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Discussion Starter #1
by a company that is a good company?

My impressions of over/unders under $1,000 are pure junk and/or made by companies that don't offer good customer service. I'm really leery about Yildiz.

https://www.academy.com/shop/pdp/yildiz-spz-me-12-12-gauge-over-and-under-shotgun

Want to try something new
I got the gun about a few weeks ago I took it skeet shooting and love it but it kicks like a mule but I love it

☆☆☆☆☆☆☆☆☆☆1 out of 5 stars.

· 9 months ago
Mine has been problematic since day one
I Bought One brand new from my local achademy sports. Gun is beautiful don’t get me wrong but I noticed something right off when assembled. The barrel latch is crooked. You push to break the action but it shows it’s perfectly even when the barrel is shut. Mines definitely not straight. 2nd it has trouble ejecting shells. Most of the time won’t eject both rounds. 3rd which is my biggest problem is if you set the safety to fire top barrel then bottom this gun will fire both barrels at least 4 times out of a box of shells. It’s pretty painful and knocks you back a step lol. Heavy bruising. Gun has done this since day one. Now 250’rounds down the barrel it still does it. But works fine if you make it shoot bottom barrel first. Maybe I just got a defective one? Guess it’s time to bring it back to be sent in for repairs.

☆☆☆☆☆☆☆☆☆☆1 out of 5 stars.

· 2 years ago
Quickly malfunctioned
Based on the other reviews I did not hesitate to buy this gun but now disappointed that I did. Before two boxes of shells were through it stopped cycling barrels. Academy sent it back to Texas to get fixed, but still waiting on it and now wondering if it will have a repeat...

☆☆☆☆☆☆☆☆☆☆1 out of 5 stars.

· 5 years ago
yildiz - low end, low function
Bought the yildiz me 12 gauge o/u, $430 version. Lower barrel wouldn't eject spent shells as expected. Returned for warranty repair. Got it back and problem continued. Returned for replacement.
Received it and then experienced no firing on
2nd barrel when shooting sporting clays.
Returned it as well. Academy Sports stood behind product every step - big thanks!. Yildiz product did not meet expectations! Wrote Yildiz and never heard back. Academy is great: responsive and totally supporting their products. Yildiz was non-responsive. Apparently they, Yildiz, don't believe in their own product.



 

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There's some really nice O/U shotguns coming outa Turkey.

I recall seeing a Winchester 101 with several inches lopped off the barrels for sale here a few years back. Wish I had of bought it, to some it was criminal but hey it's done why not enjoy it?
 

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There's some really nice O/U shotguns coming outa Turkey.

I recall seeing a Winchester 101 with several inches lopped off the barrels for sale here a few years back. Wish I had of bought it, to some it was criminal but hey it's done why not enjoy it?
I know a lot of guys that had really nice shotguns custom made in Incerlik. Very nice quality, if I remember correctly, they weren't a whole lot more than a thousand shipped to an FFL in the states. I have considered it myself.
 
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About $2K depending on what kind of sale you catch and what you want in one.

Weatherby Orion is a a pretty reasonable priced O/U and I thought it was pretty sweet. I only handled it at the shot show but it met every thing I wanted and was looking for the best price.

Until I ran in to a Browning Citori at Rural King for $1500.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
About $2K depending on what kind of sale you catch and what you want in one.

Weatherby Orion is a a pretty reasonable priced O/U and I thought it was pretty sweet. I only handled it at the shot show but it met every thing I wanted and was looking for the best price.

Until I ran in to a Browning Citori at Rural King for $1500.
Basically, a well-made shotgun with two barrels will never be priced for the blue-collar hunter unless he buys second-hand.
 
