Gun and Game Forum banner
1 - 20 of 153 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,952 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Alright Guys, it's time to stir the proverbial pot just for chit's & kicks. ...

Consider a SHTF scenario where WWIII hits and there is anarchy. You're alone on your 10 acres in the middle of nowhere with a small cabin and no neighbors for miles. You have family to protect. Which gun would you rather have to defend your property & bring down game for dinner with. here locally that would primarily be muley deer Antelope and maybe elk.

You can only have one rifle, and it must be the AR-15 or any version of the SKS, other than that cheap production fake SKS -M.

I don't want to get into semantics Over magazine capacity, because if you're proficient with stripper clips it's not an issue. let's also assume that shooting distances will be between 50 & 225 yards and you have an ample stockpile of decent ammo on hand, but not much in the way of spare parts.

Which one do you chose?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4,847 Posts
Because of my familiarity with the AR15 I would choose to go with it, as long as I was prepared with a good kit for basic upkeep and cleaning. I've got the gun and already have plenty of ammunition along with reloading supplies. With proper aim, a .223/5.56 is more than capable of bringing down a mule deer or antelope and if you hit it just right.... even an elk.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
14,179 Posts
I agree with Kmcdowell in the fact that the 223 will bring anything down it needs to as long as you're capable of putting the bullet where it needs to go. I am a huge AR fan, and I can put one together and take one apart with relative ease. But I think I would go with the AK, and heres why:the AK is much more ammo friendly and much more durable. Granted it probably not going to be as accurate as an AR, but where I hunt and live, 50 to 75 yards is much more likely of a kill shot than 225 is. And even though a 223 will take down just about anything, a 30 caliber bullet will give you a little more knock down power. I'm going to go with the AK.

Nice Pot Stirring, buickman!
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
17,079 Posts
There is a reason (several actually) the SKS is no longer used by pretty much every nation out there with the exception of irregular forces here and there.

And Ive seen the abuse/conditions that current modern designed well manufactured/assembled AR15 can withstand first hand.

I've also seen several examples of people with SKS's trying to mod the crap out of their guns to make it more "AR15 like" and just end up with a half azzed build that still doesn't do much for improving the gun.

The only/biggest thing the SKS has going for it is people debate the caliber... but considering you can get a wide variety of calibers (everything from .22LR to 9mm to .50 Beowulf in the AR15 platform that makes that sort of a moot point.


Also the AR15 will give you a much more accurate and better platform to mount optics on as well no matter the caliber you go with.

I don't want to get into semantics Over magazine capacity, because if you're proficient with stripper clips it's not an issue. let's also assume that shooting distances will be between 50 & 225 yards and you have an ample stockpile of decent ammo on hand, but not much in the way of spare parts.
But it is an issue,

1. if this was a handgun (or any other magazine fed gun) would you rather have three 17 round mags in a Glock 17 for example or would you rather have three 10 round communist mags for the same gun?

if you got the AR15 would you willingly nerf it by only buying 10 round magazines for it?

On the timing of reloads, sure you may be able to swap a magazine in the same time as inserting a stripper clip.. but

That only assumes you are doing completely dry reloads where you are loading a completely empty weapon... if you are in a gunfight what about tactical reloads?

You just fired off several rounds in your AR15 or your SKS but your not sure how many... but you know you have a couple seconds to top off... With an AR15 despite how many rounds you have left in the magazine you can simply and quickly swap it out for a fully topped off one. With an SKS with a bunch of stripper clips this process is not nearly as fast and easy.

Not to mention when you load a stripper clip fed SKS do you have to break the weapon from your shoulder and hold the thing with two hands to get the stripper clip in and press the rounds down or can you reload with one hand while keeping your weapon up and ready to fire with your sights already down range on target and your hand on fire control like you can with an AR15?


-Spare parts...

