Two weeks at a school.....

Discussion in 'The Powder Keg' started by oneastrix, Sep 9, 2002.

  1. oneastrix

    oneastrix G&G Newbie

    Yesterday a heated debate ensued over the subject of police officers in schools. I became angry. I don't want to refuel the fire so to speak.

    I would like to take a few lines to bring up some things that I have seen in the school that I have been assigned to. It's been interesting to say the least.

    Let me give ya some history as to why I have this current but temporary assignment. I don't think I can continue to eat school lunches much longer (LOL).

    A few of us were assigned here in reaction (as usual, reactive police work, not proactive) to a large gang and narcotic problem. So far, it seems that we have done a good job of quieting this place down. Our schools all have one or more police officer assigned to them beginning at the Jr High/Middle School level. However, sometimes the assigned officer simply has too many irons in the fire at on time to handle everything that comes his way during the course of a day. I have a great respect for campus officers. They are first and foremost an LEO. They also have to be a mentor, counselor, shoulder to cry on, a teacher, a coach, and a friend or foe to the students. That's a lot of different hats to wear in one day. You have to be able to "turn it on, and then turn it off....." So to speak.

    I have noticed good and bad things about this little cross section of the American educational system. This school is still saying the pledge, and let me tell you, they still say "Under God!" I was happy to hear that. I was amazed at the lack of classroom control however. I've only been out of high school ten years, approx. Things have changed. If I had cussed at a teacher, she would have grabbed me by the ear and taken me to the office. The principal would have worn my butt out, and then turned me over to my fotball coach, who would in turn run me into the ground. Then of course, there were my folks waiting at home to ground me until the rapture, and probably wear my tail end out again. I'm a 26 y/o policeman, and my mother still has no problem slapping me upside the head when I say something I shouldn't. My father has no problem reminding me daily that even though he's in his fifties, has plastic joints all over his body, he's still a Ranger (Ret.), and he will fly down here and whip my butt into shape in a heartbeat (Hooah!). Ya know what, i believe him to this day (LOL)!

    The kids in this school don't have that. This is the ghetto. Inner city San Antone at it's best. Most of the parents are in the joint, if the kids even know who their real parents are. The kids have no vision of life beyond the southside.

    One student was causing a lot of trouble the other day. After handling the problem I sat him down and talked to him. He was amazed that I even wanted to know about him in the first place. Once he opened up, I learned that he was going to be a starter for the first time in the football game that night. He badly wanted his dad to be there to see him. However, his father was placed on an ankle monitor the day before and could not leave the house. The kid was broken hearted, and therfore, acting out. Not a justification, but his behavior suddenly had an identifiable cause behind it. I ended up going to the game to watch him. He about fell over backwards when he saw me on the sidelines with my wife, watching him. My wife is a photographer by hobby. She took a roll of pics of him throughout the game. We had them developed, and gave them to him. He couldn't wait for his dad to see them. It would be as close to the game as his father would be able to get. I made a little friend that day (and the best informant I've ever had! LOL). The kid won't forget me for a long time, I'm sure of that.

    When I received this assignment, I rolled my eyes, "Oh Lord, Kindergarden Cop!" I had no idea how rewarding it would be. We have to do our job, be hard as$es, but I've definitely seen another side of police work that I did not know existed. I was amazed to see that the same exact crime that we have on the streets exists in our schools. Domestics, assaults, theft, sexual assault, DWI, weapons charges, dope, you name it. It's here, and I would venture to say that it's not just in the barrio. It infiltrates every cross section of our educational system..........

