Elli Pietta 44 cal black powder

Discussion in 'The Powder Keg' started by Jumpinhigh, Mar 26, 2009.

  1. Jumpinhigh

    Jumpinhigh G&G Newbie

    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2009
    Messages:
    3
    Likes Received:
    0
    :feedback: I inherited a Elli pietta 44 cal. Black powder handgun.



    Any information about this gun would be greatly appreciated.
    (value, year made, model)
     
    #1
  2. rebel727

    rebel727 G&G Enthusiast

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2005
    Messages:
    3,711
    Likes Received:
    14
    #2
    Big Dog likes this.
  3. madcratebuilder

    madcratebuilder G&G Newbie

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2007
    Messages:
    3,088
    Likes Received:
    3
    Please tell me it's a Paterson with a loading lever and you well sell it me for $250.
     
    #3
  4. tfd309

    tfd309 G&G Newbie

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2008
    Messages:
    545
    Likes Received:
    0
    Please tell me its a

    ---------------

    Please tell me its a revolver , not a handgun , LOL !!!!
    And when you do , tell me it is a Patterson w/LLever and I will give you $251.00 and pay for shipping . Seeing how they didn't make a .44 caliber Madcratebuilder , I think were both screwed ?

    Boken out :smashfreakB:
     
    #4
  5. andrew cochran

    andrew cochran G&G Newbie

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2007
    Messages:
    2,844
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ok! Does the cylinder have a strap across the top? Or is it open?

    Is this strap and frame around the cylinder brass colored? Or just black?

    How long is the barrel?

    Are the sights a notch in the hammer, and a front post? Or a grove in the top strap?

    If you can tell us these things, we can help you alot more!

    Better yet pic the revolver on the cabelas page that looks most like your gun.
     
    #5
  6. Jumpinhigh

    Jumpinhigh G&G Newbie

    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2009
    Messages:
    3
    Likes Received:
    0
    I took the gun to my grandfather's to have him clean it and all to keep it in the excellent condition.

    I don't have a camera to take a pic.

    The top does not have a strap on it. it is open.

    The chamber has an etched in picture of boats I believe. The etching goes all the way around. It also had a patent on the chamber.

    There is brass on the frame and that is in the grip or whatever (sorry don't know gun terms the best)

    Not sure about the sights. Again no top strap over the chamber.

    Chamber is blued I believe this is what it is called, its black or whatever.

    It is a revolver and does have the lever thing.

    This is the one it looks the most like it but it doesn't have as much brass on it.

    1851 Confederate Navy, .44 Caliber Revolver

    the trigger guard is brass and it extends through the middle of the grip.

    Again this is the closet looking one on cabela's but it is still not it.
     
    #6
  7. Kodiak32

    Kodiak32 G&G Regular Forum Contributor

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2008
    Messages:
    667
    Likes Received:
    1
    Try looking at Dixie Gun Works at http://www.dixiegun.com/ . They carry a wider variety than Cabelas.

    Congrats on pistol.

    The lever thing is actually the loading lever, an open top leads towards a colt reproduction.

    The standard 1851 Navy only had brass around the trigger gaurd, the confederates made an 1851 Navy with a brass reciever, they used brass to save materials ( steel ) during the civil war.
     
    #7
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2009
  8. rebel727

    rebel727 G&G Enthusiast

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2005
    Messages:
    3,711
    Likes Received:
    14
    Only they didn't make them in .44. A .44 1851 Navy is a Pietta fantasy piece that never existed.
     
    #8
  9. madcratebuilder

    madcratebuilder G&G Newbie

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2007
    Messages:
    3,088
    Likes Received:
    3
    Does it look like this one?
    [​IMG]
    Notice the round barrel and smooth lines at the loading lever.

    Or does it look like this one.
    [​IMG]
    Without the brass frame.
    The Naval scene on the the cylinder 'should' make it a Navy model. There never was a 'real' Navy .44, that is something the Italian makers came up with.
    Another possible variation.
    [​IMG]
     
    #9
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2009
    TNPIRATE likes this.
  10. Kodiak32

    Kodiak32 G&G Regular Forum Contributor

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2008
    Messages:
    667
    Likes Received:
    1
    Guys, I was just trying too let the original poster know that not all 1851 Navies are brass. And yes, while not historically correct Pietta makes .44 caliber in both Brass and Steel frames.

    Here's a link to a .44 1851 Navy steel frame revolver listed at Midway:

    http://www.midwayusa.com/browse/Bro...Id=10631&tabId=5&refineSearchKeyword=revolver

    Another Steel frame 1851 Navy .44 at River Juntion:
    http://www.riverjunction.com/catalog/guns/BlackPowder.html

    Elli Pietta US website:
    http://www.pietta.us/products/Muzzleloadinguns/Navy/index.html

    Good pictures madcrate and thanks for the additional infomation Rebel. I guess we wait and see if the original poster has made a match. The Pietta website is probably the best bet, but if the poster can somehow get pictures posted the model of the revolver would be identified fairly quick.
     