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Discussion Starter #6 (Edited)
Basically, a well-made shotgun with two barrels will never be priced for the blue-collar hunter unless he buys second-hand.
I think all Japan-made guns are crap. This includes Browning Citori, Browning A-Bolt and Weatherby Vanguard. I knew a man who paid about $1,500 for a new Citori in the mid-1990's. The bluing on the tang summarily wore off from just using the safety/barrel selector switch a few times. The blued steel of the tang was not protected from direct contact with the barrel selector switch and the tang got scratched all to hell in this area in short-order. There were sharp/rough edges around the blued (not even silver) receiver, it was kind of hard to put the gun together and you need a vise to open and close the gun. The man had serious buyer's remorse and dumped the gun not long afterward.

The Japanese are not master gunsmiths by a dam sight as there have been such craftsmen in Europe for centuries. I feel the finest-made sporting long guns in the world still hail from Europe, namely England, Sweden, Finland, Belgium, Germany and Italy.

The Browning Superposed over/under and the Browning BAR was once nothing short of a handmade masterpiece from Belgium.
 

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that gun needs lubed and shot.
I'm still shooting my 1991 made SKB that come from Japan.
when I still shooting I don't mean 1-2 times a year out in the pasture.
I mean about 10-12 thousand shells a year shoot.

right now about the lowest cost O/U your gonna get new is a plain jane Winchester 101 from bass-pro if you watch they are around 1600$ sometimes.
after that your looking at 2-2500$ minimum and jumping up to over 5-K after that.

I wouldn't even look at a O/U that was new under the 2-K price range.
but then again I shoot my shotguns and expect them to go an honest 50-60K before needing any real type of service, and closer to 100-K before needing any major parts repair.

you can change those K numbers to Round-count without the K, numbers for a 500$ gun.
 

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There's some really nice O/U shotguns coming outa Turkey.

I recall seeing a Winchester 101 with several inches lopped off the barrels for sale here a few years back. Wish I had of bought it, to some it was criminal but hey it's done why not enjoy it?
You beat me to it Johnny. I have quite a few American made double barrels. I have a Charles Daly for instance that is like lugging around a boat anchor and thick. Does not feel good in the hands. Also its so tight opening that you have to use two hands. My others will drop open once I take my thumb to the lever.
My favorite one is I double O/U 410 I bought. I came across a gun shop in my travels a few years back and he had a selection of Turkish doubles in different gauges and Grades. They fit my hands which are large so perfect and light. Its very well made and smooth. I have not seen such a polished deep mirror bluing in years. Also the stock is black walnut and unbelievably beautiful. I may get another. This double only cost me about $600
 

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My O/U Berretta 20 ga is a very light fast handling "Scatter gun". It is marked 12 Caliber not gauge. It has a straight butt stock and very small sling attachments.
A fellow visited the Berretta plant in Italy in 1956. He bought the gun over there. It was not made for export.:)
 

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Basically, a well-made shotgun with two barrels will never be priced for the blue-collar hunter unless he buys second-hand.
That just depends on how bad blue-collar hunter wants one. Field grade guns are a lot less expensive than about any of the game guns and are satisfactory for skeet or sporting clays.
 
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Basically, a well-made shotgun with two barrels will never be priced for the blue-collar hunter unless he buys second-hand.
Sorry. I mistook your OP to be from someone seeking an entry level shotgun.

I'll read closer next time. Thank you.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
About the name of Browning's Superposed shotguns.

It meant "over/under" in other words as opposed to side-by-side. It basically introduced the average American wingshooter to then-affordable over/under shotguns in the 1920's. To "superpose" means to stack things (such as shotgun barrels) vertically, one over the other. The word comes from Latin. Before the advent of John M. Browning's Superposed, over/unders had been rare, expensive and exclusive from Europe.

Nowadays, excellent surviving Browning Belgian-made Superposed shotguns can be had for new-car prices or even more.
 

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Why are you quoting reviews on a shotgun with a MSRP of $429 when talking about high quality two barrel guns? The Yildiz by and large get great reviews by entry level people who have used them for a while. Any gun new in the box may have something that was missed at the factory, and folks will go online and rant. Few bother to put good reviews on line, so what?

