Winchester markings on top ?

Discussion in 'Antique Firearms' started by Kaye adams, Jul 31, 2020.

  1. Kaye adams

    Kaye adams G&G Enthusiast

    There is an oval with a P and W what does it mean any winchester fans happen to know?
     

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  2. chesterwin

    chesterwin G&G Evangelist

    I believe those are the early Winchester "Proof" markings found on their earlier rifles. It means they were fired at the factory with stronger than recommended loads to prove they were safe.

    The fact that it's on the receiver and barrel is a strong indicator that that's the original barrel and has never been replaced. (A good thing.)
     
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  3. Dutch

    Dutch G&G Evangelist

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    I agree that those are the Winchester proof marks.
     
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  4. CopperniX

    CopperniX G&G Hall Monitor Staff Member

    After doing a little research on it I have come up with some interesting info.
    They started stamping just the barrels in 1905 and sometime between 1905 and 1908 both the barrel and receiver were stamped after being proof tested.

    Info came from the Winchester Collector forum.
    For firearms made prior to 1905 (or the time standardized application of the “WP” proof on barrels/receivers first appears):

    • Barrels affixed to receivers have the “Oval P” proof if the barrel was made prior to 1905 and destined for fitting by someone other than Winchester (mail order).
    • Firearms having no “WP” proof on the receiver but have affixed barrels with “WP” proof mark, in addition to the “Oval P” would signify that while it is an older receiver, the barrel was replaced after 1905 by someone outside the Winchester repair shop. (in addition to verification by other barrel markings)
    • Firearms made prior to 1905 that have the “WP” proof mark stamped on the receiver and barrel signifies the Winchester repair shop performed work to the barrel, receiver, or other internal part.
    • Are there any examples of firearms made prior to 1905 that have the “WP” on the receiver and barrel in addition to the “Oval P” on the barrel? If so, this would signify a mail order barrel being installed by the Winchester repair shop.
    • Barrels having the “WP” proof mark but no “Oval P” would indicate a potential non-mail order barrel swapped outside the Winchester repair shop.

    For barrels & receivers made after 1905:

    • Receivers having the “WP” proof but no “WP” or “Oval P” proof on the barrel would indicate the barrel was replaced outside of Winchester using a pre-1905 barrel.
    • Receivers without the “WP” proof but have barrels with the “WP” proof fall into that period from 1905-1908 where the barrel may have the “WP” proof but the receiver will not.
    • Receivers made after 1905 having no “WP” proof but have barrels with the “WP” and “Oval P” mark would indicate a mail order barrel.
    • Firearms having the “WP” proof on the receiver but not on the barrel, the barrel having only the “Oval P” would indicate an older stock mail order barrel. If the “WP” proof was an indicator of Winchesters subjection of the barrel or receiver to proved testing, why wouldn’t the “WP” appear along with the “Oval P”?
    • Receivers and barrels having the “WP” in addition to the “Oval P” on the barrel would indicate a mail order barrel fitted outside the Winchester repair shop.
    • Are there examples having the “WP” on receiver and barrel in addition to the Oval P on the barrel that have an R&R note? If so, do they occur pre-1905 or post-1905 or both?
     
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  5. chesterwin

    chesterwin G&G Evangelist

    Where does that mention both the barrel and receiver with the Oval WP?
     
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  6. chesterwin

    chesterwin G&G Evangelist

    Kaye. Can you provide the serial number of the rifle? Substitute xx for the last 2 numbers for security. I want to check the year it was made.
     
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  7. Kaye adams

    Kaye adams G&G Enthusiast

    Hi on the us 1873 springfield that i think can be a trap door rifle the only 4 numbers are 8558 here are some photos of marking I see..thank you for your help..kaye
     

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  8. Kaye adams

    Kaye adams G&G Enthusiast

    The serial# is 256xx august 21 189 . It says nickel especially for smokeless powder 25-35 wcf thanks for the help kaye
     
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  9. Kaye adams

    Kaye adams G&G Enthusiast

    1894
     
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  10. Kaye adams

    Kaye adams G&G Enthusiast

     
  11. Kaye adams

    Kaye adams G&G Enthusiast

    Thank you grat info so helpful.
     
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  12. chesterwin

    chesterwin G&G Evangelist

    That serial number indicates you have a second year production gun. It was built in 1895 according to the Blue Book serialization guide.

    Whatever you do, don't let anyone talk you into refininshing it!!!
     
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  13. Kaye adams

    Kaye adams G&G Enthusiast

    Oh I wont .and thankyou he liked his guns original and I'm going to keep them that way.
    ..
     
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