Inside the Chilling World of Civilian Snipers

Discussion in 'The Powder Keg' started by Doglips, Oct 10, 2002.

  1. Doglips

    Doglips Guest


    Don’t Try to Run’
    Inside the Chilling World of Civilian Snipers

    By Bob Woodruff

    Oct. 10 — Few Americans are aware of a mysterious world that teaches civilians how to master the deadly sniper art — and it's only mouse clicks away.

    Through videos and Web sites, civilian snipers have attracted a cult following.
    "'One shot, one kill' is the slogan of the sniper," said Tom Diaz of the Violence Policy Center.

    A series of sniper shootings — six of them fatal — in the Washington, D.C, region has area residents living in fear — which is exactly the way the sniper wants it.

    "There is a subculture, there is a civilian subculture in this country dedicated to the fulfillment of that proposition," said Diaz.

    Sniper Glorification

    Through the Violence Policy Center, a national nonprofit organization working to fight gun violence, Diaz has been monitoring the sniper culture for years. He has been collecting evidence of what he calls the glorification of the sniper.

    This evidence includes training videos that teach people how to build high-powered rifles and use them with devastating effect.

    In addition, Diaz has collected dozens of books with menacing titles and pictures. There are also Web sites, he says, that recount the heroic work of military snipers and also advertise for sniper training.

    Historically, members of the military and police forces have taken sniper-training courses, but it wasn't a civilian pastime. In the last 10 years, however, special sniper courses have been open to the public — to anyone who can afford to sign up.

    'Killing Human Beings'

    Peter Tarley, an expert sniper who has been teaching courses for police departments and the military for years, says he understands what attracts some civilians to the sniper world, although he refuses to teach them.

    "It maybe shocking to the average American to know that there are training schools that civilians can go to," Tarley said. "There are Web sites, all of which teach this doctrine: 'one shot, one kill.' … And we're not talking about shooting woodchucks, we're talking about killing human beings."

    Web sites with names like "Sniper's Paradise" and "Sniper Country" provide a road map on how to master this deadly art, Tarley said.

    Although they are careful to warn readers not to act criminally, many are riddled with disturbing quotes.

    "The careful application of terror is another form of communication," says one sniper on a Web site's chat board.

    Another sniper wrote: "The only thing I feel when I kill is the recoil from my rifle."

    A particularly chilling quote reads: "Don't try to run. You'll only die tired."

    Obsessed by the Sport's Demands

    Hollywood movies about snipers have gained nearly cult status in the sniper culture.

    Enemy at the Gates, a movie about snipers in World War II, and Sniper, starring Tom Berenger, are discussed frequently on sniper Web sites' chat boards.

    Tarley says shooters who become obsessed with sniping are attracted to the sport's demands.

    "They're trying to be as precise as possible, the breathing control required — the ability to time your shot with your heartbeat," Tarley said.

    Gun-control advocates say the sniper culture is growing fast and needs to be controlled, because even with their conspicuous weapons, snipers can get away.

    But despite the disturbing messages posted by snipers on their favorite Web sites, Tarley insists the sniper culture is not a dangerous one. He says snipers rarely murder.
  2. oneastrix

    oneastrix G&G Newbie

    Who said the sniper in Maryland is a civillian?

  3. Indy

    Indy G&G Newbie

    Informing by the un-informed is a menace to our society. It becomes obvious the media can control the public by expelling their propaganda. The word "Assault" rifle never entered the vocabulary until the media started spreading the word. I still laugh every time I think of the Glock feature of a "fingerprint resistant finish." The PRK senators, representatives,and Schumer and the Pig jumped on how we could allow a gun company to have a finish that law enforcement could not extract fingerprints. When the finish was for oxidation resistance. Of course, the "automatic" conspiracy is the most abused. Now, we have a new word "sniper".
    I watched the media distort and twist what the President was saying about Iraq. Finally, "tiny" Tom went off like a rocket and bashed the President for politicizing the issue. Everything the people in Washington DC do is politicized. The scary part is most Americans are not interested and do not keep up with the issues. Therefore, the media has a stranglehold over them and they react like cattle. If you pole the country today, the President is the reason the economy is in trouble, when in reality a President has no effect on it.
    Thanks for listening I feel better.
  4. Shaun

    Shaun G&G Evangelist

    We don't know if he is a Civ or Mil. all we know is that so far this fool is hitting every target he encounters. Most likely I agree that the shots taken in urban areas are within a 100 or so yards of the victim -- he is smart since only one casing was ever found but that could be a throw away from a range where it was picked up. If it is an amatuer which it could be we are talking about shots that can be achieved by anyone within hours of sitting down at the range and some practice. I still think we are looking at a bolt gun and not a 223. My bet is a 22-250
  5. One thing is for certain. This sniper has been well trained and poorly; by whatever means. (contradictory for a reason)

    His stupid mistakes so far, other than useless and senseless shooting and killing, is his leaving behind vital clues....the Tarot card and it's message and the spent cartridges.

    Most civilian snipers don't want to be detected. The ones who do do so because they feed on the publicity and the arrogance they won't we caught. But, leaving behind the cartridges can be military but I don't see a true civilian doing it.

    I see this guy, or gal, thinking that he/she can't be caught. I'm gonna guess a military trained person with a axe to grind. Perhaps from this military past. He/she might even well be foreign.

    I also suspect he/she will cease and suddenly go into hiding.....perhaps eluding capture or detection for some time. I don't think it's just one shooter, either.
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2002
  6. Just like the old saying goes, they would never outlaw your hunting rifle, they'll call it a sniper rifle first.