Many people cannot shoot vertically mounted barrel guns. So they complain about the problems with accuracy or that it does not point well or is not good for follow-through.

The usual problem is because they have long necks, which means they have to lean forward to align the sight picture, or to raise the stock in some fashion. That in turn affects the cant, which means they are much better off with a semi auto or pump. A side by side may have the same problem but not as bad, just depends on the design. Before one looks too far into quality of such a design, perhaps a borrowed gun will answer that question.

At the point where the design fits the shooter then the intended use comes into play. If the goal is to start into the shotgun shooting sports, the little Yildiz is a great starter tool. They are lightweight, hold up very well, and offer a single trigger and ejectors. The design in 12 gauge was tested to 25,000 rounds before offered to the public.

Then like any gun off the assembly line, it is appropriate for the first user to polish the heck out of the chambers then fire a few hundred rounds of el cheapo ammo to loosen up the action and moving parts. Only then do you know if the gun will work well for you and function properly.

All Japanese guns are poorly made. Really? I do not own a browning bolt gun, but in the A bolt I have seen four owned by buddies, all four, 2 in 30-06, one in 25-06, and one in 7mm Mag would shoot well under 1 inch. I own three myself, a Weatherby Mark V Deluxe, 300 WBY made in Japan. it has the finest finish, beautiful wood, and shoots under 1 inch. I own a Vanguard in 257, it too shoots under 1 inch and has taken animals out to 400 plus yards. I have the similar Howa bolt gun in 223, and it too shoots under one inch. They are about 30, 20 and 10 years old and never a problem. Not sure if you have actually owned guns made in Japan or if you just heard that down at the mall.

A fine shotgun is a wonderful tool, especially the 2 barrel guns. I do not use the over and under because I have the dreaded long neck, but own several side by sides which I do shoot well. I am not sure the point of your thread. Even the cheap shotguns, Yildiz, Savage, Condor and other imports all serve a purpose and serve it well in the field or in shotgun games. If you want a $10,000 gun to look at it, then by all means pull that money out of the 401K and buy one to admire.

Just my 2 cents.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Why are you quoting reviews on a shotgun with a MSRP of $429 when talking about high quality two barrel guns? The Yildiz by and large get great reviews by entry level people who have used them for a while. Any gun new in the box may have something that was missed at the factory, and folks will go online and rant. Few bother to put good reviews on line, so what?

Many people cannot shoot vertically mounted barrel guns. So they complain about the problems with accuracy or that it does not point well or is not good for follow-through.

The usual problem is because they have long necks, which means they have to lean forward to align the sight picture, or to raise the stock in some fashion. That in turn affects the cant, which means they are much better off with a semi auto or pump. A side by side may have the same problem but not as bad, just depends on the design. Before one looks too far into quality of such a design, perhaps a borrowed gun will answer that question.

At the point where the design fits the shooter then the intended use comes into play. If the goal is to start into the shotgun shooting sports, the little Yildiz is a great starter tool. They are lightweight, hold up very well, and offer a single trigger and ejectors. The design in 12 gauge was tested to 25,000 rounds before offered to the public.

Then like any gun off the assembly line, it is appropriate for the first user to polish the heck out of the chambers then fire a few hundred rounds of el cheapo ammo to loosen up the action and moving parts. Only then do you know if the gun will work well for you and function properly.

All Japanese guns are poorly made. Really? I do not own a browning bolt gun, but in the A bolt I have seen four owned by buddies, all four, 2 in 30-06, one in 25-06, and one in 7mm Mag would shoot well under 1 inch. I own three myself, a Weatherby Mark V Deluxe, 300 WBY made in Japan. it has the finest finish, beautiful wood, and shoots under 1 inch. I own a Vanguard in 257, it too shoots under 1 inch and has taken animals out to 400 plus yards. I have the similar Howa bolt gun in 223, and it too shoots under one inch. They are about 30, 20 and 10 years old and never a problem. Not sure if you have actually owned guns made in Japan or if you just heard that down at the mall.

