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Religion aside, did any of my statements make sense?

Discussion in 'The Powder Keg' started by BenP, Jun 21, 2002.

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  1. BenP

    BenP G&G Newbie

    I don't think you need to use the bible to show that homosexuality is wrong. Here's another good point.

    Homosexuality has never worked in any civilization in history. Those civilizations that openly supported and condoned homosexual lifestyle failed. Not that homosexuality was the direct cause of their failure, but that the acceptance of homosexuality was an indicator that the moral center of that civilization was going or gone. Collapse soon followed.

    The laws of nature (let alone god) are absolute. Violate them at your peril.

    I'll say it again, structure, not pleasure, determines function. We don't inhale because it feels good, we inhale because we have to breathe to live.
     
  2. NRAJOE

    NRAJOE YOU TALKIN' TO ME!? Forum Contributor

    Amen Ben...Amen
     

  3. Lenny

    Lenny Guest

    If you are going to use large, sweeping statements about civilizations please back them up with something. Cite a source, site a civilization, cite something, cite anything.

    Your points on homosexuality are wrong. Homosexuality is found in nature. It is documented among mammals.

    I am not advocating that homosexuality is right, but your statements don't have any validity.

    Structure determines function? Why do men have nipples? There is no function for that structure.

    The United States of America is the sole superpower in the world. Homosexuality is recognized and even protected in many ways in the USA. The trend is acceptance of homosexuality. The economy/military/GNP/etc. of the USA has grown steadily. That would show the exact opposite of your theory. I am not saying that homosexuality acceptance brings prosperity, but it is hard to argue the facts.
     
  4. PAPA G

    PAPA G G&G Evangelist Forum Contributor

    BenP right as usual buddy!!!! their an abomination in my eyes, and withe all the demands their placing for the rest of us to accept them, even more abombinating(?) their biggest supporters are wimmen, cause they won't get raped by a true homosexual, besides they can talk abiut eye shadow and such!!!:p
     
  5. SPOCAHP ANAR

    SPOCAHP ANAR G&G Enthusiast

    Homosexuality is Biologically wrong. It serves no purpose in nature. It only serves to self pleasure.

    I believe that some homosexuality may be a result of a chemical imbalance in the brain-its just who some people are.

    But there is alot of it that is learned behavior. There are those that go both ways, there are people that flip flop;... I am gay now I am straight, etc.. There is alot of learned gay behavior which LBJ's are a prime example (lesbian before graduation).

    All of the learned behavior is for purely self pleasure, whereas those who are truly born gay do it out of a necessity to feel whole.
     
  6. Born gay-- Just an excuse for being gay. Other than that Phacosprana: I agree with you. Lenny what is your trip where do you stand morally. Please no B.S....
     
  7. Logansdad

    Logansdad Guest

    Dr McDonald of the NIMH (May he rest in peace) theorized on research with huge populations of rats & mice that after a certain population density had been achieved they would start to exhibit behaviors that would ensure that they couldn't raise the next generation (extreme vanity, extreme aggression of large specimens & homosexuality) he called this theory "Universal Autism"
     
  8. Lenny

    Lenny Guest

    To alan

    Where do I stand morally? I am not gay and I hope that when I have children they are not gay. I have several friends of both sexes that are gay. They are both wonderful people. They are both shining examples of what is good in people. They are happy, educated people who bring love and happiness to all around them. I know it sounds all foo-fooey but they are just nice people. It is hard for me to condemn people who are that way. DO I like to see them get all cuddly with their partners? No. But generally they dont do that anyway because they know it makes people around them uncomfortable. I don't believe in hell so I'm not worried about them burning or anything like that. There are homosexuals on the other side of the coin that I really dislike: in-your-face "I'm gay, and I'm here to stay!"

    Anyone who is realy concerned with the lifestyles of homosexuals only has to wait one generation; most of them do not pass their genes down.
     
  9. Logansdad

    Logansdad Guest

    They don't generally procreate but they sure can multiply...I don't dislike groups of people...everybody gets a clean slate once a day.
    I do get a little tired of the "In your face" attitudes of certain groups though.
     
  10. I dont get it--maybe I am slow. When I have children I hope they are not gay? Children are not born gay. Thats just an excuse to make it seem right. Of course this only my opinion. Is there a gay gene that scientists have discovered that I don't know about
     
  11. BenP

    BenP G&G Newbie

    Lenny,

    Biblically speaking, there was Sodom and Gamorrah, the Philistines, the israelites...