    NRAJOE YOU TALKIN' TO ME!? Forum Contributor

    Yep, thats how they'll do it, just change the name!:mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:
  8. here's a good picture of what we mean!

    Attached Files:

  9. Mick

    Mick G&G Addict

    Is that a Lee enfeild?
  10. Benny

    Benny Guest

    It most certainly is.

  11. Mick

    Mick G&G Addict

    Aha! no flies on me!
  12. Doglips

    Doglips Guest

    The only hope aginst some seroius NEW gun laws will be if this clown turns out to be a Muslim....useing one of the firearms the FBI<IRS< INS and others reported "lost" and a search of his appartment turns up a stack of Rosie O and Marth Sterut magazines....course then the whole thing will me this is an act of terrorsim...and yet it is not called one....guess its better for the "economy" if its just some gun nut gone psyco and not called a terrorist act...
    in the end it may be intersting to find out about this dirt ball...if we get any true reports....Im still hung up on the 100 yards stuff not realy long range to me....the lack of reported hearing of the shots....sub sonic ammo?
    Im just glad the van is sick and Ive been at work 7 days a week for the last 2 weeks...cause I kinda fit the discription....white male..ex milatary..former sniper and own a dodge caravan...add gun nut and that Ive read the turner diaries and Im a perfect match...just glad Im working on federal property with a few other people.
  13. PAPA G

    PAPA G G&G Evangelist Forum Contributor


    like your scenarios, however it won't change the anti's agenda, and none will apologize for it either!!!! we as a whole have to join the NRA, GOA, JFPF, and get the fence sitters to get pro-active. it sickens me when i think of all the gunowners who aren't or wishy-washey about gun ownership.:mad: :mad: :mad:
  14. Howdy.

    On a fishing web site ( ) there was some banter about the sniper in the east.

    One fellow posted this-
    "I'm a hunter but I think the gun control people have a point about certain guns. I have a nut living not far from here that has assault rifles and in my opinon unstable. I think its just a matter of time for him to do something tragic.I'm not sure why people need "sniper guns". Yes I know you could do plently of damage with my hunting rifle set up with off the shelf scopes but the fire ease and power and compactness of some of the guns out there serve to have more abuse in this way. As a sportsman I have no use for them and know about "the camel nose under the tent" arguement that when they ban one class they are going after mine but I don't buy it. Too many people are dieing all over the country and my fear is that the formily ambivilant public may over react."

    Can you say, DENIAL! Here was ol Sniper[MI]'s response to him-
    "You my friend are in denial.

    History, England and Austrailia have proven you wrong. Canada is about to learn the same thing. First it is one class of weapon that is banned. Then a caliber or two. Then all handguns. Then all guns that hold more than one shot. Total gun confiscation is the goal of the anti gun crowd. They say so themselves. Don't fool yourself.

    As to the term "Assault Rifle", what do you suppose that means? To the lawmaker types and activists that want guns banned, that is any rifle or shotgun that can hold more than a specified number of bullets in the gun or a clip and can be fired as fast as you pull the trigger. That is every semi auto everything, no matter what it is.

    The lowly pump action rifles and shotguns get lumped into that group as they hold bullets in a magazine or chamber in the gun.

    "Sniper Rifle" Just what would that be? The way they are being described by the media and anti gun crowd right now, would mean any rifle that has a scope and is capable of hitting it's mark at 100 yards or more. If you own a deer rifle, you my friend have a "Sniper Rifle" This current outrage in the eastern US is going to be a huge excuse to BAN ALL GUNS! You are lying toyourself and have your head up your a.... er backend if you do not think so.

    "Assault Rifle" and "Sniper Rifle" are buzzwords used by the media and the anti gun crowd to stir up hype and fear to allow TOTAL GUN CONFISCATION!

    That is the goal behind balistics fingerprinting and registration. When the poitical climate gets to the point the antis want, they WILL know who has guns and who does not. If you don't turn in your guns, you become a criminal. And, they know where you live. I am not making this up, ask ANYONE in Britan or Australia.

    An apethetic gun owner is as bad as 10 anti gun types. If you think they won't come after you, you are sorely mistaken.

    There was even a push by a political group in Germany, I think, to make the laws for total gun confiscation, and to round up all the gun owners and their families and have them exterminated. This was supposed to be to exterminate the violence gene that made people want to own guns. Ya it was a fringe movement, BUT SO WAS THE NAZI PARTY!"

    I have seen the enemy gentlemen, and he is us!
  15. PAPA G

    PAPA G G&G Evangelist Forum Contributor

    we can be our on worst enemy. i have heard that rationalizing for years. those individuals are blind to the facts, and aslong as their pet intrest is left alone, don't care what happens to others.:mad:
  16. wes

    wes Guest

    Good reply Sniper. Some of the "collector" people think the same way. "They won't come after my M-1 rifle,it's a collector gun."
  17. Mandy

    Mandy FREE CITIZEN Forum Contributor

    :assult: :assult: :assult: :assult: :assult:

    I think this is the conspiracy of the antigun, a well planned plot to pass more laws.

    :assult: :assult: :assult: :assult: :assult:
  18. Logansdad

    Logansdad Guest

    I wouldn't be surprised if...

    were very anti 2nd amendment...I think they were supposed to be video game playing teens :mad: I kinda resent their being called snipers...that should be reserved for the professionals that train to use rifles at 500 plus meters...but if you're a bedwetting liberal what better word to use ? :assult: