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Since 03-15- 2002
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Iv'e been handloading for many years.

When Iv'e loaded .308 (for my model 700) I've used a factory round for length set up, or a dummy I made from a factory round.

Iv'e misplaced both.

Iv'e tried the seat method where you run the bullet down just before it touched the rifling, using dry erase marker or soot from fire to see the lands. I never had much luck doing this. seems like a real pain.

My Speer book has a COL cartridge over all lenght spec. I got the calipers out and ran a dummy round (150 grain) 2.80". This seemed awfull long :hmmm: Foreget it when the 130gn is used, that comes up way short. :insane:

I soppose I could run the COL and mark the bullet with dry erase and try to make sure I'm not getting rifling contact, or just go .10 or .20 below COL?

What do you do?
 

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Jerry, this is not rocket science. Most important thing is that it fits with clearnce in you mag. If you are into comp. shooting thats a whole different story. Length and "volume",charge and type of powder are of the most important factors. least would be the primers cause you can't controll them. Basic rule is at least the bullet dia. depth
 

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Jerry,
Hollingsworth is right but also remember for comp shooting in most cases your loading a single round at a time verse the magazine. Since your using a 700 try this load and I think you will find excellent performance. 43 grains IMR 4895 168gr HPBT Match either Sierra or Nosler J4. Seating depth is just barely clearing the magazine and you will get great performance out to 500 yards - if shooting 1000 yards with this round plan on an 18' hold over to hit center mass of a 6' silouhette. Ideally for over 500 yards kick the powder up to 45grains and the same seating depth then 500 yards is the same zero as 200 on the 43 grain load. Hold over at 1000 translates to 10' from experience. (Now these numbers have been measured on MY Rem. 700 VSSF 308 24", yours may like something else. )
 

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Since 03-15- 2002
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Thanks guys,
Coming from two highly respected gentlemen in the application, your time is appreciated.

I soppose I was overthinking/overengineering it to a certain extent. I didn't want to touch the rifling for obvious reasons.

Shaun,
I'll write this load in my current Speer manual under "Notes" When I use up the can of 4064 I have, I may try that one out. I may also get some new brass worthy of a load like that. I typically load one at a time a the range. Iv'e even thought about getting one of those devices that slip into the magazine like a follower plate to ease this. I can't remember where Iv'e seen them.
 

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Jerry,
Take a cleaning rod with a flat tipped jag on it and run it down the barrel till it stops on the bolt face. Now mark the rod at the muzzle with a sharp pencil. Remove the rod and the bolt. Place the bullet you want to use into the chamber and lightly push it up till it touches the rifling in the throat. While holding the bullet in place with a dowel rod or what have you, put the cleaning rod back into the barrel and bring it down to touch the nose of the bullet. Now mark the rod again with the pencil. Remove the rod and measure the distance between the two marks. this is your max LOA to touch with that bullet. Back off from that a little to allow for the difference in bullet nose lengths. To take this one step further get a bullet comparitor from Sinclair Int and load a round to the exact length you got off the rod. This dummy must be made with the same bullet you used to make the original measurement. If you drop the bullet you'll need to start over again. Measuring this dummy plus the comparitor and it will tell you the max LOA for all bullets in that gun. The comp. measures from the ogive or max dia. where the bullet actually hits the lands. The only way this measurement changes is with throat erosion. The comp looks like a large nut that has 6 different caliber holes around it. Once you find the measurement for each rifle you simply use the comp when you set up you seating die making it exactly how far you want it from the leade.

Of course all this goes out the window if the magazine is too short. My .308 with 165's uses a LOA of 2.825 and is still .020 off the lands. Hope this helps, it's a lot harder to explain than it is to do.
 

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jerry said:
Thanks guys,
brass worthy of a load like that. I typically load one at a time a the range. Iv'e even thought about getting one of those devices that slip into the magazine like a follower plate to ease this. I can't remember where Iv'e seen them.
Jerry you can get them at Brownells or through Midway
 

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Jerry the tool you need is Stoney Point's O.A.L. gauge and used in conjunction with thier Bullet Comparator and a dial calibers you will never have to guess angain. You will also be able to reload your brass to fit you gun "chamber" with pin point accuracy. Right now you are relying on a factory cartridge as a gage and that's not cool. Factory ammo is not to be relied upon as a gage in reloading that is why they making the following tools

Midsouth Shooters Supply has the O.A.L. for $27 plus modified case $3.80. And the comparator w/6 inserts for $23.

It really is a small price to pay to safely load accurate ammunition. Shoot, that's what make reloading so much fun is buying all those do-dads to try and get the most accuracy out of your reloads
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
This has all been good & educational.

I see some new tools in my future. That info wasn't given out for not.

Dave spent a lot of time laying out his method, it was also something I could do right now. So I gave it a try. I accomplished this method with a pretty interesting result.

The Speer COL as mentioned was 2.80. Using Dave's method I came up with 2.85 My calipers do hundreths. I couldn't do thousandths as Dave's measurement came out. Lets just say it wasn't perfectly on the line.

By this method, I'd assume 2.80 would be off the lands enough to prevent any over pressure issues due to excessive lenght. Also enclosed is a blurb I found on pressures.

Some conditions that can raise pressure
Actual Case Capacity
Thick walls and/or webs will reduce internal capacity and could increase pressure.
Case Length
Cases exceeding maximum lengths could enter the chamber throat and cause pressure increases.
Case Neck Diameters
If over the maximum listed dimension, thick necks can be a source of increased pressure.
Crimping
Crimping cases can alter chamber pressure. Never crimp a load unless the load is developed with a crimp.
Component Variations
Never change component type, brand or lot number without completely redoing the necessary load development.
Excessive or Improper storage of Powders and Primers
Always use fresh primers and propellants which have been properly stored.
(See primer storage and powder storage for more info)
Excessively Deep seated or Overly Long Cartridge Lengths
Generally it is wise to load the length listed in the data tables of your reloading manual. When a specific overall length is not listed it is wise to load ammo to the maximum length specified for the loaded cartridge. When it is not possible to load short bullets to a maximum cartridge lengths, and there is no specified length, be certain to seat the bullet at least a full diameter deep. For example a 30 caliber bullet should be seated at least .308" into the case neck.
Firearms
Firearm dimensional variations can cause substantial pressure changes.
Dies
Die dimensions, which vary from normal, can cause pressure changes.
 

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Since 03-15- 2002
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27,596 Posts
Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Shaun said:
Jerry you can get them at Brownells or through Midway
Shaun,
Iv'e done a search looking for it. Do you know the official nomenclature ie. keyword?
 

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I have found the best accurcy from .065 to .005 from the rifling on all calibers I have loaded. Remember safety is a must! I saw one idiot last week that decided he would just fill the case by taking the case and pushing it through a big pan of powder until it was full! he said that was close enough for all the hunting he would do. Not long after that he was hunting alright, but for a new rifle as it blew part of the bolt out.
 

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Tipadoux said:
I saw one idiot last week that decided he would just fill the case by taking the case and pushing it through a big pan of powder until it was full! he said that was close enough for all the hunting he would do. Not long after that he was hunting alright, but for a new rifle as it blew part of the bolt out.
!!!! remarkable that he didn't hurt himself or others - and here I am a beginner reloader who weighs every charge twice just to be sure...but I like my body parts the way they came :)
 
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