    Of course, the most prominent example is Rome. There were many factors which contributed to their demise, but their recession of power really only began after their moral character weakened, and that wasn't just due to homosexuality either, though it was a big part. This issue isn't as cut and dried as the bible or our limited debate thus far would allow.

    As far as homosexuality in nature goes, yeah, I've seen animals carry on that way. That does not make it normal. In fact, I've got a male mini-daschund that tries to hump on our neutered 80 lb dalmation. He's never successful of course, but he still tries, usually when they're playing around. I see it as an act of domination, which is part of the doggie psyche, and most other gregarious mammals do the same. There are also asexual creatures, such as earthworms, but I don't think you're talking about those. Actual copulation between males of the same animal species (I've never heard or seen a case where females do this) in all cases I've ever witnessed or otherwise heard about appear to be the product of an abnormal environment in which the animals were being maintained, either physically or psychologicially (excessive stress, close quarters, lack of female population, modified food additives). I don't consider this natural, though I'm sure there are examples of this type of behavior outside of controlled conditions, for many of the same reasons.

    My statement that structure determines function holds true with your example of the male petitula as well as mine of the appendix. Since neither are a functional part of our anatomy, they are a useless structure. Male reproductive organs, however, do have a function, and therefore a defined purpose. The purpose has nothing to do with homosexuality, which has no function in our existence.

    The points I've made against homosexuality are not wrong. They are facts. While you've augmented my points with some interesting extrapolations, you've not contradicted them yet in any way. I believe we can expound on them further, but I don't think that's going to support your position any better.

    I too have friends who are gay, and that does not make them evil. I don't think you have to be evil to be wrong about something. I don't condemn them for being wrong, for I am full aware that I would face similar condemnation for my many flaws. I simply point out that being wrong should not entitle you to certain rights that the majority are not availed of.

    I do not view homosexuality as a condition, but as a choice. I did not choose to be caucasian or a man, but I am compelled to live with certain limitations because of being both. I choose to be heterosexual, therefore I make a choice to accept the limitations that places on me, just as a homosexual should accept their limitations. The problem is our government has decided to empower the choice of being homosexual with certain rights not available to others by choice. This to me is a huge endorsement by the government on homosexual lifestyle, which I think is fundamentally wrong. There is a big difference between tolerance of non-conformity and making a non-conformity an institution.

    I think we can be tolerant of a non-destructive lifestyle choice as long as we don't then go around saying that it's not only okay to be that way, but you'll be rewarded if you decide that's what you want to do. The first thing we need to recognize is that homosexuality is a choice, pure and simple. Studies have been done that have shown both a physical link to homosexual activity, as well as to show that the physical cause in one person is non-attributable in another who is also gay, and yet other studies which show the physical cause to exist in heterosexuals as well.

    The bottom line here is that there is no argument that can be supported that homosexuality is a physical attribute. The fact that it does exist in both man and animal does not imply that it has to exist, but merely that a choice exists. Mankind has been making bad choices for a long time, and has still survived, and will likely continue to survive. Success, though, tends to favor those who make the right choice, which usually makes logical sense. Christian morality does not seem to violate natural law. So it has been the de facto standard generally accepted by our leadership. In the past 40-50 years, we have been gradually eroding that standard, so is it coincidence that our government seems odd?
     
  12. Lenny

    Lenny Guest

    christian morality

    Any event that takes place in nature is by definition natural. Homosexuality is natural. It happens in nature. It happens with humans (who are a part of nature) and it happens with animals (who are a part of nature).

    I have seen homosexual traits develop in a child that was 1 1/2 years old. He is now about 19. He is now gay. Every person that came into contact with him from 1.5 years on could see that he was going to be gay. Don't tell me that he made the choice at 1.5 years to be gay.

    If christian morality were not in conflict with natural law, why are there so many rules? If christian morality were so correct and natural, why is the world not christian? Besides, christian morality came into being very recently on the timeline. While natural law has been in existence since the dawn of living organisms.
     
  13. Jesse

    Jesse G&G Newbie Forum Contributor

    2,036
    3
    I find it VERY hard to diagnose a 1 1/2 yr old as a homosexual. Tough call. I believe it is a sin in God's eyes because the Bible says so. The Old Testament speaks of curses lasting for generations after the sins of their parents. Generally in Christian theology these are known as generational curses. Basically a generational curse is broken with the acceptance of Christ as savior and a redemption from the curse. This may sound really far out, but it is generally accepted in Baptist and Pentecostal theology. If you want to see something really radical, read or watch any of Bob Larson's books/programs.



