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Should people carry a mouse gun?

  • Yes

    Votes: 21 70.0%
  • No

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • As a second gun

    Votes: 11 36.7%
  • If that is all they are willing to carry

    Votes: 9 30.0%
  • If they have recoil issues or other problems with shooting

    Votes: 7 23.3%
  • Never, never, never

    Votes: 0 0.0%
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Discussion Starter · #22 ·
I have given my two daughters mouse guns. The youngest daughter, I gave my most reliable handgun I’ve ever owned, believe it or not it was a Bersa Thunder + holding 15 rounds in a easy to conceal platform. My oldest daughter I gave my Ruger LC9 after her marriage took on a “physical” aspect.

I plan on replacing both, as at one time each was my primary carry gun and I would recommend either as they were utterly dependable.
The Bersa Thunder was my wife's daily carry until the arthritis in her hand/wrist got worse & it hurt to shoot it, even to rack the slide. She tried the P938 Sig, but recoil was too much & she settled on the P238. The Thunder Plus is one of the 3 that I alternate with my P938 & 1911.
I am not sure that I would call a gun with 15 rounds of 380 a mouse gun. I once worked on a drug task force with a local police officer that carried a Beretta Cheetah. One of the issues of working under cover is you are pretty stupid to carry the same gun as local police, because that made you look like a cop, at least until Glocks came along, then Glocks became the gun of choice for thugs and gangs and still is. I once said something to another officer in his department, something dumb, like I hope he is not my back up if things go south. The other narc who carried a nickel 1911 45 laughed a belly laugh. He said, have you seen him shoot? Well, no, he said not to worry, nobody is as accurate or fast as he is. So, felt pretty silly. I later carried a Walther PPK/s in harms way many times, just about your ability and confidence level.

The Ruger LC9 is also not a mouse gun, I assume you mean the one in 9mm although they made one in 380 also. The stiker model, the LC9s is an excellent carry gun. We compared the single stack 9s a few years ago, the Ruger LC9s had the best trigger of the bunch. I think they come from the factory at 4.5 pounds. Great little guns, I like it so well, I bought one for my wife.
 
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Discussion Starter · #24 ·
I have two KelTec P-32s, one is the early model and minimalist sights and the second is the latest type with "better" sights than the 1st gen. I am a fan of the .32 because it is thin and in the FMJ it will penetrate..That stated one problem with the KelTec is the magazine, it is designed for FMJ only, anyone who carries it with Silvertips risks developing a fight ending issue called rim-lock. Since the .32ACP is semi-rimmed there is a very distinct possibility that in a "long" magazine that the rims can become locked. This is not possible in some .32ACP pistols that had "short" magazines for the .32Silvertip type ammo only such as the Seecamp. I wish that KelTec would make a magazine that would allow the use of .32ACP hollow points without the risk of rimlock; it could be done in a couple of ways. They could alter the front of the magazine so that it could only feed HP, or they could alter the rear of the magazine so that it would not allow rimlock to happen. The latter is the best alternative as I like FMJ, but others want HP..
The Seacamp is a great idea but has zero sights so it is truly a belly gun. And as you say the magazine is short, it will not cycle any regular ball ammo. Mine will only feed Corbon and Silvertips. I carried it in a front pocket in law enforcement for a get off me gun but never had the need to use it. I did have a problem with a huge armadillo digging under my hot tub, I sprayed water on him, threw rocks at him and shot him 3-4 times with a BB gun to gun him off, but he was aggressive, you have to picture that. My wife thought it was hillarious an armadillo chasing me around the yard, never heard of one doing that. Finally, I shot him in the center with a Silver Tip, he continued to chase me, so I shot him again, both shots under 4 feet, he ran off and died.

I am no longer a fan of the 32 acp Silvertip. It really did not do much damage on the armadillo. Just my experience. I do like the Keltec, 6 ounces, you can put those in a cigarette pack and they shoot great. Keltec invented the tiny 380s, everybody else just copied them.
 

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I had a Seecamp briefly, then got rid of it as too ammo sensitive to run. Went through two Beretta Tomcats which I ran until the frames cracked with Euro heavy ball. Still have a 1920 Colt Type II M1903 pocket hammerless, which my father carried in WW2 in the ETO, a pair of WW2 bringback 1935 Berettas and a SIG P230 in .32 ACP as well as a pair of P230s in .380 ACP. In travel bag have a pair of original model Ruger LCPs in .380 which are reliable, accurate enough and run well. LCP is great for church and beach bathing suit and flip-flops carry and I carry the P230 as a lower profile summer primary when wearing light clothing.

Euro CIP ball by RWS, Geco, or S-B in both calibers.
 

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I once backed down a big boxer dog with one shot from the little 5 shot NAA pistol in 22 mag, the blast and dirt kicked up in his face did the trick. He went away, I went my way, nobody got hurt and I did not have to shoot a dog, not much worse than having to kill a dog.
I have a NAA mini-revolver in .22WMR that I put one of the folding grips on. I have times when I have to wear a suit & tie or tux to a function and with the folding grip its unobtrusive. Like carrying a small knife with a pocket clip. Deployment can be a bit concerning having to open the grip but as has been said, better armed than not.

