot sights these days.
Thats a great point I hadnt considered. Ill have to try them out and see if the sight radius is indeed too short or sufficient. I use modified front sight posts that are a slim tapered post with a slightly larger ball on the top of the post. I really like this style sight as it is still easy to pick up, but much more precise and a better sight picture than the stndrd post.

Too check them out search Google for:

KNS Post Sight Assortment For: M-16, AR-15, AR-10, SR-25
 

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Discussion Starter #17 (Edited)
Yesterday I emailed the barrel mfg, Bear Creek arsenal inquiring about the gas port size. they replied back today with the Specific port size of this particular barrel, .110. which is more in line with what i would expect than .125 which many reports say would require an adjustable gas block. they said they have tested it with sub and super sonic ammo and it functions both and isnt over gassed, they do not state that it needs an adj gas block.

Most of my research into gas ports have been seeing the sizes around .100 or .09XX, so i was worried that this barrel has too large of a port. however, most of the barrels that have the smaller port sizes are either longer barrels, like 8.5-10.5".

what i think i now realize is that the 7.5" barrel, with pistol length gas system, has really very little dwell time, from the time the bullet passes the gas port to the time it exits the barrel, so it would make sense that there needs to be a larger gas port to allow enough gas into the system to cycle the action, before the bullet leaves the barrel. more of a large short blast of gas(pressure) instead of a longer barrel/ gas system which would be a smaller amnt of gas entering the system over a longer period of time.

think 5.56 carbine length vs mid length.

Am i thinking about this correctly?

i may need to get an h2 or h3 even buffer to slow down the bolt if it feels like its getting beat up too much from cycling.
 

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I really do intend for this to be a 0-50 gun. if i needed to shoot to 100 i probably could. but its purpose is self defense from large 2 or 4 legged critters. I have no delusions of a 200 yard deer shot with it. (which some might argue is possible)

I had biult a 10.5" 5.56 pistol for this purpose, but found it not quite meeting that goal very well. its still fairly large and heavy, and the 5.56 does in fact loose alot of OOMPH at that velocity.
Im not sure what ammo you are using but
You can extend the effective range of your ammo out of a short barreled 5.56 by using better ammo.

Most people don't carry ball ammo in their CCW handgun, they use dedicated self defense rounds. The same principle should hold true to their defensive truck gun, especially if its going to be used for a possible defensive situation against 2 or four legged critters. Using expanding soft points or bonded copper ammo works a lot better out of short barrels than just plain ol crappy M193 or M855.




Ha jokes on me! I was taking the "what direction do you want to go with this build interpretation!"

On the "eye sight" version of "vision" my vision isnt as good as it used to be either, Particularly regarding astigmatism, so, dots are more like starbursts than dots unless I have my glasses on. chances are if i need this gun for defense outdoors I dont have my glasses on. so, thats one reason im not crazy about red dots. plus, it adds weight and just something to go wrong.
Ive mentioned this before but try looking into a 1x or a 1.5X Prism scope.

No red dot, if you have an astigmatism but an etched reticle like a magnifed scope and they have an adjustable diopter like on binoculars so you can fine focus it just for you.

They also generally have large eye boxes too.

Like this one just for example.

https://www.primaryarms.com/pa-1x-compact-prism-scope-with-acss-cyclops-reticle-black
 

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Yesterday I emailed the barrel mfg, Bear Creek arsenal inquiring about the gas port size. they replied back today with the Specific port size of this particular barrel, .110. which is more in line with what i would expect than .125 which many reports say would require an adjustable gas block. they said they have tested it with sub and super sonic ammo and it functions both and isnt over gassed, they do not state that it needs an adj gas block.

Most of my research into gas ports have been seeing the sizes around .100 or .09XX, so i was worried that this barrel has too large of a port. however, most of the barrels that have the smaller port sizes are either longer barrels, like 8.5-10.5".

what i think i now realize is that the 7.5" barrel, with pistol length gas system, has really very little dwell time, from the time the bullet passes the gas port to the time it exits the barrel, so it would make sense that there needs to be a larger gas port to allow enough gas into the system to cycle the action, before the bullet leaves the barrel. more of a large short blast of gas(pressure) instead of a longer barrel/ gas system which would be a smaller amnt of gas entering the system over a longer period of time.

think 5.56 carbine length vs mid length.

Am i thinking about this correctly?

i may need to get an h2 or h3 even buffer to slow down the bolt if it feels like its getting beat up too much from cycling.
Yes. If it's been tested with all rounds from subsonic through supers you should be fine--I think your thought process is fine but if the manufacturer has tested it with ammo similar to what you're gonna use you should be fine (and wouldn't read anything into the situation until you've ops tested the ammo you're gonna use). I use a Spike's Tactical T2 buffer in most of my stuff, but it runs the gamut from subsonic unsuppressed to supersonic suppressed -- which is alot to ask -- but my .300s have done OK. The T2 is an intermediate compromise which doesn't seem to affect reliability when the gun is run open with subs.

My .223 10.5/11.5" uppers are WAY overgassed when running with a T2, standard weight spring, suppressed, and M193. Hasn't been a problem in function though. The 'right' answer would be to either have an adjustable gas block (you can get these where they fit on the gas key of the BCG as well) but I shoot a fairly wide spectrum of ammo and am willing to accept the additional blowback for the reliability in shooting weaker rounds unsuppressed and still having the gun function (without having to screw with it which takes ammo and that ammo might someday be in short supply). I want it to be able to run from shooting unsuppressed PMC .223 rounds through suppressed M193's. Which means unless I tweek the gas block (or have a switchable one on the BCG) it's GONNA be slightly under gassed to way overgassed and that's how it is.

If you're not suppressing I'd postulate you'll be fine.
 
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Discussion Starter #20 (Edited)
Im not sure what ammo you are using but
You can extend the effective range of your ammo out of a short barreled 5.56 by using better ammo.

Most people don't carry ball ammo in their CCW handgun, they use dedicated self defense rounds. The same principle should hold true to their defensive truck gun, especially if its going to be used for a possible defensive situation against 2 or four legged critters. Using expanding soft points or bonded copper ammo works a lot better out of short barrels than just plain ol crappy M193 or M855.






Ive mentioned this before but try looking into a 1x or a 1.5X Prism scope.

No red dot, if you have an astigmatism but an etched reticle like a magnifed scope and they have an adjustable diopter like on binoculars so you can fine focus it just for you.

They also generally have large eye boxes too.

Like this one just for example.

https://www.primaryarms.com/pa-1x-compact-prism-scope-with-acss-cyclops-reticle-black

The only ammo I'll have at first is 125 gr HPBT PPU. good stuff, maybe not the best, but better than fmj.

I dont have a suppressor, so I'm sticking with supersonic ammo.

while I totally get the practical applications of suppressors, I just haven't felt the need to get one, Plus i dont like how they take a short gun and make it long. kinda defeats the purpose of a pistol or sbr IMO. I might like a short one like 4" or so, but then they aren't as effective.

I would love one of the primary arms 1x prisms, but they are bit large and heavy. maybe in the future ill pick on up. the more i think about it Im actually looking forward to just a straight irons gun, I may choose to upgrade to some top tier fixed irons, like DD or Troy.
 
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