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Pre-64 question

Discussion in 'The Powder Keg' started by Rooster, Jul 14, 2002.

  1. Rooster

    Rooster G&G Newbie

    I thought the big deal deal with pre-64 winchesters was with the bolt actions. I was looking for a older win 94 and a guy said that he had a pre-64 model 94. I know about the difference in the bolt actions but how is that applied to the lever gun? Thanks for any info.
     
  2. jerry

    jerry Since 2002 Forum Contributor

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    Remember when Harley's were made by AMF for a while. Kind of the same thing happened with Winchester. My Winchester history is rusty. But I think USRAC started to Mfg. the line. Matter of fact some Browning A-5's were made in Japan. I could be wrong on this but I think this is accurate.
     

  3. Rooster

    Rooster G&G Newbie

    Your right on the Brownings. I'm very lacking in my Winchester department. I think a trip to the library is in order.
     
  4. dave375hh

    dave375hh G&G Newbie Forum Contributor

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    Your right about the A-5's being made in Japan, but USRAC didn't take over Win production till the late 80's. Gait didn't buy the two companys till 94 or 95. Post 64 Win. had a lot of stampings and cast parts to save money over the forged parts that required hand fitting on pre 64's. This was also when the mod 70 was changed to a push feed action. Modern day mod 70's are superior to the pre 64 in everyway except snob appeal IMHO.

    dave375
     
  5. Rooster

    Rooster G&G Newbie

    Does that apply to the mdl 94 lever actions also. The guy told me the price of this 30-30 and I said why so much? He said because it was pre-64. So I says -- you got any 1965's??? LOL
     
  6. dave375hh

    dave375hh G&G Newbie Forum Contributor

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    In the case of the Mod. 94 the pre 64's had a much smoother operation, and yes they were built with stampings and ugly wood finish in the post 64's. They also had pressed checkering crap!

    dave375
     
  7. jerry

    jerry Since 2002 Forum Contributor

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    to correct my self;
    in 1981 USRAC was formed when several employees of Olin's Winchester Corporationbought the Winchester gunmaking division from Olin.

    In 1991 the french company of GIAT aquired both USRAC and Browning.

    Some say today's modern guns are = to or better than even the pre 64's with updated Mfg tecniques etc. Albeit there is nothing like a classic gun with quality workmanship compared to mass produced product regardless of the quality. The post 64 days were bleak indeed.

    If you can't get into a pre 64 mode of thinking, you may be better off buying current new product. You will find though new PC add ons to arms like the 94 (cross bolt safety)
     
  8. Rooster

    Rooster G&G Newbie

    What about the guns made 1964-1981? Theres 17 years before the company changed hands and went to the new manufacture process. Should I also consider a "pre-81" gun? I just want to make sure there is such a thing as a pre-64 mdl 94, so that someone isn't just hype-ing up the deal.
     
  9. dave375hh

    dave375hh G&G Newbie Forum Contributor

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    The worst years were 64 to late 67. In 68 they started to make improvements in the line such as the XTR's. Personally I wouldn't pay extra for a pre 64 mod 94. But I wouldn't buy a new one either, that cross bolt saftey is a PC farce. some of the pre 64's have colletor value but I personally don't think the mod 94 justifies the inflated price unless it's a rare or special model. I'd pay extra for a mod 88 in .358 win., or a mod 70 in .22 hornet, but there is no magic to a pre 64 mod 94 IMHO.

    dave375
     
  10. Rooster

    Rooster G&G Newbie

    That was my sentiment, what the magic in a pre-64 mdl 94? If there is a disernable differece,the dealer couldn't tell be what it was. I see what some of you are posting about with the down turn in product quality post 64( I don't buy pc cross bolt either) , but I thought the pre-64/post-64 specficly applied to the mdl 70 chages? I don't mind paying what somethings worth but I don't want the xtra bs charge either.

    Does the pre-64 claim apply to all winchester or only to win mdl 70's???
     
  11. gunut

    gunut G&G Newbie

    PRE 64

    The pre 64 monkier applies to winchesters full line from 22s thru model 70s to shotguns. Winchester in 64 did major cost reduction changes in the way its firearms were made they dropped a lot of there product line because of the amount of hand fitting needed and the cost of this fitting, some of these changes were so drastic that the buying public would not purchase some of the products until winchester improved the fit finish and quality of raw matrials used in the production of its firearms. Guns produced right after the 64 changover were pure junk for the first few years, with a increase in quality slowly improving there product lines into the 80s then with the advent of CNC machineing the quality took a major league jump up leading to the reintroduction of pre 64 styled guns.
    Some of the changes on the 94 were purely cosmetic in 64[cheaper wood, poor or pressed checkering, poor metal prep[sharp edges] but a lot of internal parts were also not polished leaving a very gritty action and poor trigger pull.
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2002
  12. Rooster

    Rooster G&G Newbie

    Thanks - that answers my question.
     
  13. The steel on the post "64" 94s (into the early 70's) is of a kind that doesn't take blueing well either. Some of them are a purple color and some are splochy. They get worse if you try to reblue them. The actions certainly arn't as smooth as the older ones.
     
  14. Oxford

    Oxford G&G Evangelist

    I thought the thread above was well worth re-reading, especially since I bought my Win Model 94 30-30 last year. It was mfgd in 1974 so I have no other model 94 to compare to that I've actually shot.

    However, in looking over pre 64's on the rack at Cabela's recently, I noticed their external appearance wasn't up to snuff and they were priced considerably more than I would pay for a wall hanger, which most of them appeared to be. I could be wrong about them being wall hangers. On second thought they might have many more years of service left if their workings were checked out carefully before using again.
     
  15. rdale 501

    rdale 501 G&G Newbie

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    I own 2 pre 64 mod. 94s and one made in 77. My brother had a new one in 65 and it was junk. Yes it had stamped parts and the blue was a funky color. But the worst thing was the feeding ramp. It was stamped and made an ugly dent in the casings at times. It also would jam at times. My 94 made in 77 is better than the one my brother had, but does not come close to the feel of the pre 64s. That was the majic year for Winchester.
     
  16. old trapper

    old trapper G&G Newbie

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    pre 64 winchester

    The model 94 action was changed, for economical reasons, in and about seriaal number 2,300, 000. The parts were then stamped instead of machined and the firearms would rattle a little when shook. They were still a fine firearm as the barrel was still the same. Later the parts were again machined and once again they were a better deal. It was a sad day when the 94 was discontinued and perhaps never to appear on the manufacturing scene again.