    Jesse
     
  14. NRAJOE

    NRAJOE YOU TALKIN' TO ME!? Forum Contributor

    There is Hell and Homos are going there Lenny,Its too bad you don't believe in Hell Lenny 'cause your gonna be shocked when your standing there! This will probably the last time I reply to one of your assinine posts because you will only tell me I'm a bible thumper and I'm hateful and intolerent and tell me to "eat a brown one" ...(which by the way was very grown up of you)...you are an antagonist that only replys to things that will cause arguments. You have no substance and seem to have an axe to grind with everyone who are not godless as yourself! People like you are the reason this country is going down the toilet with their tolerent bullcrap! It has to stop! You and your ACLU buddys have fun out there trying to destroy the decent way of American life...those of us on this site will not fall to your hug them all attitude. The failure to accept GOD has led to the downfall of this country, you and your kind will most certainly find Hell even though you don't believe...good luck.
     
  15. Lenny

    Lenny Guest

    generational curses

    don't exist. But if they did they would not effect the children of homosexuals. Homosexuals don't pass down their genes.
     
  16. Lenny

    Lenny Guest

    Dear NRAJOE

    Your nazi attitude is what the founding fathers tried to prepare for upon giving us the freedom of religion.
    There is a hell? And homos are going there? Prove it.
    Try peddling your nightmares elsewhere. You are completely brainwashed. I'll bet you were going to church before you even had any concept of religion. That is called brainwashing.

    "Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocrities." - Albert Einstein

    You, NRAJOE are a mediocrity. Please do yourself a favor and don't reply to any more of my posts...assinine or otherwise.
     
  17. BenP

    BenP G&G Newbie

    I don't agree that everything that happens in nature is natural. I define natural as something that has an expected outcome based on the previous performance of a group or standard. There are always aberrations, and these are unnatural events, which can occur in nature. It is a natural event for a sheep to give birth to a lamb of similar distinction. It is not natural for a sheep to give birth to a lamb with two heads.

    When is a person a homosexual? As an extension to the logic of your argument, I would say that an inmate who is raped by another inmate of the same sex in prison is exhibiting homosexual traits and therefore a homosexual. I don't believe that defines a homosexual. Rather, I think a person is homosexual when they make the statement that they are homosexual, or at least when they have consentual homosexual sex. This is fundamentally different from other characteristics pertaining to legal issues. I am not caucasian because I said I am. I am caucasian because that is what I came from, and it can be proven unarguably. For me to say I am any other race is insane. Likewise, I am male. I was designed to breed with females. For me to say I am anything else is insane. I was not designed to breed with males. The function of other male orifices is not to breed. Therefore, using them for such is insane.

    The definition of homosexual traits is subjective, and therefore, cannot be argued. If the child is actually having sex at that age, then I'd say he is psychologically impaired, or is being adversely influenced by his environment.

    There are a great many rules in nature that have been documented in various forms. Rules are ways for people who made mistakes and survived them to help their successors avoid the same hazards. Like anything else human, they can be abused. No one said the system was perfect.

    I read a book when I was about 13 titled "Benjamin Alexander Sheep". I learned that your relationship with God was personal, and that no one on earth could reliably judge who was and wasn't going to be saved. What a man tells you can be entirely different than what's in his heart.

    I know of several proclaimed gays that had families and raised children before coming out of the closet. I also know of some who were gay before and then became devout heterosexuals and raised families and had children later on.

    Lenny, I don't want to perpetuate this argurment, but it seems that there's simply nothing you can say that's going to convince anyone who's not gay that being gay is normal, acceptable behavior. Our government compels us to live with the condition, but that is the absolute limit of our current society. If we ever get to the point where homosexuality is majority accepted as normal behavior, it will have to be after the current generation of citizens is dead and buried. That's just the way it is and no one living now is going to change that. That is the reality of our world.

    You can rage against it, but reality will continue on it's merry way. Who knows, maybe some day in the future you will be revered as a pioneer in changing our social views.
     
  18. NRAJOE

    NRAJOE YOU TALKIN' TO ME!? Forum Contributor

    BenP, Lenny is gay and doesn't want to admit it,so he is angry at everyone on here because 99% won't accept it! He is a health and beauty broker for GODS sake! I would have had more respect for him if he had just come out and said it! He has called people on here ignorant...hateful...nazi's...etc! Just come out of the closet Lenny...free yourselve sister!
     
  19. Logansdad

    Logansdad Guest

    Everyone knew when my son was one year old that he liked girls...he has a crush on one of his cousins...you should see him around her...he's shameless
     
  20. NRAJOE

    NRAJOE YOU TALKIN' TO ME!? Forum Contributor

    Good, may he grow to be a good strong man like his father...I know you'll teach him right bro!
     
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