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Discussion in 'The Powder Keg' started by PaleHawkDown, Feb 12, 2018.
ROFLMAO!!!!!!! So that is sooooo true!!!
So funny, but so true. I have two kids in college, both taking criminal justice degrees and my oldest daughter had to take "the history of Rock and Roll" last semester. All they did was sit in class and listen to the "professor" play his guitar and listen to music.
I went to and gradgeated from, the University of Hard Knocks!
That video is pretty close to right on..one of the reasons I decided to go the Community College route vs. to a university.
Heck, even if I had gone to Uni I still would have gotten my prereqs out of the way at the junior college level (cheaper and smaller class sizes).
i can attest that there is quite a bit of truth to that video -- especially for the kids with the pie in the sky dreams who take a degree path that leads to a dead end career --oh the list is long! The kids however who choose their degree wisely and diversify their studies (as well as limit the partying) will do okay provided they have any semblance of work effort.
Problem is the college environment is one that actively encourages partyinging/wild behavior, right up into the class room via professors.
At UNT there were professors who would encourage kids to 'explore themselves' through any route deemed interesting. You can figure the rest out for yourself.
The dorms would hand out free condoms (even the Monster Energy Drink company would donate bunches with their own label on them) and host resident meetings with themes such as S and M and other sexually-themed costume-meetings...so yeah, people would dress up (or down, depending on your viewpoint) for these things.
I wasn't a student there, but a satellite college which gave me access to their facilities and most of my friends were on campus. Before my brains set it I did a lot of stupid stuff there myself as well. Not my brighter decision-making days.
And the degree I came away with is practically pointless. Took 6 years to get a 2 year associates degree for arts (due to working full time, and taking a year off to financially regroup). I was lucky as I qualified for pell grant most of the time I was enrolled, having only a $5,000 student loan when I was done. But even that has taken almost 10 years to get half paid off due to handling other debt problems first.
If I had to do it all over again...I wouldn't. I'd have just focused on the company I was with and take the management position I was offered in 2008. I'd be making about the same I'm making now, only much sooner as I detoured through the military for a bit.
Now my sister is looking to go to college and I'm trying to encourage a trade school.
A degree that gives you marketable skills is a good investment. There are too many obscure majors that only lead to more education courses and debt !!!!
Most of my friends graduated beginning in 2006 to 2010 roughly.
Out of around 15 people, only 2 or 3 ended up in fields roughly where they were aiming.
There are schools well known for partying, and schools known for serious study. That said, I'm sure every institution has its own sub culture of party people...it's whether or not we choose to join them. I never joined a sorority and I'm glad I didn't because I may have been led astray far beyond my natural tendency for mischief. Having taught at University on and off during the past 15 years, I have seen a change for the worse in faculty, in some cases similar to what you described. If students, parents and other faculty don't address improper behavior of staff, money and time is being wasted. I've already been the "red headed stepchild" (no pun intended) among faculty who didnt agree with my beliefs and views -- including the regimented student professor relationships I fostered. I guess I'm turning into a curmudgeonette.
If I had to do it all again, I would. I learned quite a bit about people, judging character and how a strong work ethic (as opposed to slacking) can pay off.
As far as trades go, I am a big advocate for acquiring a trade. While I feel formal education has its place, the common sense usually resides in the people with trades.
My second degree was a trade school. Much better experience, much better students over all, and much more structure/less partying in general.
We'd still go out to bars and have hangout times, but nothing near as wild as back in the other college.
I've been to community college, a university, and trade school currently. Community college was great. I had friends I studied with, and we'd also go out for food together. University sucked. Trade school was awesome last year when we were actually working with our hands. This year, we've been in the classroom watching videos.
Send ya off to college try to gain a little knowledge ...... but all ya wanna do is learn how to score
If one has the understanding he/she is actually paying for the classes it might change how you view things.
Worked pretty hard in school with a double major in engineering. Then again figuring out how to do your partying and getting hooked up around the work was a valuable lesson too. But I found it more fun to fly airplanes and I was never good at matching ties and clothes anyway.
Yep. I started college after discharge from the military. Using the GI bill and my employer ‘s matching payments, I’ve taken about 4 years of college courses that I wanted. Geology, mathematics, theology, meteorology, Native American studies, electronics and computer technology. Things I wanted to learn about and not a set course for a degree. I still had to pony up for books and some credits after the GI bill ran out but have no debt.
I have yet to take Freshmsn English II so no degree. I have enough paper on my wall so don’t care.
Oh God... Criminal Justice.
Tell them to change their major to something more useful other than that before they are too far into it and it's too late. (that is the opinion of pretty much every cop I know who has a CJ degree including myself).
That major is only good for two things... teaching it, and possibly promoting (at the higher levels) later on if they go into LE. But you don't figure that out until you are in like year 3 out of a 4 year degree and it's too late. And all it translates too is a resume builder and maybe extra points on a promotion test.
If anything take it as a minor.
The problem is that depending on where you go, colleges do one of several things with their CJ program...
A. Make it a half azzed program UNDER their political science program
B. Make it a half azzed program UNDER their psychology program
C Make it a half azzed program UNDER their sociology program
D. Make it it's own independent program with emphasis on related history, and "specialty" classes such as or forensics or administration related things... and sort of combines A/B/C/D but more geared as it's own well rounded program.
E. Make it it's own program that is more functional with topics like "report writing" and state law etc.
Options A/B/C and D, I maintain you should just take CJ as a minor, Option E. is completely useless as a major because that is the type of stuff you will get in the police academy if you go the "LE/Cop" route. so you will get all that for free if you get sent to an academy and most police academies now count as college credits (just like USMC boot camp does because they cram so much history down your throats while there)
D. Makes the most sense if you want to actually get a degree in CJ as an academic subject (or want to eventually promote into a command staff position).... or just take it as a minor.
