Unissued No1 MK4???

Discussion in 'Enfield Rifles' started by 338RUM, Oct 4, 2010.

  1. 338RUM

    338RUM G&G Evangelist

    Is it possible for there to be an unissued Long Branch No1Mk4? I happened to stop by the gun shop today and seen this rifle sitting in the used rack for 550 and it truly looks unissued, the bore looks like a new barrel and there are NO signs of the rifle being fired, I checked the bolt face with a Loupe 17x and could only see machine marks... this thing is amazing looking... and the stock it barely marred and isn't really that dark, so once again is it possible to have an unissued Enfiled? and is 550 a good price for one?
     
  2. spinecracker

    spinecracker G&G Newbie

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    What date was it made? If the gun shop would let you, you could take off the hand guards and the forend and look at the draws and other areas that are load-bearing. I came across a No.4 Mk.1 a little while ago that looked pristine on the outside, but the draws had been turned to mush - not a good sign.
     

  3. killsnapz

    killsnapz G&G Evangelist

  4. Those rifles hit the market some 20 years ago.
     
  5. Reality check

    possible but not really probable.

    If it looks to good to be true then take warning.

    There are people out there who are good at this type fraud.
     
  6. SNO4MKI

    SNO4MKI G&G Newbie

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    If it is a '49 or '50 dated rifle, there is a possibility; however, if it is '41 - '45 dated, unlikely.
     
  7. 338RUM

    338RUM G&G Evangelist

    It is a post war rifle, which is what has me wondering... I can take it apart if I want as I am good friends with the owner of the shop, but what am I looking for? and how do I know it isn't fake? and is a 550 price tag too much? I know I probably will be snagging the 79 dollar M44 they have on the used rack but only because it is a nice gun!
     
  8. A few years ago at the Gunboards forum a forum member bought a BRAND NEW in the box early model Savage with the round cocking piece still in cosmoline.

    Checks you can preform.

    1. If the headspace is under .067 with a low number bolt head it is likely to be a new or low mileage Enfield rifle.

    2. Put a bore light in the chamber and using a magnifying glass look "inside" the muzzle. A used bore will be frosted to some degree from using corrosive primers.

    A new bore will be smooth as glass and look like slightly dull chrome.

    [​IMG]

    A used frosted bore will look like frosted glass that has been sand blasted.

    [​IMG]

    The 1950 Long Branch I have was unissued and only had very slight storage rack dings in the wooden stock. The bolt was the only place ANY bluing had worn off from rubbing the action. (very light rub marks)

    Other Enfield forum members have been lucky and purchased Enfield rifles that went through FTR or overhaul and were unissued.

    NOTE: When the Enfield rifle was proof pressure tested a oiled high pressure test cartridge was used. The oiled proof round put twice the force (bolt thrust) on the bolt as a normal standard Mk.7 cartridge would. The oiled proof cartridge would "seat" the bolt head to the bolt body and the bolt lugs to the receiver. After the proof cartridge was fired the rifle was checked with a .067 headspace gauge, if the bolt closed on the .067 gauge the rifle failed proof testing due to excessive bolt setback.

    (all my "new" Enfields have less than a .067 headspace setting)

    Below is a "brand new" 1916 Enfield No.1 Mk.3 that went through FTR- overhaul in 1953.
    (the only old and used part was the receiver and it had a brand new BSA barrel.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

     
    Last edited: Oct 5, 2010
  9. Take some close up photos of the Enfield in question and post them here.

    Then email the photos to Brian Dick and ask Brian if he thinks it is the real deal. Brian is the most knowledgeable person in the U.S. I know of on the Enfield rifle and he also has a very close friendship with Peter Laidler the British armourer and Enfield author.

    BDL LTD Rifles and Accessories
     
  10. killsnapz

    killsnapz G&G Evangelist

    I got my No1 MkIII wire wrap from Brian. Great guy to deal with and very knowledgeable.

    Michael
     
  11. 338RUM

    338RUM G&G Evangelist

    ok guys, I will see what is up with this rifle, and see if I can take pics.
     
  12. mack

    mack Guest

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    I bought a new FTR on a No. 4 that was a '44 receiver. New wood, barrel and even a new bolthead. No evidence of firing. This was only two years ago, so there are likely some similar rifles still out there. It just takes patience to find them.

    I have two of the new mummy wraps, a couple of the Jon Jovina rifles from Oz old in the 1990s, an FTR'd Mk III (1953) with beautiful English walnut furniture and even a new, unissued No. 4 from 1944. I thought it was FTR's when I bought it, but it is new throughout. Rough rifle, but new. It is the one Enfield I own that gives you true insight into how desperate the Allies were in WWII to get their equipment into the hands of fighting men.

    Keep looking if this one doesn't suit you. There are lots of collections being broken up right now as Baby Boomers begin dying off and their kids sell off the closet full of firearms Dad had accumulated.
     
  13. NRAJOE

    NRAJOE YOU TALKIN' TO ME!? Forum Contributor

    There are still some unissued still in the wrap examples out there, or just taken out of the wrap...saw 2 last week on Gunbroker.
     
  14. But they are MkIIs - not MkIs or MkI*s.