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ANY gun is better than NO gun.
I 100% Agree with you.

I don't have a lot of handguns. My regular carry is a Springfield XDS 3.3" .45, and I have a Ruger LCP .380 for when I'm really not supposed to be carrying...

As Blaster said "Gun = Better than NO Gun"
 

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I voted YES. have carried a mousegun since 1995 when I bought a beretta 950BS jetfire 25 acp with the tip up barrell. Cool little gun that I paid $150 new for and traded it 15 years later for ...$150. I basically carried it for free all those years!
Today I carry the S&W M&P Bodyguard 380 in a Desantis Nemesis pocket holster.
 

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my main concealed carry gun is a CZ 82 but depending on the situation, I will carry my LCP, P-64 or my non mouse gun Colt Officers .45.
while carrying the .380 or 9x18 pistols, I never felt under gunned for human varmints they are easy to shoot accurately and double tap. ballistically they are close to the .36 black powder revolvers of the 1800s. that were considered a serious weapon in their day. but due to evolution, game animals and humans now require magnum ft. lbs. of energy to kill.
 

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I wonder if anyone is making those solid copper bullets that look like the point of a drill bit in .32 ACP? The thought occurs to me that would give any goblin a dose of fun he would not soon forget - if he lived to remember it.
 
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I wonder if anyone is making those solid copper bullets that look like the point of a drill bit in .32 ACP? The thought occurs to me that would give any goblin a dose of fun he would not soon forget - if he lived to remember it.
Is this what you're talking about? Inceptor Ammunition | Advanced Ammunition Done Differently I use the .38Spc in my bedside revolver. Unfortunately, it doesn't look like they make any .32 ACP. Ruger also makes some but again, not in .32ACP. Ruger Arx Ammunition for Sale | Sportsman's Outdoor Superstore | Online Ammo Store
 

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I am a big big fan of the micro 1911s and the Ruger LCP MAX in terms of firepower per size, but stash guns for emergencies, the subcompact 9s are the most economical. The 10 round Taurus Pt111/G2Cs are consistently $250 and much more robust and higher capacity than similarly priced 380s.

The pocket 380s and 9s do have the advantage of being easier to conceal, lighter, smaller. That makes them good for something like running/exercising or keeping hidden if you REALLY have to.

If I were stashing guns to issue out to my neighbors, it would probably be Ruger Security 9s. They are bulkier for sure, but for a gun UNDER 500 they are the beefiest. Cheap(ish), reliable, low recoil, super rugged, simple design. I'm a fan.

Before someone points out that the Security 9 and the pocket 380s are the same design, I'll just say that the design is great, but the amount of mass and energy creating the action (bullet leaving the barrel), relative to the amount of mass absorbing the equal and opposite reaction (recoil), is vastly different between the LCPs and the Security 9s.

More mass shoots smoother, lasts longer, and will simply survive abuse and neglect that a daintier machine may not.

In terms of a "liberator" the LCPs are really hard to beat, but then again, a 3D printer is just $300 and a glock 19 barrel can be as low as $40 each.
 

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Discussion Starter · #34 ·
Does the sp101 snub in 357 count as a mouse gun? Never felt underpowered
No. A ruger sp 101 is not a mouse gun. It is a real gun. I do not have one but I do have a 3 inch model 60 SW, which is 24 ounces. I love it but when you fire it the mere fireball tells you and everyone within about 50 meters it is not a mouse gun.

My background is military and law enforcement. A 5 shot SW model 36 or 60 or Charter Arms Undercover was a pocket or backup gun. Any smaller caliber was a mouse gun, 22, 25,32, 380, the derringers and such. The 380 graduated with ammo improvements along the way. I do not consider a 380 with 10 or more rounds much of a mouse gun anymore, but that is just me.

Just Google "mouse guns" and you get lots. They even show the Walther PPK/s 380 a mouse gun. Mouse Pistols - Bing images

If you Google something like the "best mouse guns" you get lists, I own most of them. Many say the Seecamp is the very best. Not even close. I carried mine for a decade until the plastic 380 came along. The Seecamp has no sights, none. The pattern is like a basketball at 10 feet. They are a work of precision machinery. Everyone should add one to their collection. I had a problem with mine and personally dealt with the owner, the son now. Great guy and great customer service, one phone call and parts in the mail.

The NAA 22 magnum is high on the list. Sorry not even close, love mine but again the pattern is like a basketball if you need to fire fast. They do make a great third gun if you have an empty pocket. And take up no space or weight.

Lots of them include the baby browning in 25 great gun carried one and very accurate, but it is a 25, shoot something with it. They all list the Berretta 21 with the pop up barrel, wife has one, cool gun, but 22 is still a 22. People get killed with 22s, even at 700 fps you get from a barrel no longer than your big toe. And the list goes one, forget the derringers, unless you get a big one, like the 45 but why would you pick those when a 10 shot 380 or small 38 is the same size.