    Would like to hear Oxford's thoughts on this, and any other educator out there. Thanks for what ya do, it's an often thankless job.
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2002
  2. PAPA G

    PAPA G G&G Evangelist Forum Contributor

    LORD LOVE YA MAN!!! may His Grace look over you and protect you, and any one with a shield.!!! others have issues with cops and their sidearms in school. and if they don't like it, take it up with the school board not the guy assigned to the school. or put the kid in a school that doesn't have problems in the hall way, whether it be private, or another school district.:nod:

  3. jerry

    jerry Since 03-15- 2002 Forum Contributor

    Intersting perspective 1*. I don't think that one needs to be an educator or officer to relate. I can as a parent. I have one in High school next yr & one on the way up. It's healthy to get real time, real world info on what's happening out there before the media gets a hold of it and twist it to suit their needs.
    I hop that young athlete dosen't forget the human compassion shown by you and your wife. Take every opportunity to make a difference. But, remember thay all don't work out. As you probably allready know.
  4. oneastrix

    oneastrix G&G Newbie

    It's really easy to set yourself up for a let down. You're right Jerry. It felt good to make him happy, but that doesn't change the fact that he a violent gang banger in his off time. Maybe it helped tear down some of the barriers that stand between police and the public.

    I didn't mean to limit this to educators. I apologize for that. I can see now that it sounded that way when I typed it.

    I'm going to put my son in private schol for sure. I grew up in an Episcopalian Prep School. I have a daughter back hom in West TX from a first marriage. I have offered to pay for her to go to the same school that I went to (she's in Kindergarden) but the evil ex will have nothing to do with the idea. The school has some pretty good financial aid progams, and I don't mind shelling out to make up for the remainder or the tuition. It's my children's education at stake. Maybe I can convince her down the line. However, when you realize that you are talking to a brick wall, it's time to shut up (LOL)!
  5. PAPA G

    PAPA G G&G Evangelist Forum Contributor

    shame that your ex doesn't think of the welfare of the child. when my girls were in Catholic school there were children of other religions, even Jew attending there. because they we're taught in a no nonsense, yet caring and loving manner, at every staff level, and the kids got a superior education. when it was parent teacher confrence time. there was decorum and respect, when hard times forced us to put the kids in public school there was chaos and mayhem, kids running crazy, parents that did come were snitty because little jonny couldn't read. but i'll bet those parents didn't reinforce the school lessons at home!!! and failure was an option, rather than striving to be better.
  6. oneastrix

    oneastrix G&G Newbie

    I had a student tell me just the other day that he can't pass his classes because of his teachers. It's a total failure to accept responsibility for one's own actions. That really gets my boxers in a wad.........
  7. Doglips

    Doglips Guest

    I did the Aple Core School voleteer program for 6 weeks...trying to recruity me as a Middle school (6,7,8 grade) social studies teacher....after 2 weeks I waled out...thoses kids were the reason child abuse happens....they needed a good old fashioned butt wooping....went to wrok with inmates serving life + and they were better behaved.
  8. BattleRifleG3

    BattleRifleG3 G&G Evangelist

    Kids aren't responsible for child abuse. They're responsible for their actions. Abuse is when parents take things out on the kids that aren't their fault. Besides, when a whole society of kids turns out rotten, you can't ignore the screwed up generation that bore them. I was sort of lucky enough to have parents that were pre baby boom. I also have the church to thank for a good chunk of my upbringing. And people wonder why I was made fun of in school.

    I'm glad to hear that you're making a difference, 1*. Wish I'd seen more like you.
  9. MarkII 22

    MarkII 22 Guest

    Whats your church BattleRifleG3? Mines the Church of Christ.
  10. wes

    wes Guest

    I taught kids self-defense at a Community College,about half were home schooled. The thing I noticed most was the home schoolers were really there to learn and paid attention,the Public schoolers wanted to play games and try to do what "Walker,Texas Ranger" did on TV. But they were all good kids,and I never had a problem with them. Wonder why.
  11. Oxford

    Oxford G&G Evangelist


    Thank God for people like you!

    As I read your initial comments I was thinking how true your statements were. You nailed it square on the head when you said that lots of kids don't have parents who will give them their "time".

    I believe you're absolutely correct in your statement that the boy will always remember you for taking time to talk with him, for watching him play football, and for taking pictures and giving them to him so that he can show them to his family. Sounds simple enough...why don't more parents figure that out? They're "too busy", "got to work", "got other kids who need their time", "don't care", and have endless other excuses.

