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Buddy, first think about the M1D Garand Sniper. Its offset to the left actually even more than the k31 is offset to the right.

Zero the rifle in first at 100 ayrds. Rezero it at 200 yards. After that the POI difference from 100 to 300 and beyond will be something you won't be able to determine anyway.
The only way you'd be able to measure POI differences it is in a solid firing device like the bullet manufactureres use and measure it with calipers from 100 to 400 yards.

Latigo
 

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Insignificant compared to the bullet drop and wind deflection.

Sight in range is the focus point. The further away that point is, the less it matters.

If the offset is 1" and sight in range is 100yds, then then POI moves left 1 " at 200 yds, 2" left at 300yds, 3" left at 400yds. About the same effect as a 10 mile/hr wind effect


If the offset is 1" and sight in range is 200yds, then then POI moves left 1 " at 400 yds, 2" left at 600yds, 3" left at 900yds. About the same effect as a 4 mile/hr wind effect.
 

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Insignificant compared to the bullet drop and wind deflection.

Sight in range is the focus point. The further away that point is, the less it matters.

If the offset is 1" and sight in range is 100yds, then then POI moves left 1 " at 200 yds, 2" left at 300yds, 3" left at 400yds. About the same effect as a 10 mile/hr wind effect


If the offset is 1" and sight in range is 200yds, then then POI moves left 1 " at 400 yds, 2" left at 600yds, 3" left at 900yds. About the same effect as a 4 mile/hr wind effect.
Thanks guys..
It just bugs my head it would seem if the scope is sitting at a slight angle that would be more dramatic at the POI...I know its not but my brain is having hard time digesting why not.
 

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Buddy, there's no angle in the mount or the scope. The mount is dead paralell to the bore. The only adjustment is your windage in the scope.

Latigo
 

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Latigo - Are you involved in making or marketing these mounts somehow? I'm kinda interested, how tightly do they clamp and how well do they stay put?
 

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Its one of the things our company manufactures, but you'll have to click on my name and then click on "Go to Latigo's Homepage"

I don't market or sell them at all. Everything is handled through our distributors, Graf & Sons and Brownells. The most I can do here is explain how they work and help solve problems.
Go to the top part of this thread. There are pictures of how they are secured on the rifle. The explantions are all there already.
Thanks
 

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Wow, some interesting stuff there!
 

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Coincidence! That's exactly what my wife said when she first met me. :D
 

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Buddy, there's no angle in the mount or the scope. The mount is dead paralell to the bore. The only adjustment is your windage in the scope.

Latigo
I see so its a clocking issue not what I am thinking that makes sense, if I just thing of the scope as being just at another clock instead at 12 its more like 0130 or so...
ok...I'll be ok
 

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Scoped K31 Kansas 2010 Buck Harvest

I saw this thread on scoped K31's and thought you might find this interesting. My set-up below is very similar to the ones pictures in this thread and I used it for the first time this year to harvest a Kansas buck on opening day of deer rifle season in Kansas (12/1/2010). Shot this deer at 92 yards with Prvi Partizan 174 grain soft point. He went about ten yards before collapsing. The Pentax 4x12x40 is a very good scope for the money and mounts very well on the K31. I find the cheek weld to very natural in my set-up and the eye relief seems to be just about perfect.
 

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Nice buck and nice rifle! But, rifle's cocked and safety's off? :yikes:
 

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Kansas Buck Harvest

I wondered after I posted the picture if anyone would comment on that...I laid the rifle there for the picture immediately after doing a bore check to insure it was clear - which it was. Magazine had been previously emptied in the field (I do not doubt that the Swiss magazines can take the load, but I don't like to keep tension on a spring made in 1935). I guess next time for posterity sake I will "put her on safe" even when she is just posing.
 

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Or just put your finger through the ring, hold the firing pin back while you release the trigger, and gently lower the firing pin. On the empty chamber of course.
 

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Swiss Performance Summary - Kansas Deer Season

Kansas 2010 (2011 Extended Anterless) deer season in now over (ended 1/16/2011 for Unit 15). The K31 and its attendant load for this season (Prvi Partisan 174 grain soft point) accounted for themselves very well. One buck (see previous post) and four does were taken by this combination. Shots ranged from 80 yards to 125 yards. None of the deer in question went more than 25 yards before collapsing, the last doe of the season was DRT. This is a very effective rifle and ammo combination for whitetail deer hunting, next year I may try some 150 grain hand loads and see how they stack up.
 

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Insignificant compared to the bullet drop and wind deflection.

Sight in range is the focus point. The further away that point is, the less it matters.

If the offset is 1" and sight in range is 100yds, then then POI moves left 1 " at 200 yds, 2" left at 300yds, 3" left at 400yds. About the same effect as a 10 mile/hr wind effect


If the offset is 1" and sight in range is 200yds, then then POI moves left 1 " at 400 yds, 2" left at 600yds, 3" left at 900yds. About the same effect as a 4 mile/hr wind effect.


Why not just zero one inch to the right at one hundred yards and it will still be one inch to the right at all distances.Just asking.
 

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Why not just zero one inch to the right at one hundred yards and it will still be one inch to the right at all distances.Just asking.
i'm not buying that one inch at a hundred and two inches at two hundred stuff. i'm going by what the guy who makes the says. it makes more sense to me.

"Zero the rifle in first at 100 ayrds. Rezero it at 200 yards. After that the POI difference from 100 to 300 and beyond will be something you won't be able to determine anyway.
The only way you'd be able to measure POI differences it is in a solid firing device like the bullet manufactureres use and measure it with calipers from 100 to 400 yards.

Latigo"

the scope in in line with the bore. why would the bullet ever move to the left with distance?
 

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I think Latigo and diopter are both correct.

Thought experiment:

A) scope over the bore, bullet angles up and crosses line of sight at about 40 yds, an inch or so high at 100, max height above line of sight somewhere around 150 yds or so, back down to dead on at 200 yds and drops from there. This is a 'normal' sight in scenario. Depending on bullet speed and BC the numbers vary a bit, but you get the idea. There is NO left/right movement.

B) everything exactly the same, but scope moved 1" left. Still parallel with bore in direction. now the bullet travel is exactly as it was before but the cross hairs are now looking at a spot 1" left of where it was in A, for all ranges. no problem. If you know that you will always hit 1" right at any range, the elevations are the same and you can be a happy camper.

However, if you now adjust the scope at say 100 yds to get rid of the offset, the bullet is angled in toward the line of sight and crosses the line of sight at the zero distance. For example, with a 100 yd zero, at 200 yds it will be 2" left, at 300 yds 3" left, etc. Zero the scope farther out and the angle is lessened. If the crossover is at the 200 yd zero, the bullet will be 1" right at the muzzle, 1/2" right at 100 yds, on at 200, 1/2" left at 300, 1" left at 400, etc. Elevation remains the same.

so it does add some difficulty but with a 200 yd zero you are only dealing with a maximum 1" offset at all practical ranges. to the right before 200 yds and to the left past 200 yds.

now to be clear, there is nothing that says you can't have 2 zero points. one for elevation and another for left/right. sight it in for elevation as if it was over the bore. then sight in as far out as you can for left/right. between the muzzle and zero point you will have 1" and less offset and at 2x the left/right zero yardage you will have the same 1" offset to the other side.
 

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i'm still sticking with latigos statement that the difference wouldn't even be measureable without calipers. i'm gonna get one and find out for myself. my k31 is dying for a scope anyway!
 
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