The point of the OP, me, is that many folks will not carry a real gun. Should we push the tiny ones on them, if we can get them to do so, I think so. I lean toward the plastic 380s, Keltec, Ruger SW, Taurus, as long as they go off every time, that is all that matters to me. My LCP Custom the one with sights, will shoot 2,5 inch full magazine groups at 50 feet. That is the size of the head on a rabbit or squirrel, or the ear of a human. I have others, that give a basketball size group, like the Seecamp. Nobody wants to get shot , and 5 shots from even a 22 short to the face is pretty scary to me. Justsaying.

So, no, the SP 101 is definetly not a mouse gun. It is a man's gun. IMHO
 

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Is this what you're talking about? Inceptor Ammunition | Advanced Ammunition Done Differently I use the .38Spc in my bedside revolver. Unfortunately, it doesn't look like they make any .32 ACP. Ruger also makes some but again, not in .32ACP. Ruger Arx Ammunition for Sale | Sportsman's Outdoor Superstore | Online Ammo Store
Yes, only made of solid copper for sharper edges. But as you say, Duane, no one is making anything like that for .32 ACP/7.65mm that I can find. I I bet no one is making a mold for it in .32 ACP, either, worse luck. Such a bullet would really increase the viability of the .32 ACP in the personal defense role, I think.
 

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When I was coming along in the firearms fraternity, "mouse guns" were defined by caliber far more than by size. The Savage Model 1907, down-calibered from the .45 ACP that lost the US Army pistol competition that gave us the M1911 to .32 and .380; the Beretta Cheetah; a variety of snub-nosed top-break revolvers in 19th Century pocket pistol calibers; the Colt Model 1903 and 1908; the Walther PP and PPK; the various Astra copies of other guns in .32 and .380, like that. (The small pistols generally were referred to as "holdout guns.") .25 ACP, .32 ACP, .380 ACP, later the 9x18 Makarov; those were the mouse gun calibers.

Curiously, the 7.62x25 Tokarev was never lumped in with the mouse guns despite being smaller in caliber than .32 ACP. (Perhaps because it was a general issue military caliber only in full size pistols, with enough authority to kill a horse at 25 meters and more terminal energy at normal defense ranges than a 9mm NATO round? I've long thought there would be a market for a 7.62 Tok pistol the size of a Sardius SD-9; probably a double-stack 10 round magazine.) It seems to me as if size didn't enter into the equation until about 2000, or maybe 1990. The NAA revolvers in .22 WMR weren't seen as mouse guns, they were seen as curiosities at best. Times have changed, and I guess I am behind the curve.
 

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I have two KelTec P-32s, one is the early model and minimalist sights and the second is the latest type with "better" sights than the 1st gen. I am a fan of the .32 because it is thin and in the FMJ it will penetrate..That stated one problem with the KelTec is the magazine, it is designed for FMJ only, anyone who carries it with Silvertips risks developing a fight ending issue called rim-lock. Since the .32ACP is semi-rimmed there is a very distinct possibility that in a "long" magazine that the rims can become locked. This is not possible in some .32ACP pistols that had "short" magazines for the .32Silvertip type ammo only such as the Seecamp. I wish that KelTec would make a magazine that would allow the use of .32ACP hollowpoints without the risk of rimlock; it could be done in a couple of ways. They could alter the front of the magazine so that it could only feed HP, or they could alter the rear of the magazine so that it would not allow rimlock to happen. The latter is the best alternative as I like FMJ, but others want HP..
I have always been a KT fan. Their ingenuity is unsurpassed by any in the market. I once carried a KT PF9 and did so for a long time. Until I came to the realization that, one day, my life might depend on it. I just could not trust it, not that it ever failed me. Kinda like grabbing an AR over an AK. Won't happen. I'll give up a lot for a gun I know is going to go 'bang' every time I pull that trigger.
 

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To me, a mouse gun is something like the P32 Keltec. So small, some wouldn't be able get their finger in the trigger guard to pull the trigger!:) Not recommending it, but something the size of my .25 Raven. Something so small, that if you made the mistake of putting it in your pocket with anything else, you wouldn't be able to find it!:p
 

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I have a NAA mini-revolver in .22WMR that I put one of the folding grips on. I have times when I have to wear a suit & tie or tux to a function and with the folding grip its unobtrusive. Like carrying a small knife with a pocket clip. Deployment can be a bit concerning having to open the grip but as has been said, better armed than not.

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I have a NAA black widow in .22 mag and I have to say it's a nice little gun, much better than I thought it would be. Easy to carry/ conceal and it feels comfortable in the hands with the larger grips, I'm good with it at 7 yards, but you have to make each shot count because reloading is awfully slow. I keep a J frame in the car , but when I'm out and about or just working in the yard I carry the NAA
 
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