Im still running the same parts with thousands of rounds through the same AR15's.... Assuming no catastrophic failure (then you are screwed either way with an SKS or an AR15) you will probably be dead before your parts break assuming you had quality parts to begin with from firing so much.

if this was an AK vs AR15 debate I think the choice would be a LOT closer with one or the other having more distinctive advantages over the other but with SKS vs AR15 I think the SKS is simply to much of an antiquated weapon system to compete with an AR15 on paper stats alone. Assuming shooter skill is the same.

just my thoughts.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
4,689 Posts
AR15 because I'm already familiar with it and can hit targets pretty well with it. And I already have a bunch of ammo for it. Plus, it's a little more pleasant to shoot than an SKS. And I can more easily mount a scope if needed.
 
  • Like
Reactions: jwrauch

·
Resident Curmudgeon
Joined
·
35,758 Posts
I'd go with the SKS. General Simonov designed his rifle for the Eastern Front battle conditions the Red Army endured in World War II. It's klunky, sure. I don't find it at all clumsy, and my dad hammered "Count your rounds when you are shooting!" into me from the time he let me have my first BB gun to the point it is second nature. (I don't know whether he had that hammered into him by Grandpa with the Winchester Model 94 that was the family rifle, or his drill sergeant when he joined the Army, but he took it to heart.)

Simonov knew that even though soldiers should field-strip and clean their rifles at every opportunity, sometimes you don't have the opportunity; thus, he designed the SKS to work even when filthy. That counts for a lot with me, especially in the scenario we are discussing. I keep hearing the duckspeak that the Poodle Shooter really has been improved since the Vietnam days when it earned its epithet of "the Jam-A-Matic," but my personal experience with the design on the range (other people's rifles; I won't own one) and the stories told by soldiers and Marines who are veterans of every conflict from Vietnam to Afghanistan of the M-16s and M-4s jamming when they needed them the most tell me to stay away from the AR family. I simply don't trust them.

I own two Yugo Model 59/66s, one stock and the other set up as a plinker with a scope and a bipod. I've never had either one jam. I would very much like to get a couple more when finances improve.

The bottom line is if my choices are limited to those two, I'll go with the SKS. I trust my SKS rifles to work when I need them to, and I don't trust anything built to Eugene Stoner's original direct impingement design.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
24,835 Posts
The title did not specify WHICH "AR" was to be selected.

Obviously, I'm choosing my AR10!! It was the ORIGINAL AR. :D

Especially for defending my home, AND for getting game.

25 round magazines. .308 caliber power and accuracy. 800 yard kill zone. What's not to love?!?!?!?!

And it will outdo ANYTHING an SKS or AR15 can do. ;)
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
17,079 Posts
The other thing I could expound upon...

The AR15 has the clear advantage in modularity and perhaps more importantly adaptability. Which is very important in a survival situation...

If you have an SKS... you are basically stuck with what you get.... a medium weight, medium sized 3-4 MOA accurate general purpose infantry carbine....

If you go AR15... you can build it to whatever spec you need.

You want a lighter weight quick handling general purpose infantry carbine? You can do that.

You want a shorter CQB gun? You can do that?
How about an intermediate 1 MOA accurate Special Purpose Rifle build? Yup.
Or a bigger .308 caliber + designated marksman rifle or semi auto sniper rifle? Yes you can do that too.

You want a drum mag fed setup with a bipod to put down some suppressive fire? you can do that too if you so desire.

You Or if you want you can even do several roles and just have a different upper receiver on hand.
 

·
Gun Toting Boeing Driver
Joined
·
21,493 Posts
The other thing I could expound upon...

The AR15 has the clear advantage in modularity and perhaps more importantly adaptability. Which is very important in a survival situation...

If you have an SKS... you are basically stuck with what you get.... a medium weight, medium sized 3-4 MOA accurate general purpose infantry carbine....

If you go AR15... you can build it to whatever spec you need.

You want a lighter weight quick handling general purpose infantry carbine? You can do that.

You want a shorter CQB gun? You can do that?
How about an intermediate 1 MOA accurate Special Purpose Rifle build? Yup.
Or a big more .308 caliber + designated marksman rifle or semi auto sniper rifle? Yes you can do that too.

You want a drum mag fed setup with a bipod setup to put down some surpressive fire? you can do that too if you so desire.