I took option D and while it had a lot of interesting study topics. I had specialties that counted for terrorism and forensic science (which have both helped in me in my current job positions). But I would still recommend to do it as a minor or pick something else entirely.
A good many people in the FBI academy (and other fed jobs like HSI) already have master's degree's in pretty much anything else other than criminal justice. such as languages, math, sciences, economics, business etc.
And those types of degrees will also help you if you ever get into investigations on the local/state side. Just imagine being a new detective and your first case is a white collar fraud/embezzlement case that has been going on for the past 3 years... and now you get to pour over and translate the past several years of tax and accounting records. Yea have fun with that!
Interestingly enough a lot of the people I work with who have a college degree but not in CJ usually have them in business/economics or education.
I know a lot of people who went from teaching to being a cop or the other way around.
Also interesting trends in LE is that most cops who have a girl friend or who get married, their spouse is either one one of three professions... LE (hopefully at another agency because the divorce rate in LE is already ridiculously high due to stress and two at the same place is like a 90% rate) or the medical profession (nurses/doctors etc) or the education field (teachers).
Probably at least 85-90% of the people I know how are married or dating fall into that as well.
I had to take a movie history class... as an "elective" for more BS credits I didn't need but needed the credits to graduate...
All we did was watch movies and then write a BS essay on some theme in it. It was a great monetary use of my limited college money that I was already working two jobs for at the time.
Really though the point of a lot of these "extra classes" not so much the movie watching and listening to people play the guitar but the academic ones is to teach you organizational, time management, and writing skills that will help you in the future. I took a couple classes in ancient Chinese history not because it was anything useful to my eventual profession but because I found it interesting. I really think some of the college classes that they "make you take" just for the sake of making you buy more credits is totally stupid.
For my 4 year degree I had to take X amount of credit hours. The core classes of my major, my minor and my "mandatory electives" (like mandatory phys ed credits) amounted to about 3/4 of the total credits I needed to graduate with my degree...
btw they had "walking" as a phys ed class in college... you would show up at 0845 and walk around the track for an hour.... and that counted as a phys ed class.... and 3 credit hours at a cost of whatever the going rate per credit hour the college charged you. What BS.
Anyways my major also required me to do an internship to graduate. I got a summer job doing things for a local police force for a few months. The job was in a different state from my college. I worked enough time there throughout the summer to qualify for up to 12 college credits...
Had to write a paper on what I did all summer and how it was good experience for me bla bla bla.
I submitted the credit application and the college charged me some huge amount of money for the 12 credit hours. Along with "associated fees" that went along with each credit hour for IT fee's, dining facility fee's, campus maintenance fees, the health facility (gym) fee etc...
Keep in mind I was working my internship in a completely different state several hundred miles away where I was getting none of the benefits of the college gym or internet system.
I couldn't afford that I bumped it back down to 2-3 credits even though I had done the same amount of work for 12 credit hours for the internship.
So basically the college was just charging me extra for a number on a piece of paper. And btw they wouldn't waive all the fees even though I wasn't there.
the Pennsylvania State System of Higher Education is a bunch of cheap asses.
Btw this was also the same system that would routinely bus in inner city kids from Philadelphia every first semester with their crap grades on severely discounted rates and scholarships to try to up their diversity demographic stats... and then by the second semester every year probably half to a 3/4 of those kids had already dropped or failed out.
Meanwhile other kids who actually had worked for good grades in high school and wanted to go go college didn't get the same treatment. Affirmative Action is just reverse racism and reverse racism is still racism...
It'll be trade schools for my last two. Paying for 4 years (or more) of school is foolish any more.
.......But was he any good?
I did the same thing, but nearly half my prereqs didn't transfer. Alabama has the STARS program which means that ever junior college course is guaranteed to transfer to any state-accredited school.
I worked my butt off so that in theory I could graduate in three years.
I got to the university and found out 22 credit hours were the maximum transferable - out of close to 70. Neither my advisor at the junior college, nor the recruiter I had been talking to at UAB seemed to be aware of this.
I ended up having to do several courses a second time and having to take a giant pile of fluff courses to fill out the credit hours requirement. When it was all over I was two classes away from three different minors, and three classes and a term paper away from a second major.
If I had stayed for one more semester I could have been an even more over-educated idiot.
I worked in my chosen, and beloved, field for several years and then the industry collapsed around me. Basically all of it was for nothing but some fun stories, a few heartbreaks, and a chance to learn more about some of my favorite subjects.
Here's the best part. There are two fields that I am well-suited for, that are well-paying, and that I can already basically do, but I could never have passed the math prerequisites.
Journalism was my first choice, but my second and third choices were architecture and veterinary medicine. If it hadn't been for the trig, calculus and physics prereqs I probably would have gone into one of those fields.
My mother was a hobby architect who has designed several buildings professionally, after a "real" architect signed off on the drawings for legal reasons. My dad was an estimator for an industrial construction company.
By the time I was 13 I could not only design a building and determine load-bearing necessities, but I could figure out the materials costs. I used to do that for fun, by hand, and without the use of computers.
I grew up on a farm and pretty much lacked squeamishness. I got along well with animals and knew most of the old ways of doing things. I also hated doctors, loved to read medical texts, and learned to treat most of my injuries myself.
When I had my pet shop I did everything but spaying and neutering myself.
I know a professional architect right now who was a math wizard, and passed those courses easily, but he couldn't design a structure that wasn't basically a box if his life depended on it, and he's never had to determine material costs. He has an engineer who does that.
I'd be willing to bet that ridiculous prereqs push more good people out of fields than they ever place in them.