    As a teacher I learned about the word "empathy" early in my career. Tried to think how I would feel, act, if I was in the student's position. For doing that I was able to relate to students when many other teachers couldn't figure out why I was working so hard trying to help students they openly labeled them as a "troublemaker".

    To this day when I see these students after they've become adults, they still address me as Mr. "Oxford" and tell me how much they appreciated what I taught them. Many have gone on to make successful careers out of something related to the coursework I was trying to teach to them.

    Here's something interesting I learned, too. When I was teaching shop classes (auto mechanics, welding, metalworking, woodworking, electronics) I'd pick the toughest acting and most arrogant kid to act as my shop foreman. It was amazing how that title, along with the responsibilities expected of him, would in almost every case cause him to have a different personality in my class. He was in charge of my end of class activity called "clean-up" time. He'd get the job done better than I could most of the time.

    Enough on my past. Oneastrix, you are to be commended for what you're doing for those students. Thanks for posting your experiences on this forum.

  12. MarkII 22

    MarkII 22 Guest

    Thanks wes I'm home schooled.
  13. oneastrix

    oneastrix G&G Newbie

    It's been an experience, that's for sure. We've fought like heck with some of the students (physically), made a good number of arrests, wanted to bang our heads against the wall, you name it.

    I know for a fact that my "box of tools" has one more tool in it now.

    Given the state of our local inner city schools, I foresee more assignments like this in the future. What the heck, I've been on graveyard (dog watch shift) for almost three years. I'll ride the eight to four Mon-Fri until the wheels fall off!
  14. I still find it disturbing


    I just find it disturbing that a school even needs police present. The thought that a school or school yard is playspace for thugs and predators is very disturbing. What's next, armed guards in the churches? (no Catholic jokes please)

    It is maddening that the schools have lost control, and even more so that when they try and exert control it is the lib PC version.

    You are also right 1*, kids today fly the victim banner high and proud. Nothing is their fault, Mom and Dad owe them and the world owes them a living. Well guess what young grasshoppers, you better keep an eye on us little ants....the winter is coming.

    Thanks again for the thought stirring posts 1*. It is great to see by just talking to kids anyone can reach some of them. You can make a mountain out of sand, but the right way is one grain at a time and it takes a while.
  15. oneastrix

    oneastrix G&G Newbie

    I was going to take the ball and run with the Catholic jokes, but I respect your request! Laugh out loud...Take care!
  16. tommy

    tommy G&G Enthusiast

    well i diagree 100% with you astrix. you say in you'er post that it is you'er job to be a hard ***** well you are so wronge you'er job duty is to protect and to serve the public. to me a hard***** is a bad cop . you talk about this one boy who in one sentence you call him a friend and the other you call him an informant .i looked and asked some people about a cops job and they told me it is to protect and to serve but no one but you say it is too be a hard*****.you talk like you been on the police force for 20 years . but from you'er age you maybe have been a cop for 4 or 5 maybe 6 years at the most. the only people that can say thier job is to be a hard*****. is the miltary . and they have all my respect . but you are an idiot for saying that is was you'er job to be one. or i could have been wronge and miss raed the post so could you please make it a little clearer. for me meaning an idiot to under stand. i just hope that the kid you mentioned in this post never reads what you wrote about him . all this time he thought you was his friend. looks like he was wrong huh!!. like i said give respect and you shall get respect. i had an uncle he was the warden of the detention center down here. he was a good cop .he was always in the paper cause he done something good for the people. he even baked a cake for the inmates at xmas time. and before you get hyped up these were just trafic violators and misdemeanor ofenders . they were not killers. they were just waiting over night or were waiting to go to court. but he treated them fair . and he treated them like people.untill they were convicted of something .and went on to prison. now that is what i call a cop. before he was a cop he was in the army and served in korea and vietnam. and was shot up pretty bad i might say.but with age he also had wisdom. unlike the young cops of today. that think well i got a gun and a badge i'm a harda
    $$.so don't take an idiots word for it go back and reread some of you'er post.
  17. Oxford

    Oxford G&G Evangelist

    schools are a mirror images of our society

    Why is there a need for cops in some schools?