    #10
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2009
  11. madcratebuilder

    madcratebuilder G&G Newbie

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2007
    Messages:
    3,088
    Likes Received:
    3
    That steel frame 51 navy in .44 looks nice.

    No, I well not buy it.

    I well not buy it.

    Well not buy it.

    Not buy it.

    Ah Hell!
     
    #11
    the shootist 44 likes this.
  12. the shootist 44

    the shootist 44 G&G Newbie

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2015
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    0
     
    #12
  13. the shootist 44

    the shootist 44 G&G Newbie

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2015
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    0
    [​IMG] I have this gun in better shape taking offers
     
    #13
  14. Rex in OTZ

    Rex in OTZ G&G Evangelist

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2008
    Messages:
    5,250
    Likes Received:
    324
    My first cap n ball was a .44cal brass frame (Reb .44) id bought at the old Cabelas store for $25 as a u-fix-it with a broken hammer spring. I still have it some place.
    With brass you have to stick with the published loads for it (id suggest backing off 2-3gr recommended power charge), as brass it should have a lighter load than a steel frame, with colt replica open tops the problem is the cylinder is deep enough that you can really step on a load, its very possible to double charge one of these revolvers, they dont blow up, the greater pressure shears the brass threads the cylinder base pin is screwed into, after the threads are gone there is not much you can do with a shot loose brass frame cap n ball revolver (possible helicoil repair)
    the same goes for the steel frame revolvers open top revolvers too (i shot loose a EMF1860 .44), you want a hotter handgun use a .38 special.
     
    #14
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2015
    the shootist 44 likes this.
  15. PaleHawkDown

    PaleHawkDown G&G Evangelist

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2010
    Messages:
    7,386
    Likes Received:
    3,205
    First some background: We are a Pietta distributor and we are also shooters, so this is less a personal opinion, and more a professional opinion.

    I'm guessing this revolver is a few years old, so this is what I'm basing this on. I'm also taking a wild guess that this revolver probably came from a box store such as Bass Pro or Cabela's which has some affect on value for the hardcore shooters and collectors.

    If it is a brass frame in great shape and unfired produced either before the 1980s or after 2000 it is worth $150 or less. If the condition is less than excellent you are looking at a double digit figure. If it is unfired with the box you can get around $150 tops, unless you find the "right" buyer.

    If it was produced in the '80s or '90's, begin with the double digit figure and go down from there, even with the box. That period is the dark ages for Pietta production, and an awful lot of them are pretty awful - though a rare few are OK.

    If it is a steel frame (and with Pietta, nothing 'Confederate' is steel frame) you can start at around $200 NIB as long as it wasn't produced in the dark ages. They go down from there with Very Good condition being between $150 and $100 depending on your salesmanship and the local market. Anything below "Good" condition and the value is in the parts or to someone wanting a project.

    If you could get good pictures and describe any marks on it that would help a lot. Guns brought in by Dixie, Traditions, EMF, Navy Arms and a few others usually command a few bucks more than the big boxes, but with non-special edition brass framed ones, not so much.
     
    #15
  16. Big Dog

    Big Dog Retired IT Dinosaur Wrangler Forum Contributor

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2002
    Messages:
    24,461
    Likes Received:
    5,590
    I have five Colt 1851 Navies and one Colt 1860 Army, all by F.LLI Pietta. I just love the 1851 design. Four are .44 caliber (inaccurate, as the Navy was never actually made in that caliber), two older revolvers are brass framed, the newer two are steel framed. The oldest 1851, I got it in 1976 from a K-Mart, has been overloaded in my "young & stupid days" so it is loose and internal parts broke. It's manufacture is very different from today's Pietta guns so parts do not interchange. It is a wall hanger.
    My fifth Navy - the shorter Sheriff Model - is in proper .36 Caliber and has a nickeled and engraved brass frame, with gold tone cylinder, trigger and hammer - very pretty. Pietta's published powder loads are so anemic as to ensure misfiring and poor performance. I researched good loads on a couple black powder forums, and now use a load that is safe but with proper level of 'oomph'!
     
    #16
    the shootist 44 likes this.
  17. the shootist 44

    the shootist 44 G&G Newbie

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2015
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    0
     
    #17
  18. the shootist 44

    the shootist 44 G&G Newbie

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2015
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    0
  19. the shootist 44

    the shootist 44 G&G Newbie

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2015
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    0
    Pietta 1860 Army Steel Frame Black Powder Revolver 44 Caliber 8" Bl... Fill your Hands you son of a bitch sell for 140 and shipping 20
     
    #19
  20. the shootist 44

    the shootist 44 G&G Newbie

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2015
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    0
Verification:
Draft saved Draft deleted