You Or if you want you can even do several roles and just have a different upper receiver on hand.
Yup.....this.

If I need range I'll go to my M1 or 270 hunting rifle. Both have a longer stick than an AR-15 and about the same as an AR-10.

BUT

If my parts are going to break, my ARs are reliable and they are all interchangeable. I can go from 223 to 300 Blk for hunting. I do have spare parts, but worst case can pick the best lower/BCG I have and cannibalize parts from other builds as necessary. The AR is very easy to configure for whatever task, compared with AKs or SKSs which are much harder to hang lights on or even switch optics. Although an ACOG can do it all I can quickly swap a different upper (with different optic) if I want to which has already been zeroed. I can easily put legs on it or add/remove a sling. Most have some form of Weapons Mounted Light, but if they don't they will easily go on a rail.

The 223 loses something outside of 100 yards, but with good shot placement can still kill game or stop a BG. AND it's a great deal easier to compute bullet drop with given that the graduations are already on the ACOG or even the EOTech (AND shoots flatter). Even the 300 BLK has graduations on an ACOG for drop at range, and these also let me figure out a rough wind drift.

AND if I miss I've got a whole bunch more follow up shots quickly from standard mags.

I LIKE shooting my AK and SKS from time to time, but the AR platform is much more versatile. The 300 BLK gives me an AK-like caliber. DGI works well even when abused (maybe not as well as the AK under terms of very bad abuse), but anything I might do to a rifle the AR will continue to operate. It's easily suppressed, the springs are all interchangeable (and easy to keep spares), and I can swap out a buffer/spring in seconds if need be. Broken firing pin; no problem--pull the BCG and swap it out. Same as for extractor, etc. Or just swap the whole BCG out if you'd rather.

So from the standpoint of inventory the AR is much better suited.
 

·
Global Warming Enthusiast
Joined
·
4,253 Posts
AR no question. Keeping the gun clean isn't an issue, it's on your property and in your cabin so you're not going to be in the field for an extended period of time. I have all sorts of .223 bullet combinations along with 5.56 in M855 and M193 for two legged critters in vehicles or behind barriers. With my 24" version I can group at about 1.5 inches at 200 yards, with my carbine it's light for the fight. I know every part and have spares.
 

·
Resident Curmudgeon
Joined
·
35,758 Posts
Perhaps the parameters of this thread need to be defined. I am not looking at the AR as one of the exotic caliber uppers made of unobtainium and chambered in .44 Callahan. I presumed, apparently incorrectly, the AR as being in 5.56 Poodle Shooter and the SKS as being in 7.62 x 39 ComBloc. As close to stock as possible, in other words.
 

·
Gun Toting Boeing Driver
Joined
·
21,493 Posts
He said minimal spare parts.
Not an entire brownells catalog !
;)
Good thing is you don't need many--and after working with and building ARs you usually wind up with all kinds of spare parts.

And like I said another m4 can be a spare parts kit -- and the ar IS unique in that any swaps among anything likely to break can be done pretty quickly.

Much quicker than replacing the firing pin on my SkS and dealing with the block o' steel Russian bolt.

In fact, because I've broken a narrow roll pin punch from time to time I just keep a spare bolt around. Easier to swap the entire bolt out of the BCG rather than replace little parts in it. And I figure with the wear on the bolt and my time for 40 bucks or so it's worth it for something I seldom have to do.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,952 Posts
Discussion Starter · #20 · (Edited)
Another great thing about the SKS. Peter Kokalis top editor of shotgun news trained armies all over in use and servicing of mostly machine guns but rifles also. he has seen wars from steaming jungles to frozen Serbia and said the SKS was the most reliable weapon he ever saw. I'll take his word for it.

the basic premise of this that was brought up on another board, is the SKS or a basic 556 / 223 AR . no fancy Optics other than a decent basic scope or Red Dot, no modular doodads & no interchangeable calibers because we all know that life doesn't begin until 30 caliber, IMO anything smaller than that is for varmints and plinking anyway ;)
 
1 - 20 of 153 Posts
Top