    It's a basic fact that schools are a mirror image of our it or not. Schools have to deal with the same problems that our society faces.

    Sure it would be great to move the clock back 50 years when the majority of students followed the established rules. That isn't realistic now. Parents views have changed, our social values have changed. Movies, television and the internet have opened up new ideas to everyone young and old... some better...some worse.

    All these changes and stresses are reflected back in schools with their inherit problems. They result in the need for cops in some schools, drug dogs in others, security systems that we wouldn't have needed 30 years ago, metal detectors as you enter school doors, security systems screening people leaving the school library, motion detectors installed in classrooms after school hours, and the list goes on and on.

    Let's face it...we're facing a different set of problems than our parents faced. The idea of needing these changes takes a lot of getting used to for most people who haven't spent much time in schools for a while.

    And finally, we all know that change is usually resisted because we're uncomfortable getting out of a rut.

    If your school doesn't fit the scenario above than thank God for your situation. What happens socially on the coasts of America usually moves inland to larger schools and eventually moves on to even the smallest of schools. Don't be shocked or in denial when it hits you in the face.

    Oxford :nod:
  18. tommy

    tommy G&G Enthusiast

    i understand you 100% oxford . and i hope it never comes to my town . but i'm sure it will one day hopefully later than sooner. but it will come. i just get madd when a cop or school oficial tells my kid that his had has bad guns and they are on good. but the cop is sitting there with his in his holster. the cops around here don't treat the kids very well and i can't blame them for that. i called the cops to see if i had to get my handgun registerd and all i got from them was it would be in you'er best interest to do so.i then asked if it was the law and got the same response.i could go on and on about what goes on in my town with the cops but what good will it do.know one wants to hear the bad parts they just want to hear the good a cop does.
  19. Mandy

    Mandy FREE CITIZEN Forum Contributor

    :assult: :assult: :assult: :assult: :assult:


    I perceive that maybe, and I say maybe, you had some kind of trouble with some cop.
    I don't blame you 'cause the other day some idiot cop gave me a speeding ticket for $150.00 and I know that I wasn't speeding because I was in cruise control like 4 or 5 miles below the speed limit.
    I got mad with this cop, I even talked to him in a disrespectful manner and took off with screaming tires.
    I know that this guy did it knowing that I was right and he was wrong, it **** me off more to see that this guy was 22 or 23 years old and he was doing all this with a big smile in his face (like you're the catch of the day and there's nothing you can do about it).
    I have to point out that this was the first time I acted like this, in all my other experiences with pullovers the cop was right and I had done the offense, so I just apologised for the offense and asked them for a chance in a polite manner, if he doesn't agree then I accepted his decision and took my ticket.
    Guys like this give the force a bad reputation, there has allways been guys like this and there allways be guys like this, but I can't take on all the cops and measure them by the same token.
    I mean no offense to you and please correct me if I'm wrong but that's my impression.
    Again, I may be wrong.

    :assult: :assult: :assult: :assult: :assult:
  20. oneastrix

    oneastrix G&G Newbie

    Quick reply to ya Tommy. I think you mistook my words for a different meaning. I was assigned to this school along with other officers. It's a temporary assignment with basic direct orders to "get in there and clean the mess up." It's the result of parents and teachers complaining to the score board about the condition of things here.

    As for the kid that my wife gave the photos to, I really don't see that there was anything derrogatory said about him. If so, please quote me in a post, I need to know because I surely didn't mean it that way. My heart is still bleeding for the poor soul. As for the "informant" comment, well bud, that's his choice. He's giving me dope info by his choice and I would never burn an informant. But it's all by his choice....
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2002