A fine shotgun is a wonderful tool, especially the 2 barrel guns. I do not use the over and under because I have the dreaded long neck, but own several side by sides which I do shoot well. I am not sure the point of your thread. Even the cheap shotguns, Yildiz, Savage, Condor and other imports all serve a purpose and serve it well in the field or in shotgun games. If you want a $10,000 gun to look at it, then by all means pull that money out of the 401K and buy one to admire.

Just my 2 cents.
Well, I'm not too crazy about the cosmetics of every Jap gun I've seen though they might actually shoot well. I like Jap vehicles, though, and that's why I drive a Toyota.
 

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I own what you would call a "Junk" Browning A bolt II, and a Japanese made Citori 625 Sporting with THOUSANDS or rounds through it each year. The actions are still tight, they are accurate, and they go BANG every time I pull the trigger. I keep my guns clean, lubed and used, and haven't had any of the problems that you've quoted from other people.

I don't just admire them in the gun cabinet, they see use on a regular basis. I wouldn't be afraid to put either one up against any European built gun that you brought to the table.

I also have a couple of Belgium made Brownings in my safe, and they aren't perfect and never were. They both function flawlessly, but aren't safe queens either.

You talk about entry level but want some high end product. You could go get a Perazzi, Zoli, Kreighoff, or Belgium Browning and pay $20K or more, but can still have issues. I've been shooting sporting clays for a while, and have seen nearly every brand have some type of problem, regardless of where it was made or how much it cost.

Go to the gun shop pick up one for yourself before you start quoting every negative review you find on the web.

If you want a field grade gun, then go to the high volume dealer and get it. Make sure that it fits you when you pick it up. A gun that doesn't fit you will "kick like a mule". Just don't expect the same fit and finish of something that is high end. That's like buying a VW bug and expecting a Porsche 911 turbo.

If you want high end, go to a gun shop that specializes in over/unders, spend more money, and get fitted for a gun.

I picked up several dozen guns ranging from $1K up to $10K before settling on my "JUNK" $3500 Japanese Citori. I went into it thinking that I wanted a Beretta or Ceasar Guerini O/U, but the Citori fit me, it fit my budget, and I'm very satisfied with it.

I personally would never just go and buy the cheapest O/U that I could find. I saved my money for a while, did my own research by talking to guys shooting every weekend, picked up and tried several brands, then made a purchase.

I'm picky, but also have realistic expectations for the amount of money spent.
 

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QUOTE="d_p_holland, post: 2637348, member: 68594"]Well, I'm not too crazy about the cosmetics of every Jap gun I've seen though they might actually shoot well. I like Jap vehicles, though, and that's why I drive a Toyota.[/QUOTE]


The wood stocked Howa guns from Japan I have seen the last few years have had wonderful premium level stocks. I saw some in Walmart a couple years ago, called something like premium grade with a tiger striped wood. The stocks themselves looked like $2,500 wood from the finest makers. The guns were about $650, looked really like a $2,500 stock on a $500 gun. I almost bought a couple just for the stocks. They actually looked better than 99% of the top guns you would find in the Cabelas Gun Room. Problem is I have a dozen or so nice bolt guns just gathering dust so I had to pass.
 

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I own a few trap guns, Remingtons 1148 and an 1100. I consider those pretty well made guns. I've shot a lot of clays with those as well as beavers, possum, and *****. Oh yeah quail, chukar, and pheasant. I've also spent hours cleaning those things and watching the O/U guys clean their in just a few minutes.

Cleaning, cleaning cleaning and more cleaning, it took to lead me down the O/U path and now it's all I want to shoot. Gone is the thought every time I pull the trigger "Now I've got to spend an hour cleaning this thing."

Now I've got a Winchester 101, the Browning a cross over gun for sporting clays, field, skeet and I shoot a little trap with it, and the most FUN an HR Topper trap gun. Broke my FIRST 25 straight with that topper.
 
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